Senedd Cymru (Welsh Parliament), 22 September 2026

275 contributions from 62 members. The official report.

1. Questions to the First Minister

Huw Irranca-Davies (Labour, Afan Ogwr Rhondda)

Good afternoon, all. Let's make a start. We will begin with questions to the First Minister. The first question this afternoon is from Andrew R.T. Davies.

Andrew RT Davies (Conservative, Pen-y-bont Bro Morgannwg)

1. Will the First Minister provide an update on the Welsh Government's position on the Global Centre of Rail Excellence? OQ64526

Rhun ap Iorwerth (Plaid Cymru, Bangor Conwy Môn)

The question does indeed come at an opportune time. A review has been commissioned, looking at how to deliver the best outcome at the Nant Helen site. We are keen now to develop a clear direction of travel with GCRE Ltd.

Andrew RT Davies (Conservative, Pen-y-bont Bro Morgannwg)

Thank you for that update, First Minister. The Economy, Trade and Rural Affairs Committee in the last session visited the site and looked into the proposals that were presented to us. When this concept was first thought through, there was the potential for 1,000 jobs coming to the site, and the Government of the day was told that there was huge demand for this testing facility. Regrettably, to date, not £1 of private money has gone into it. It is a huge site. I saw a media report saying it's the size of Gibraltar. There's a lot of remediation work to go into it. The one thing we were told as a committee was that the incoming Government, whoever that Government would be, needed to make a quick decision about future investment. The site has burned through £70 million of public money to date. When will you be in the position to formulate what the Government is going to do, bearing in mind £70 million of public money has already gone in and £350 to £400 million is required to build this Global Centre of Rail Excellence?

Rhun ap Iorwerth (Plaid Cymru, Bangor Conwy Môn)

Llywydd, the Member makes very important points. Significant amounts of public funding have gone into the site already. I'm not going to criticise the concept that came from the current leader of the Labour Party, but we have to understand what has happened as those tens of millions of pounds have been spent on the site, and what maybe hasn't happened to enable us to be at a place where there is private funding willing and able and keen to come in. As I say, my Minister has commissioned that work now because I agree that we need to come to a decision soon in order to make the most of the opportunities for what is still a very important site.

Steven Rodaway (Reform UK, Gŵyr Abertawe)

First Minister, it's good to hear that you are commissioning a review, but this Chamber would like to understand that the confidence of your Government in this site must rest on a credible commercial case, which the public actually needs to understand. The additional proposed data centre and energy park may promise local jobs, but these benefits cannot justify an indefinite dependence on taxpayer-funded grants. After more than four months in office, your Government should be able to demonstrate how and when the development will attract private capital and generate a sufficient income to support itself. How will you make any further development conditional on a financially self-supporting business plan that delivers measurable local benefits without further taxpayer-funded grants to GCRE or participating companies? Thank you.

Rhun ap Iorwerth (Plaid Cymru, Bangor Conwy Môn)

Again, perfectly appropriate questions to ask. It is not just about making it a credible commercial proposition, it's making sure that the public money that has gone into it has been put to good use, and, as we consider the future, that we look at that balance of where Government works potentially with the private sector on what could be a whole host of different propositions. As I say, the fact that we understand the need to move quickly on this is why that review has been commissioned. Whatever the project, you cannot continue to move forward in an aimless way. This started from a point where there was a real belief in a particular project. Time has moved on. We need to make sure that, in 2026, we understand what the best project is now for that site.

Rebeca Phillips (Plaid Cymru, Brycheiniog Tawe Nedd)

The Global Centre of Rail Excellence is seen as a promising development for many across my constituency, showing the potential of green travel, a path towards net zero, and supporting the development of stronger, greener and more affordable transport systems right across the world. What other opportunities are there alongside this project that will help people in my constituency? Diolch.

Rhun ap Iorwerth (Plaid Cymru, Bangor Conwy Môn)

The Member again points to that original concept around rail. A lot has happened in rail since those times, not least the changes in direction around HS2 and so on. We need to understand where we are now, rather than where we were. We need to understand the significance of decisions that have been made to date. The Member will want to ensure that what we achieve there is something that is of value to the locality, to the constituency that she and others represent, and to the Welsh economy. And those are the principles that will be guiding my Cabinet Minister for enterprise as he now works with the review and looks forward to seeing the results of that review pretty soon.

Huw Thomas (Labour, Caerdydd Penarth)

I also had an opportunity earlier this year to visit this site and to see the great potential that exists there not only for a centre of innovation in rail, but also as a place where you could have things such as data centres, which will help to unlock the broader project.

Huw Thomas (Labour, Caerdydd Penarth)

Welsh Labour invested £2 billion in the Heads of the Valleys road precisely for a reason like this, to connect communities, including along the M4 corridor but also in the old Valleys communities, with projects like this. If we are serious about bringing well-paid jobs and re-industrialising the former coalfields, this is exactly the kind of investment that Wales should secure, recognising that this will take public money as well as private money. So, I've heard a bit of equivocation from you today, which will raise concerns for people wanting to see a rail solution brought forward. We want to see more trains brought forward into Wales, and this would help unlock that. Can you give a reason why your Government would not support the GCRE project specifically? And if you can't give a reason, will you perhaps today commit to supporting it? Diolch yn fawr.

Rhun ap Iorwerth (Plaid Cymru, Bangor Conwy Môn)

I think that I've been as open as I can be about the choice that we have to make as a Government now. And that choice is to assess what the best use is for, yes, public money but also the best way of attracting private investment in. And the problem with the railway plan as it is is that it has failed. It has failed to attract private investment and that's why we're in the situation that we're in today. The Member is correct, Llywydd, to say that what is needed is to consider the potential of the site. I could compare this with the Anglesey Aluminium site. When the work there came to an end, what we had there was a site. And what needs to be done in that kind of situation is to think, 'Right, what's the best use for this site?', and not being too tied to one possible element. And, of course, the railway option is still on the table, but what we are going to do is to look at where we are now and to make the best decisions for the people of that area and the future of Wales's economy.

Paul Davies (Conservative, Ceredigion Penfro)

2. What are the Welsh Government's healthcare priorities for Ceredigion Penfro for the next twelve months? OQ64479

Rhun ap Iorwerth (Plaid Cymru, Bangor Conwy Môn)

Improving health outcomes, ensuring timely access to care, supporting sustainable NHS services for communities across Ceredigion Penfro are clearly major priorities for this new Government. As part of our vision to strengthen healthcare in rural and coastal areas in particular, we will engage closely with the local health board and partners to ensure high-quality, patient-centred services that genuinely do meet the needs of local people. We want to make sure they're delivered now and into the future.

Paul Davies (Conservative, Ceredigion Penfro)

First Minister, I believe that the Welsh Government's healthcare priorities for Ceredigion Penfro must be to protect essential health services at its hospitals so that patients do not have to travel further afield for treatment. Now, over the years, my constituents have seen health services centralised and moved further away by the local health board, despite clear public opposition to these changes. And there has been little, if any, intervention or challenge from a Welsh Government over the last 27 years. Now, following the change of Government in May, there was a sense of hope for my constituents that their views would be heard and the health board stopped, and, so far, that has not been the case. So, First Minister, what threshold must be crossed before the Welsh Government is prepared to intervene and prevent Hywel Dda University Health Board from further downgrading services in west Wales? And what message do you have for the people of Ceredigion Penfro who voted for a Government they believed would stand up for local communities and ensure that no further services are removed from their hospitals?

Rhun ap Iorwerth (Plaid Cymru, Bangor Conwy Môn)

Llywydd, the Member is absolutely right that we want to protect essential services, and most of us at one time or another have been involved in various campaigns around particular services in different places. I think the principles that we need to bear in mind always are that we provide timely services in the appropriate location. There will be different stories in different parts of Wales, but those are the principles that tie us together.

Decisions on clinical services are taken by the health boards themselves. I know that the health board in this particular instance has looked at eight out of nine of the services that it provides and consulted on them, and put in place changes that it believes would provide better services to be delivered over the best part of a decade. These aren't overnight changes. And it's important to remember that these are changes that can take time. But my appeal always is for health boards, when they make those changes, when they consult, and afterwards, to ensure that people feel that they are engaged properly on those decisions. But there will be, clearly, different applications of different services in different parts of Wales. It's about getting that balance of appropriate services that will always put the patient first.

Paul Marr (Reform UK, Ceredigion Penfro)

Thank you to Paul Davies for the question. First Minister, 35 per cent of Ceredigion households and 23 per cent in Pembrokeshire rely on oil heating, among the highest rates in Wales. Public Health Wales warns that cold homes increase cardiovascular and respiratory risks, particular for older and vulnerable people. As your Government moves towards net zero, how will you ensure that rural households are not forced to ration heating because of the cost of that transition, and will you guarantee that keeping people warm and healthy comes before hitting arbitrary deadlines? Diolch.

Rhun ap Iorwerth (Plaid Cymru, Bangor Conwy Môn)

I will accept that there is a healthcare link there, Llywydd, and I'm being very, very generous. We know that a healthy home, a healthy environment, is important for people's health, so the Member is absolutely right in that respect.

On oil heating in particular, of course, these are measures that are reserved. We have consistently appealed to the UK Government to make the right decisions when it comes to the options that it has at its disposal, but that we haven't as a Welsh Government, to relieve the pressure on households in rural Wales in particular that are particularly dependent on off-grid oil. It is a principle that ties this Government together, that we think cross-departmentally, and the Member is right: we need to think housing, we need to think energy, we need to think health when it comes to the well-being of the people that we represent.

Anna Nicholl (Plaid Cymru, Ceredigion Penfro)

First Minister, I'd like to agree that protecting services at Bronglais and Withybush hospitals remains vital for communities across Ceredigion Penfro. However, in rural areas, we also need innovative ways of bringing healthcare closer to people's homes. Integrated care centres in Cardigan and Aberaeron show what can be achieved when we bring services together, and, again, bring them closer to people, taking the pressure off hospitals. Having recently visited GP services in Fishguard, I know that there is strong local support for a similar approach there. Indeed, my colleague Elin Jones has previously worked with local councillors to make the case for an integrated care centre for Fishguard. So, will the Welsh Government commit to working with Hywel Dda University Health Board and local communities to explore how towns such as Fishguard could benefit from integrated care facilities, ensuring rural communities are not left behind as healthcare services evolve?

Rhun ap Iorwerth (Plaid Cymru, Bangor Conwy Môn)

Many of us represent rural areas here, and the health of somebody in a rural part of Wales is as important as somebody in an urban part of Wales. We need to make sure that we have equitable healthcare, but it does mean that a different approach is needed. I'm really interested in the work that is developing—already has begun—into creating a centre of excellence on the delivery of rural healthcare in Bronglais Hospital, which could benefit all parts of Wales, not just Ceredigion Penfro.

The programme for government commitment is clear. We want to ensure that integrated care is delivered closer to home, with prevention in particular at its core, to support earlier diagnosis, reduce admissions and delays in discharge. We have many ideas on how, in general, the delivery can be improved in rural areas, but health officials, I know, are engaging with the health board and Pembrokeshire County Council specifically on the development of that integrated centre in Fishguard.

Huw Irranca-Davies (Labour, Afan Ogwr Rhondda)

I now call on the party leaders to question the First Minister. First, the leader of Reform UK, Helen Jenner.

Helen Jenner (Reform UK, Bangor Conwy Môn)

Diolch, Lywydd. First Minister, you so often stand on your soapbox and arrogantly claim that you and your party are the ones fighting injustice and standing up for Wales. Yet, you and your party had the chance last week to tackle rape gangs and to stand up for Wales by backing our Reform motion to help bring closure for women and girls by uncovering the extent of rape gang activity in Wales. But, instead, you voted, shamefully, against it. How on earth can women and girls expect you to have their best interests and safety at heart?

Rhun ap Iorwerth (Plaid Cymru, Bangor Conwy Môn)

Let me take this opportunity to congratulate the new leader of Reform in Wales on her election to the role. She is certainly a bold politician. Anybody who says she came into politics because she was impressed by the principles of Nigel Farage certainly has to be seen as bold.

There is nothing that is more important to any of us, hopefully, than safeguarding people that we have a duty of care for. That is why my Government at this moment is working on strengthening safeguarding and how it protects vulnerable people, including women and girls, potentially trafficked people, in all parts of Wales. That is something my Government is actively getting on with.

Helen Jenner (Reform UK, Bangor Conwy Môn)

You had the opportunity for a Wales focus there. Ironically, normally, we like to stand out, don't we, from the rest of the United Kingdom, but, in this case, you are happy to be absorbed into the UK inquiry. First Minister, the evidence suggests that rape gang activity may have been covered up by authorities to avoid racial tensions, and if we don't get to the bottom of what is among the most sickening organised criminal activities of our time, we cannot expect to prevent the risk of many more crimes of this nature. Last year, the Welsh Government said there was no current widespread issue with grooming gangs in Wales, and one of your current Ministers was accused by a grooming gang victim of downplaying her experience. Let's just have a look at the last 11 weeks alone: we've had two men imprisoned in Cardiff, five people convicted in Rhyl, and eight men across south Wales charged as part of Operation Oak, all relating to grooming gang-type activity. First Minister, can you really look me in the eye and say that you didn't let down victims last week by voting against wanting a grooming gang investigation in Wales?

Rhun ap Iorwerth (Plaid Cymru, Bangor Conwy Môn)

I can look you in the eye every single day of the week and tell you that we have a Government that isn't interested in scoring political points about what is a very, very sensitive issue, and is interested in getting on with finding solutions. Now, we said that we needed to understand the scale of the problem in Wales. Work was done to understand the scale of the problem in Wales, and it is apparent, obviously, that we have issues here that we need to get to grips with in order to safeguard people, which is why my Government is giving all support to the inquiry that is currently looking at the lessons that can be learnt. She may want to make this a constitutional issue; I make this about the safety of people in Wales, and that is the difference between her and me.

Helen Jenner (Reform UK, Bangor Conwy Môn)

First Minister, making sure victims' voices are heard—that is not political point scoring.

Speaking of uncovering the truth, First Minister, I've got a couple of quotes to read to you today:

'Reform would look at the nation of sanctuary and say Welsh people come first when prioritising council housing, and that is really, really important to me.'

Let me read you my second quote:

'Millions are being wasted on the tree-planting project, which is absolutely incredible, that we are sending money in Wales to Uganda.'

First Minister, these were things said by a Senedd Member that now sits on your benches. Do you agree with these comments, 'yes' or 'no'?

Rhun ap Iorwerth (Plaid Cymru, Bangor Conwy Môn)

What I admire is that somebody would have the bravery to stand up to this Reform group in the Senedd and say, 'I now can see you for what you are.' That is precisely what Sarah Cooper-Lesadd did last week. I firmly believe that, in politics, it is up to all of us to show that we are able to change, that we are able to see the light, politically, if you like, and so many other people are doing the same. We have now a scandal-ridden Reform party that is collapsing in chaos around the new Reform leader in Wales. The Member said yesterday that she is all for unity and continuity, but her party is incapable of showing either. Perhaps she can tell us how much of the £72 million arising from the latest Reform scandal she hopes will come to Wales. Maybe she hopes it will be Barnettised.

Helen Jenner (Reform UK, Bangor Conwy Môn)

'Yes' or 'no'? Okay. Diolch yn fawr.

Ken Skates (Labour, Fflint Wrecsam)

First Minister, today we remember the deaths of hundreds of people in the Gresford mining disaster. It was a horrific disaster that devastated the community, and I'm sure you, First Minister, will also remember those who died. More than 260 bodies were recovered, but 253 remain entombed. Unfortunately, it wasn't just men that died; boys died in that disaster as well. It clearly was one of Wales's darkest days.

Research by Wrexham.com shows that, whilst the Plaid Government was questioning the need and rationale for an extra £100 million to be spent on additional learning needs, it was at the very same time asking councils how much more they'd be spending on additional learning needs this year. Now, the data was published just before the supplementary budget vote on your own website. And that figure, in total, for all councils and all schools in Wales was an extra £96.3 million—almost exactly the £100 million that Welsh Labour was saying was required to stabilise the system across Wales, and for which you received a major UK Labour Government windfall. Now, does this revelation, uncovered as I say by Wrexham.com, demonstrate that disadvantaged children risk coming second to this Plaid Cymru Government, behind free childcare for millionaires?

Rhun ap Iorwerth (Plaid Cymru, Bangor Conwy Môn)

Let me, firstly, associate myself very much with the comments as we remember the Gresford disaster, and we send our thoughts to the community, for whom the pain of that day is still felt in many ways.

On additional learning needs, I remind the Labour leader that he was intending to spend £9 million, had they won the election. My party's manifesto made it a pledge to put ALN on a sustainable footing. We had a discussion, running up to the supplementary budget, where we were putting £100 million plus on the table, including £40 million for this year—for this year—which is what we gauged, working with officials and others, could actually be spent to take the pressure. That money is still on the table, and I appeal to the Member again: help us to get it out of the door to help those families and the schools and local authorities who need that money spent.

Ken Skates (Labour, Fflint Wrecsam)

First Minister, the £9 million that you refer to was before the UK Government budget. Once the UK Government budget had taken place and confirmation that more than £300 million was made available, the then education Minister, Lynne Neagle, was planning to spend an extra £100 million on additional learning needs, had we been re-elected.

Now, I can provide clear, irrefutable evidence of how disadvantaged and disabled children will pay the price for your uncosted pledges. Clwb Cwtsh, which is the only provider of school holiday play for children with complex needs in north Wales, has just been told by the Plaid Government that funding for its services will end. The previous Labour Government here funded that provision, which is, as I say, for children with complex needs. I'm afraid, unless your Government makes a u-turn on this, changes its mind and provides the funding to Clwb Cwtsh, it will be lost. So, can I urge you to reconsider the decision to end funding for this provision? Otherwise, I'm afraid disabled children will be paying the price for free childcare for millionaires.

Rhun ap Iorwerth (Plaid Cymru, Bangor Conwy Môn)

I ask the Member to look again at when they were promising £9 million, and it was very much after that money was made available. And there are principles here about the ability for us to set directions here in Wales. I am familiar with Clwb Cwtsh. I don't know why the previous Labour administration didn't put its funding on a permanent basis. The Member might be able to shed some light on that. I do understand also that it fills an ALN gap. The Member is asking for £30,000 for that; I have £40 million on the table that I have sought, and continue to seek, agreement with the Member on. That money includes money that would directly go to Flintshire council, so I'm imagining that the leader of Flintshire council would be keen for the Labour leader here to help us get that money out of the door.

Huw Irranca-Davies (Labour, Afan Ogwr Rhondda)

The leader of the Welsh Conservatives, Darren Millar.

Darren Millar (Conservative, Clwyd)

Diolch, Llywydd. First Minister, last week, the UK Government published the inflation figures. They showed that inflation was up, with prices rising by 3.1 per cent in the year to August, and of course economists forecast that that increase in inflation will continue to rise to above 4 per cent around the end of this year, in the coming months. And that's going to be as a result of the energy price cap going up, the increase in fuel prices eventually coming through. Now, many households in Wales are facing the pinch in their pockets, and they desperately need help. One thing that your Government could do to help people here in Wales is to take action on council tax. Can I ask you, First Minister, instead of making yet more demands for more power, why don't you help people with their council tax demands? Why don't you initiate a cap on council tax and legislate, with the powers that you already have, so that people require a referendum in order to give local residents a say for any increase above that cap?

Rhun ap Iorwerth (Plaid Cymru, Bangor Conwy Môn)

I understand that the leader of the Conservatives wants to replicate policy in England. I'm interested in what works for Wales and it's about what works for council tax payers, Llywydd, and it's what works within the bounds of the finances of Welsh Government. And I remind the Senedd that we will be facing a real-terms cut in the day-to-day spending that we have available in the next financial year.

Council tax is set, of course, by local authorities and it's important that it is. I would remind the Member that, in a recent budget deal before we came into power, we made sure that there was a baseline for an increase in funding for councils, and a big part of that was to protect council tax payers, which I agree is something that's very, very important indeed.

Darren Millar (Conservative, Clwyd)

You know, I was listening to the radio this morning and I heard one of the commentators talking about it being a bad week for NATS; I thought they were talking about the Welsh nats, but actually, they were talking about the National Air Traffic Services, as it happens, and the chaos at our airports. [Laughter.]

One of the things that I want to see is fairness for council tax payers in Wales. You often talk about the need for fair funding between the England and Wales settlement—I get that, I completely get that and we support you on fair funding—but we need fair funding in Wales and we need fairness in council tax bills for people who have to struggle to pay them each and every year. The average band D council tax bill in Wales has risen by more than £600 over the past five years, and some residents have faced hikes of over 50 per cent over that period. It's totally unacceptable. We need urgent action to protect people from the sorts of excessive rises that some people have been having. So, can I urge you again: introduce a cap, legislate so that people have to have referendums for anything above that cap and do one more thing too—let's have a review, an independent review, truly independent of the local government funding formula, to make sure that there's fair funding to all parts of Wales, not just places favoured by the previous Labour Government.

Rhun ap Iorwerth (Plaid Cymru, Bangor Conwy Môn)

Let's be positive and concentrate on the things that we agree on. Absolutely, we want to review, and looking at my local government Cabinet Minister, that is something that is happening under this Government, because it's important that people understand and feel that the decisions taken by Wales are equitable.

The other element that I agree with him on is that we need fair funding for Wales. We have lived under successive Conservative Governments and now Labour Governments that are still not engaging on that need to get the fundamentals right when it comes to fair funding for Wales. And you can't separate the two. It is an absolute truism that a lack of fair funding at the top will come down in the end to the money in the pockets of people the length and breadth of Wales, including through pressures on council tax. We want to be able to help in many ways that we can.

And on the rather glib start, if you're going to say it's a bad week for nats, actually choose a week that is a bad week for this Government. We're about to publish our programme for government, which is about transforming Wales, putting the health service on a firmer footing, raising education standards, halving that productivity gap with the rest of the UK, creating great job opportunities, the most generous childcare offer anywhere in the UK in dealing with child poverty, and standing up for Wales, always, which is something I'm not hearing from any other party in this Chamber.

Anthony Slaughter (Green, Caerdydd Penarth)

3. What is the Welsh Government doing to prepare for adverse and extreme weather events this winter? OQ64508

Rhun ap Iorwerth (Plaid Cymru, Bangor Conwy Môn)

I know the Member agrees with me that the evidence is clear: climate change is increasing the frequency and intensity of extreme weather. We are committed to building stronger, more resilient communities across Wales in that changing context. We're working closely with partners, including through the Wales resilience forum and local resilience forums to prepare for winter risks, to strengthen response arrangements and learn from recent extreme weather events. We're also making communities more resilient to flooding through continued investment in infrastructure and nature-based solutions.

Anthony Slaughter (Green, Caerdydd Penarth)

Thank you. Last week, First Minister, you issued a statement saying that you will convene a resilience summit focusing on wildfires—very much welcomed. Yet, we must be ready for all of the escalating risks of a changing climate. This includes extreme cold, winter flooding and severe storms this coming winter. The Met Office has warned of a heightened risk on the horizon due to an unprecedented El Niño event this year, only highlighted in shocking headlines yesterday, recording the record breaking of 150 years of records. Weaknesses in our infrastructure and our resilience, such as recently witnessed in Gwaelod-y-garth, will only become more apparent in the coming months.

Wales is dangerously unprepared for the predicted onslaught of extreme weather conditions. Climate response must be integrated as our first line of defence. Welsh Government allocated in its supplementary budget just £1 million for emergency preparedness. Establishing a climate shock fund would be a vital step forward in demonstrating that the Welsh Government is serious about protecting communities this winter, with or without UK Government support. What discussions has the First Minister had with the UK Government on funding these emergency measures? Diolch.

Rhun ap Iorwerth (Plaid Cymru, Bangor Conwy Môn)

Thank you for the question. I think the world is largely unprepared for the challenges that we face. The question is how can we accelerate our preparedness. You will see in the programme for government today that climate change isn't seen as a priority in and of itself; it's one of the priorities that binds us all together as Government Ministers, because this has to be addressed across all portfolios.

Resilience—I talked about this last week—is an issue that I have tried to focus a great deal on since I came into the role of First Minister, understanding the various elements that contribute to the resilience, or lack of, in some ways, that we have as a society. Wildfires happen to be the one that has grabbed our attention, which is why we need to make sure that we're tightening up those resilience elements around that in the summit on 22 October. But the Member is right; flooding is something that many communities will be concerned about. There are other concerns too—the effects of heat, the effects of cold and so on.

It is something that we work across the UK on. I want to ensure (a) that Wales gets its fair share of resilience funding, civil contingency funding, across the UK, and that's something I'm eager to pursue. But the Member has my word that I will absolutely be looking at how we work between Welsh Government and UK Government to get the support that Wales needs to prepare for this wide range of threats that we face in future.

Steve Bayliss (Reform UK, Afan Ogwr Rhondda)

First Minister, I recognise that £85 million has been invested in flood risk management this year, but Rhondda Cynon Taf's investigation into storm Dennis has found that Blaenllechau was flooded from the steep hillside above it, that felling on Welsh Government-owned Natural Resources Wales-managed woodland may have contributed to surface water run-off, and that modelling suggested three of the four culvert networks lacked adequate capacity. This August, a major wildfire burned around 150 hectares of Llanwonno mountain, above Blaenllechau and Ferndale. So, before the winter rain arrives, will you ensure that Natural Resources Wales and RCT carry out a co-ordinated inspection of that hillside, its drainage and culverts, with the Mining Remediation Authority checking any relevant higher category coal tips within or below that affected area, and report the findings and any remedial work required to the Senedd by the end of October? Diolch.

Rhun ap Iorwerth (Plaid Cymru, Bangor Conwy Môn)

There is, of course, an ongoing programme of works that need to happen, some of them under the auspices of Welsh Government or its agencies, Natural Resources Wales, some that are the responsibility of local authorities. I have no doubt that, as we face the challenges of the winter, there needs to be just a double-checking of the robustness of those measures being put in place. I would say that, as well as making sure that your culverts are able to deal with run-off, there are other questions and innovations that we need to be looking at in how you slow down that run-off. Clearly, hot weather—hard ground—makes the situation more difficult. I'm really interested in how we manage the land, working with farmers to try to limit run-off, and so on.

We have to be aware that there are no silver bullets, there are no single measures that can be taken as we face these threats. They are multiple, and the need to be strategic in the way that we approach this is important, which is why the wildfire summit, in particular, looking at that threat, brings in so many different partners who will be able to contribute to making our resilience that much stronger. But I'm sure that your message will have been heard by the local authorities and others today.

Matthew Jones (Plaid Cymru, Sir Fynwy Torfaen)

First Minister, Monmouthshire has faced catastrophic flooding in recent years, and I was pleased that you were able to visit Monmouth and Abergavenny before the Senedd elections to speak to some of the local people affected, as well as to those finding solutions—long-lasting solutions—upstream. The scenes from last year’s flooding, especially those from Monmouth, will be etched in the memory of everyone who saw them for a long time. These once in 100 years events are getting more and more frequent, and we must now assume that they could happen at any time. As we've heard, the approaching El Niño event is on the horizon, with extreme weather events already anticipated, so, with this in mind, how is the Government improving flood preparedness for this winter? And in the longer term, how can we learn from the experiences of Monmouthshire residents to improve flood management for their community and for all of Wales? Diolch.

Rhun ap Iorwerth (Plaid Cymru, Bangor Conwy Môn)

I was pleased, along with the Member, to speak with some of the individuals who were affected by the pretty devasting flooding that they experienced in Monmouth. The Member's right that it is about learning lessons. It's not just about cleaning up; that's the first step. It's about trying to make sure that lessons are learnt for those localities in order to avoid and avert flooding, but lessons for elsewhere too, and I know that Monmouthshire County Council is preparing its section 19 flood investigation report following the devastation of storm Claudia, and the flood investigation report is almost complete, I understand, and will be published in October. But, wherever those floods are, the learnings are ones that we can try to make sure that they are applicable in other parts of Wales too.

Vikki Howells (Labour, Pontypridd Cynon Merthyr)

First Minister, my colleague Jayne Bryant, asked you, during your oral statement last week, whether the Welsh Government would consider bringing in a climate resilience fund to help us mitigate the impacts of extreme weather. You didn't really answer her directly, and nor did you answer Anthony Slaughter when he raised a very similar point in his opening question. Now, there's widespread support for this from stakeholders that we on the Welsh Labour benches have engaged with over the summer recess. And with resources for agencies involved in climate mitigation measures being really stretched, this is one way to safeguard those funds and make sure they're channelled in the right way. So, is this something that your Government can explore setting up ahead of your wildfire summit next month?

Rhun ap Iorwerth (Plaid Cymru, Bangor Conwy Môn)

No attempt to avoid the question. There are, in effect, a number of funds, aren't there, on which a Government can draw to deal with emergencies. What you want to make sure is that those funds themselves are resilient. I absolutely am ready to consider whether we can bring together funds in one place, in the same way as the Government is looking at how we can put preventative health funds under one banner, so that we can measure better what the various elements of those funding capacities are. So, absolutely willing to consider that. At the end of the day, it's making sure that we have the tools to do the job that we need. There's more than one way of doing that, but let's put that in the mix too.

Alun Cox (Plaid Cymru, Afan Ogwr Rhondda)

4. Will the First Minister provide an update on progress relating to the development of a new national food strategy? OQ64561

Alun Cox (Plaid Cymru, Afan Ogwr Rhondda)

Will the First Minister provide an update on progress relating to the development of a new food strategy and how that could start to deal with food poverty in Afan Ogwr Rhondda?

Rhun ap Iorwerth (Plaid Cymru, Bangor Conwy Môn)

I am very pleased that significant and early progress has been made on developing our new national food strategy. An expert working group has been formed already, and terms of reference have been published. Plans are also in place to fast-track immediate discussions on food in schools, which is important, and edible horticulture as well, and the meat supply chain. There will be two interim reports that will be published before the final report by autumn next year.

Alun Cox (Plaid Cymru, Afan Ogwr Rhondda)

Thank you, First Minister. Over the summer months, I've met with a number of organisations who are involved in food poverty and food insecurity. From frontline provision to community pantries and growing schemes, everyone seems to be saying the same thing: the number of people who are working and using these resources is increasing, contributions are declining, and groups of people who have never sought support before are starting to do so now. How does the Government intend to engage with these local organisations, who see the impacts on the ground, in developing its national food strategy?

Rhun ap Iorwerth (Plaid Cymru, Bangor Conwy Môn)

I'm very pleased to have that question. It gives me a chance to explain a little bit about how the group is going to be operating. There are four pillars to that piece of work: one of them is the environment, one is the economy and rural development, there is a food security element, and then the other element is health and well-being. We can see there, can't we, where we need to make sure that local groups can feed into this. The working group does include a local food partnership in order to make sure that the voice of community organisations is heard. So, it is something that we were determined to build into this piece of work from the beginning, for the reasons that the Member referred to.

Huw Irranca-Davies (Labour, Afan Ogwr Rhondda)

Diolch. Alun, you extended the question a little bit from what was on the order paper, just to be aware, because this isn't an Afan Ogwr Rhondda-specific question. So, can I bring in now Claire Johnson-Wood, to explain why?

Claire Johnson-Wood (Reform UK, Gwynedd Maldwyn)

Diolch. First Minister, what Welsh farmers need is a Government that understands and prioritises, not yet another 'expert panel' kicking the can down the road. Given that under the previous Labour-Plaid administration the sustainable farming scheme significantly increased regulatory complexity, can the Welsh Government please give assurances that the national food strategy will not place additional bureaucratic burdens on farmers and producers that they do not need at this time?

Rhun ap Iorwerth (Plaid Cymru, Bangor Conwy Môn)

I haven't heard anybody accusing this agriculture Minister, this rural resilience Minister, of kicking any can down the road when it comes to supporting the agriculture sector. I heard nothing but a sigh of relief from a sector that believe that they have a Government that's willing to engage with it in a positive way, that security of that over £1 billion over the course of this Senedd in order to give assurances and confidence to the sector. And on where they fit into the food strategy, they are members of the working group that is bringing together this food strategy, and as I said, rural development and the economy, which includes agriculture, is one of the core pillars of this work that we're undertaking.

Huw Irranca-Davies (Labour, Afan Ogwr Rhondda)

Next—. I do apologise. Peter Fox.

Peter Fox (Conservative, Sir Fynwy Torfaen)

Diolch, Lywydd. First Minister, I welcome the food strategy, and I was pleased to read the published terms of reference for it last week, and I look forward to the expert panel being put in place. I am frustrated in many ways that we've lost four months because, actually, most of the evidence that is needed around that area has been in place, because there are huge similarities between what you're putting forward and what I was considering a couple of years ago. Within my proposals back then, there were clear, measurable targets against food goals. Can we expect to see really robust, measurable targets against your food pillars, and can I ask you: would you consider anchoring your food strategy into legislation, recognising the importance this will have for our future generations?

Rhun ap Iorwerth (Plaid Cymru, Bangor Conwy Môn)

Can I pay tribute, Llywydd, to the work that the Member has done in this field in trying to bring in a piece of legislation that would underpin a robust food sector and protect issues relating to food production and nutrition and so on in Wales? We haven't lost four months, of course, because this work is already under way. This was one of the early actions of the Minister, to appoint a chair. The work is ongoing.

I'm not going to be prescriptive in telling a chair who is much more of an expert in this field than I am of the approach that he should take. You know me: I tend to take the approach of, 'Let's see what the evidence tells us.' If there's a suggestion that legislation could be a part of the approach on one particular element of what we're trying to do, well, let's have a sit down and see how we could formulate that legislation. But it's also true, we know, that you can act without legislation. I'm about outcomes, at the end of the day: let's progress in the way that gives us the best result.

Adrian Mason (Reform UK, Clwyd)

5. Beth mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn ei wneud i gefnogi pobl hŷn gyda chostau byw? OQ64527

Rhun ap Iorwerth (Plaid Cymru, Bangor Conwy Môn)

Supporting people with the cost of living, as we know, is a real priority for this Government. We're ensuring that measures to tackle poverty reflect older people's needs and make support for older people simpler, fairer and also more accessible. Through our £4.84 million tackling poverty support fund, local authorities will provide crisis support, including emergency food aid, alongside preventative help also tailored to local communities, to stop people, including older people, from falling into poverty where we can avoid that.

Adrian Mason (Reform UK, Clwyd)

Thanks for the answer, First Minister. So, while I recognise there are a number of schemes available, and I knew you'd refer to some, of course you would, but the Older People's Commissioner for Wales tells us that one in six older people in Wales are living in relative income poverty, with one in five going without heating and a quarter skipping meals or eating less. How can we imagine that situation? It's happening in Wales. These figures suggest that despite the support available, too many older people are still struggling, particularly those living on fixed incomes and those who may fall just outside eligibility for means-tested assistance. So, what further action will your Government take to ensure that support actually reaches older people, and how will you measure whether it is succeeding?

Rhun ap Iorwerth (Plaid Cymru, Bangor Conwy Môn)

The Member is quite right. I have the results here of Age Cymru's 2026 annual survey, and more than half of respondents identified cost-of-living pressures as being the biggest challenge that they face—and for some, it will be a significant challenge.

There are things that we can do. The nearly £5 million that was announced in the past few days can really help people who are particularly vulnerable. There are a host of issues around travel and the continuation of bus travel and so on that we can wrap together as support for older people. But also we have to, when it comes to the main pressures, recognise that there is a need for all of us to put pressure on the UK Government here, especially on fuel. We've had a question already on the pressure of the cost of fuel in rural areas in particular. There has to be a coming together of all the potential levers—some of which are in our hands, but not all of them. And, at the end of the day, we also need a fresh approach on the question of public service funding because it is the most vulnerable people, including older people, who bear the brunt of it.

Sam Rowlands (Conservative, Fflint Wrecsam)

Can I support the Member in his questions on this topic, First Minister? We know that many older people at the moment are struggling with the cost of living, and particularly with the impact of a fixed income on many older people in our communities. We also know that, historically, people have been able to access advice services in their communities through organisations such as Citizens Advice and other fantastic organisations like that, who can support our older people to ensure that they are making the best use of any welfare support available to them and other types of support as well. So, I wonder, First Minister, if you're able to outline how you see those types of services in the future and what support the Welsh Government can give to organisations like the citizens advice bureaux to ensure that that advice is available to them in a timely way, and in an accessible way as well? Diolch yn fawr iawn.

Rhun ap Iorwerth (Plaid Cymru, Bangor Conwy Môn)

We all have worked with Citizens Advice, with CAB, haven't we, and appreciate the work that they do on the ground in all parts of Wales in helping vulnerable people? I advise people to turn to your friends in CAB. Part of the funding that was announced in the past few days was specifically around advice; I think that's important to note. There is £36 million grant funding in place for the single advice fund for the period from April last year and for three years from then. That's about providing integrated advice services. I would hope that those providing services under that grant are able to reach as many people as they can. But the Member's right: reaching out with advice to people is key. We've made some funding available now and we are so lucky in Wales that we have those partners, and in local government too, who work so hard on this front.

Marc Jones (Plaid Cymru, Fflint Wrecsam)

6. What consideration has the Welsh Government given to ensuring that the costs of remediating illegally dumped waste are paid by the people responsible, rather than by taxpayers? OQ64553

Rhun ap Iorwerth (Plaid Cymru, Bangor Conwy Môn)

In line with the polluter-pays principle, those responsible for illegal activity should bear the costs of the clean-up. That's true for illegal dumping today, as it should be for historic contamination, if I could add, too. We are committed, as a Government, to reducing the burden of illegal dumping on taxpayers and on landowners, and landfill disposals tax ensures that those responsible for unauthorised disposals pay 150 per cent of the standard tax rate.

Marc Jones (Plaid Cymru, Fflint Wrecsam)

Diolch, Brif Weinidog. In Fflint Wrecsam, you may be aware that communities continue to deal with both the historic legacy of illegal waste dumping and the current active sites that are causing ongoing problems for residents in my constituency. Time and again, we see the companies responsible for these environmental crimes avoid accountability by entering liquidation and walking away from the costs of remediation. This leaves local communities to deal with the consequences and risks shifting the burden of cleaning up onto the public purse. How will Welsh Government work with the UK Government, local authorities and relevant public bodies to address this ongoing issue?

Rhun ap Iorwerth (Plaid Cymru, Bangor Conwy Môn)

It is an issue that blights many communities and, as I say, communities should not have to bear the consequences of waste crime, and neither should the taxpayer, and we're committed to supporting regulators to pursue those who are responsible: funding Natural Resources Wales's waste crime work is important; supporting multi-agency work to tackle organised criminality, because this is criminality; sharing intelligence where we can; and co-ordinating enforcement action. This is also an issue on which we are eager to work with UK Government and, indeed, Governments across the UK. The Welsh Revenue Authority wants to build those links with His Majesty's Revenue and Customs and so on, to strengthen the system, to close loopholes and ensure waste crime does not pay. Of course, when it comes to historic contamination, something that has received significant publicity recently, we have to make sure that every avenue is pursued to deal with this, as one of our lasting post-industrial legacies.

Gareth Beer (Reform UK, Sir Gaerfyrddin)

7. What action is the Welsh Government taking to reduce river pollution levels in Carmarthenshire? OQ64555

Rhun ap Iorwerth (Plaid Cymru, Bangor Conwy Môn)

My Government's determined to improve the health of our rivers. We're funding the west Wales nutrient management boards, which deliver targeted action across the Tywi, Teifi and Cleddau catchments. We're also establishing a new nutrient efficiency and resilience group to strengthen national leadership on nutrient pollution and co-ordinate action across sectors. Together, we believe these measures will support river restoration, improve water quality and build long-term environmental resilience.

Gareth Beer (Reform UK, Sir Gaerfyrddin)

Diolch, First Minister. People whose livelihoods depend on Carmarthenshire's rivers, including members of Carmarthen Coracle and Netsmen's Association, tell us they have never seen such a poor season, with the return of only six sewin from May to June this year. Their experience makes clear that river pollution must be treated with a far greater urgency. I urge you to read the Royal Society's recent report on chemical mixtures in British waterways. Quote: 'Regulators are flying blind.' Unquote.

In Carmarthenshire, Natural Resources Wales seem to be flying blind. Our rivers are being contaminated by harmful chemical mixtures, including organics, ammonia, microplastics, cadmium and mercury, with no understanding of their interactions or the harm done. Will you acknowledge that the Welsh Government lacks a credible plan to clean up our rivers, and set out how it will meet its political duty to protect our waters and rivers and special areas of conservation?

Rhun ap Iorwerth (Plaid Cymru, Bangor Conwy Môn)

This is work that is under way, and it's very important that it is. We know that river pollution, sea pollution, is something that is of real concern to people the length and breadth of Wales, and it certainly is to me. The vision for a reformed Welsh water sector will be published later this autumn, so we're nearing that point where we have a point to move forward from. We know that river pollution has multiple causes. It requires action across all sectors. It involves industry, it involves agriculture, it involves the water companies themselves. It's about making sure that we have good, solid regulation, made in Wales—that's what I want. It's by having that attitude that we can move forward to having cleaner rivers in Wales.

Llŷr Powell (Reform UK, Blaenau Gwent Caerffili Rhymni)

8. What is the Welsh Government doing to address NHS waiting times in Blaenau Gwent Caerfilli Rhymni? OQ64559

Rhun ap Iorwerth (Plaid Cymru, Bangor Conwy Môn)

The Welsh Government is investing £145 million to help health boards reduce waiting times and improve access to treatment. This supports delivery of our planned care plan, which sets out a clinically led approach to eliminating the longest waits, increasing capacity and improving outcomes. An expert group is also advising on the development of up to 10 surgical and diagnostic hubs to provide faster, more efficient care for patients, including those in Blaenau Gwent Caerffili Rhymni.

Llŷr Powell (Reform UK, Blaenau Gwent Caerffili Rhymni)

First Minister, a constituent has come to me who is now unable to work because he has a hernia. He's been waiting close to 36 weeks for his surgery. He's living in pain. He feels it affects his family life, his relationship with his children, all because he's waiting to be seen. During the election, you looked down a camera and told the people of Wales that these waiting lists will see an impact within months. We learnt during recess from your health Minister that months could take up to, now, years. [Interruption.] So, the Minister was wrong when he said that waiting lists will take years to address, was he? That's what he said. So, what can you tell the people of Wales? Do you regret saying it's going to be months, because from reports last week, waiting lists are going up and not down? So, will you apologise to the people of Wales for your statement at the election?

Rhun ap Iorwerth (Plaid Cymru, Bangor Conwy Môn)

That's exactly what I've said throughout. This is an issue of seriousness that means we put it at No.1 on the list of our priorities coming into Government. It was somewhat missing in Reform's pledges for Government, were they to be in this position. I have said about the most extreme over-two-year waits that they have to go. They have to be eliminated. I said they'll go in months. That goes, a year from coming into Government they are gone. That's months. Well, months is not more than a year. So, a year after we come into Government, I expect them to have gone. I stick to what I have said throughout, okay?

I consider us right now to be beginning the work. We came into Government in May. We've had two months of figures. It's during that time that we have started putting money in that will, in months, bring us the benefits, not for us as Senedd Members, but for the people that we serve: people who are on long waiting lists who shouldn't be, staff across the health boards who want to be able to care and not have to have those that they're concerned about waiting two years or more. We stick to what we said. I've said it throughout. I say it again today.

Lindsay Whittle (Plaid Cymru, Blaenau Gwent Caerffili Rhymni)

9. How will the Welsh Government ensure that women can access opportunities in major growth sectors, including advanced manufacturing, clean energy, and information technology? OQ64494

Rhun ap Iorwerth (Plaid Cymru, Bangor Conwy Môn)

Our productivity mission, as a Government, is about unlocking the talents of the whole workforce, and ensuring economic opportunity is everywhere and open to everyone. We aim to work with employers, education and training providers, and others, to ensure women can enter and progress in sectors such as advanced manufacturing, clean energy and digital technology where, of course, many women are already having a huge impact.

Lindsay Whittle (Plaid Cymru, Blaenau Gwent Caerffili Rhymni)

First Minister, thank you for that answer. I welcome the Welsh Government's focus on growth sectors and its commitment to fairness in the workplace. But to ensure, in the Valleys that I represent, that women directly benefit from these opportunities, could you expand any further on how you will agree to work alongside local authorities and industry partners to explore the targeted apprenticeship pathways for women in our former coalfield Valleys, please?

Rhun ap Iorwerth (Plaid Cymru, Bangor Conwy Môn)

It absolutely is about partnership working, and we will continue absolutely to work with employers, local authorities, training providers and others to make sure that those opportunities are there for women in these sectors. We want more women to access apprenticeships, to develop higher level skills and progress into well-paid careers that many women thought were closed to them not that long ago. Well, they are not closed to any women, and through apprenticeships, Careers Wales, Working Wales, we're helping women in communities like Blaenau Gwent Caerffili Rhymni to identify those opportunities and ambition to increase female participation in advanced manufacturing, digital and clean energy. That's the kind of Wales we want, where opportunity genuinely is open to all. There have been some positive signs, but we've got more to do.

Huw Irranca-Davies (Labour, Afan Ogwr Rhondda)

And finally, First Minister, question 10, Cai Parry-Jones.

Cai Parry-Jones (Reform UK, Caerdydd Ffynnon Taf)

10. Will the First Minister provide an update on the implementation of the Senedd Cymru (Member Accountability and Elections) Act 2026? OQ64560

Rhun ap Iorwerth (Plaid Cymru, Bangor Conwy Môn)

The Welsh Government is working closely with the Standards of Conduct Committee and the Business Committee to ensure that Members whose conduct falls far below that which is expected of elected representatives can be robustly held to account.

Cai Parry-Jones (Reform UK, Caerdydd Ffynnon Taf)

Diolch, Brif Weinidog. Part of this Act places a duty on your Government to bring in rules banning false or misleading statements of fact, made before or during an election, to affect who is elected. It also lets your Government set out what does and does not count as a statement of fact. If it is, in fact, true that a candidate misrepresents their own beliefs to win votes, and that becomes clear after polling day, will your Government treat that as a false statement of fact?

Rhun ap Iorwerth (Plaid Cymru, Bangor Conwy Môn)

This is a sour grapes question, Llywydd, I believe. I think it references a decision taken by a Member of this Senedd who has seen a new approach to politics. This is a party that misled people in the Brexit vote. It knows all about misleading people. I and my Government stand by the determination to make sure that we have in Wales an honest politics, the kind that seems alien to many on his benches.

Huw Irranca-Davies (Labour, Afan Ogwr Rhondda)

Thank you very much, First Minister. I'm speaking very slowly now—

Huw Irranca-Davies (Labour, Afan Ogwr Rhondda)

—as we wait in high expectation for the Counsel General to appear on the benches. If Members will just bear with us for a moment, as soon as we are ready, we will commence.

2. Questions to the Counsel General

Huw Irranca-Davies (Labour, Afan Ogwr Rhondda)

We will move now to item 2, questions to the Counsel General. The first question is from Jane Dodds.

Jane Dodds (Liberal Democrat, Brycheiniog Tawe Nedd)

Thank you very much, Llywydd. Good afternoon, Counsel General.

Jane Dodds (Liberal Democrat, Brycheiniog Tawe Nedd)

1. What legal advice has the Counsel General provided to the Welsh Government regarding its legal powers to intervene in service reconfiguration decisions taken by local health boards? OQ64489

Jane Dodds (Liberal Democrat, Brycheiniog Tawe Nedd)

Thank you for that response.

Jane Dodds (Liberal Democrat, Brycheiniog Tawe Nedd)

Sections 26 to 28 of the National Health Service (Wales) Act 2006 clearly give Welsh Ministers the power to intervene where a health board is failing to perform its functions adequately, and to remove board members, which we saw in the Senedd last term. Section 12 of the same Act allows Ministers to direct health boards on their functions more generally. While there appears to be some confusion over the 2006 Act, and the social care Bill in 2020, Vaughan Gething at the time was relatively clear that the Bill did not affect Ministers' powers under sections 26 to 28. That is a bit of a mouthful, I'm aware, of lots of sections. I ask for a clear answer, and I'm very happy to take a response in writing to this: is there anything in law that prevents Welsh Ministers from intervening under sections 26 to 28 where a board has lost public confidence in this way, or is the truth that Ministers could act and are choosing not to? Diolch yn fawr iawn.

Andrew Griffin (Reform UK, Gwynedd Maldwyn)

I'd like to thank Jane Dodds for bringing this matter up. Powys is a large and sparsely populated rural county, where removing in-patient provision from community hospitals can mean substantially longer journeys for patients and their families. When a health board considers a major service reconfiguration, what legal duties must it take into account regarding rurality, equality and access to services? And what remedies are available if those duties have not been properly discharged?

Niamh Salkeld (Plaid Cymru, Blaenau Gwent Caerffili Rhymni)

2. What legal advice has the Counsel General provided to the Welsh Government on the devolution of youth justice? OQ64502

Niamh Salkeld (Plaid Cymru, Blaenau Gwent Caerffili Rhymni)

Diolch, Gwnsler Cyffredinol. Many have called for youth justice to be devolved to Wales, including the Brown commission, and I'm glad that this Plaid Cymru Government also wants to see that happen. Currently, a child in the justice system in Wales has one foot in each world. Their school, healthcare and social workers are devolved, yet their court and their custody are not. That jagged edge means different systems, different governments, and it's the child who tends to slip through the gaps. The UK Government is proposing, like you mentioned, reforms to the youth justice system. From April 2027, Wales is due to take on some funding for remand and early intervention. That's a start. It's funding, but it's not powers. Decisions on how the system works will still be made in Westminster, even though Wales delivers the majority of it. Does the Counsel General agree that the UK Government has a duty to work with Wales, not around it, on reforms to a system that Wales largely delivers? Diolch.

Cristiana Emsley (Reform UK, Fflint Wrecsam)

Counsel General, there is a fundamental difference between improving youth justice and simply devolving it. Wales already has strong pre-court diversion and comparatively low levels of youth custody. Yet the Government's own advisory work identifies inconsistent police management, staffing pressures, funding uncertainty and rising school exclusions. Indeed, its own youth justice advisory panel asked the questions Ministers must answer: how will devolution improve outcomes for children rather than simply change who is responsible? Because transferring responsibility across the border does not solve a problem. Changing the nameplate on the door is not reform. Counsel General, what objective test has the Government been advised must be met before further youth justice powers are devolved? If Ministers cannot demonstrate better outcomes for children, victims and the public, what is the legal or constitutional justification for transferring those powers at all?

Huw Irranca-Davies (Labour, Afan Ogwr Rhondda)

I now call the party spokespeople to question the Counsel General. First of all, Reform UK spokesperson, Adrian Mason.

Adrian Mason (Reform UK, Clwyd)

Here we are again, Counsel General. You and I have to walk a narrow line in our exchanges. We're here in our legal capacity in this instance in an immensely political Chamber. So, no trick questions.

Constitutional change can have long-term consequences, of course. When the Government considers seeking additional powers for Wales, what tests do you believe should be applied before a proposal is taken forward? Should those tests include a clearly identifiable difficulty, evidence that transferring powers is the best way to address it, a workable delivery plan and sustainable funding, and clear accountability? Where services operate across the England and Wales border, should the effect on those cross-border links also be addressed and made clear before any changes take place?

Adrian Mason (Reform UK, Clwyd)

Thank you. I want to move to the tribunal system. I know it's high in your priorities, Counsel General. So, the proposed new Welsh tribunal structure is intended not only to bring existing devolved tribunals into a more coherent system, but also be capable of taking on additional jurisdictions in the future. Before any additional jurisdiction is transferred into the Welsh tribunal system, what safeguards do you believe should be in place? In particular, how would we protect judicial independence, access to specialist expertise, consistent rights of appeal, and the handling of cases across the England-Wales border? And would you expect the costs and practical impact of each proposed transfer to be fully assessed before it takes place?

Adrian Mason (Reform UK, Clwyd)

Let's move now to the rail network—another one that is coming down the line, excuse the pun. Counsel General, the Government has set out a pathway towards full devolution of rail services and infrastructure, while also accepting that the Welsh network must remain integrated within the wider United Kingdom, of course. From a legal and constitutional point of view, what would need to be settled before such a transfer could take place? In particular, how would responsibility for long-term infrastructure liabilities, cross-border routes, for example, funding and dispute resolution be divided between Welsh Ministers, the Welsh Government and Great British Railways? And should funding and liability be settled as an integral part of any transfer rather than being left to subsequent negotiations?

Huw Irranca-Davies (Labour, Afan Ogwr Rhondda)

The Welsh Labour spokesperson, Mike Hedges.

Mike Hedges (Labour, Gŵyr Abertawe)

Diolch. What discussion has the Counsel General had with the Law Society regarding securing fully funded level 7 solicitor apprenticeships in Wales? Level 7 solicitor apprenticeships are a well-established route to qualifications in England, allowing aspiring solicitors to earn while they learn and avoid taking on significant tuition debt. In Wales, however, aspiring solicitors still cannot access an equivalent funded route. The uptake of level 7 solicitor apprenticeships in England has grown, with more than 5,000 people starting an apprenticeship between 2018 and 2025. We cannot allow Wales to be left behind, can we?

Mike Hedges (Labour, Gŵyr Abertawe)

Thank you very much for that answer. Let's see if I can keep being on a roll. Access to justice is a core component of the rule of law and yet many areas of Wales are facing a growing crisis in access to legal services. Described as legal deserts, these are areas where the presence of solicitors is so limited that people cannot easily obtain legal advice or representation when they need it. The Law Society has produced a report that draws on the latest data available, including solicitor distribution, demographic trends and the impact of legal aid funding pressures. The findings include severe geographic inequality in solicitor density, rising solicitor retirements without adequate replacements, the attrition of legal aid providers, and increasing numbers of unrepresented litigants in civil, criminal and welfare cases. What are the Counsel General's views on this report?

Huw Irranca-Davies (Labour, Afan Ogwr Rhondda)

The Welsh Conservatives spokesperson, Paul Davies.

Paul Davies (Conservative, Ceredigion Penfro)

Diolch, Lywydd. Counsel General, I want to return to the issue raised by the Member for Brycheiniog Tawe Nedd and ask some further questions around what the Welsh Government can do to intervene and stop service reconfiguration decisions taken by local health boards. I listened very carefully to your earlier answers. Now, I'm sure you'll agree that health board service reconfiguration is a contentious issue in most parts of Wales, including, of course, in west Wales, which has a long history of service reductions, relocations and reconfigurations that have led many residents to feel that healthcare provision is increasingly being moved further away from their communities. In my view, when there is such strong public opposition to the health board's decisions, the Welsh Government has a moral responsibility to get involved and put a hold on controversial plans that do not carry the will of the people. So, Counsel General, you've confirmed here today that Ministers can intervene under the National Health Service (Wales) Act 2006, but can you tell us what role you have as the Welsh Government's legal adviser in any process that would involve intervention? And can you confirm that a Government can legally intervene on any health board decision under this Act?

Paul Davies (Conservative, Ceredigion Penfro)

You see, many people across Wales will find it difficult to understand why Ministers appear powerless to act when there is overwhelming public concern about major service changes that could significantly affect access to healthcare. Therefore, Counsel General, can you outline the legal thresholds, then, you believe must be met before the Welsh Government will intervene in a service reconfiguration decision taken by a health board? Furthermore, do you believe the current legal set-up provides the Welsh Government with sufficient powers to protect communities from reconfiguration decisions that lack public confidence?

Paul Davies (Conservative, Ceredigion Penfro)

I'm asking your opinion.

Matthew Jones (Plaid Cymru, Sir Fynwy Torfaen)

3. What legal advice has the Counsel General provided to the Government regarding maintaining the Senedd’s legislative competence where the Welsh Government and UK Government's views differ? OQ64507

Art Wright (Reform UK, Casnewydd Islwyn)

I'm sure that, as a former Member of Parliament, the Counsel General is well acquainted with the concept of parliamentary sovereignty. Will the Counsel General acknowledge that the Senedd's legislative competence is defined by the Parliament of the United Kingdom and that the Senedd lacks the legal capacity to legislate on matters explicitly reserved to Westminster? Schedule 7A reserves the union. Does the Welsh Government accept that a Senedd Bill for independence or for an independence referendum would be outside the competency of the Senedd?

Sarah Cooper-Lesadd (Plaid Cymru, Pen-y-bont Bro Morgannwg)

4. What legal advice has the Counsel General provided to the Welsh Government regarding the adequacy of Welsh electoral law in respect of artificially generated content in devolved elections? OQ64487

Sarah Cooper-Lesadd (Plaid Cymru, Pen-y-bont Bro Morgannwg)

Seven years ago, the BBC's The Capture imagined footage of a public figure fabricated convincingly enough to destroy them. It was dystopian and it was fiction then, but today all it takes is a free app and 90 seconds. A councillor in Kent told LBC this week she is thinking of quitting politics altogether due to sexualised images of her being flyposted all around lamp posts around her home and the council building she works in. It makes her feel watched, she said, and unsafe in the town she represents. Other women have said they are now considering whether they should stand at all. This is a real cost, not for one councillor, but for every single woman who decides the abuse is not worth it. Wales goes to the polls in May 2027, and I know the Government really does take this seriously. So, does the Counsel General consider that the existing Welsh electoral law reaches artificially generated material of this kind, and what steps is the Government considering before those elections?

Jason O'Connell (Reform UK, Pontypridd Cynon Merthyr)

Counsel General, under Wales's electoral law voting system, voters get one vote for a political party and its list of candidates, so there's a very clear statement of accountability. What happens when a candidate asks voters to back one party, gets elected on that party's manifesto and then walks away from those commitments? The voter doesn't have to change their vote—[Interruption.]

Huw Irranca-Davies (Labour, Afan Ogwr Rhondda)

We're trying to listen—

Jason O'Connell (Reform UK, Pontypridd Cynon Merthyr)

They can't choose another candidate—[Interruption.]

Huw Irranca-Davies (Labour, Afan Ogwr Rhondda)

Colleagues, we're trying to listen to the question. I think the Counsel General is trying to listen.

Jason O'Connell (Reform UK, Pontypridd Cynon Merthyr)

Diolch, Lywydd. Yet, the Member keeps their seat, alongside their very generous salary. Now, some learned legal minds, such as yourself, could consider that to be fraud by misrepresentation. So, Counsel General, does Welsh electoral law provide any legal protection for voters where a candidate's conduct after election departs from the political representation they were elected under? Does Plaid Cymru still consider that politicians who mislead constituents should be criminalised? And have you considered that, in order to protect Welsh democracy, the Member should do the right thing and resign? Diolch.

Jason O'Connell (Reform UK, Pontypridd Cynon Merthyr)

We've all been elected.

Huw Irranca-Davies (Labour, Afan Ogwr Rhondda)

Right. Now, we're going to try and move ahead and get some more questions in further down the list, if we can, with everybody's help.

Huw Irranca-Davies (Labour, Afan Ogwr Rhondda)

Therefore, question 5, Mair Rowlands.

Mair Rowlands (Plaid Cymru, Bangor Conwy Môn)

5. What assessment has the Counsel General made of people's ability to access legal services and justice through the medium of Welsh? OQ64495

Mair Rowlands (Plaid Cymru, Bangor Conwy Môn)

Thank you, Counsel General. In February, the Law Society reported on the legal deserts in Wales, outlining how access to legal services declines outside the M4 corridor. While Cardiff has 12.3 solicitors for every 1,000 residents, in north Wales, the figure is closer to 2.3 per 1,000. This geographical inequality has a fundamental impact on Welsh-speaking communities in Bangor Conwy Môn and across north Wales in terms of access to legal services and justice through the medium of Welsh. Will the Counsel General outline the Government's plans to address this inequality?

Carrie Harper (Plaid Cymru, Fflint Wrecsam)

My question has some crossover with the question that Mike Hedges asked earlier.

Carrie Harper (Plaid Cymru, Fflint Wrecsam)

6. What assessment has the Counsel General made of the impact of pressures on legal aid provision on access to justice in Wales? OQ64498

Carrie Harper (Plaid Cymru, Fflint Wrecsam)

Diolch yn fawr iawn. We know how vital legal aid is to helping those in need and ensuring that everybody has the right to adequate legal representation. A report by the House of Lords select committee last year concluded that there are people who are both unable to access legal aid and unable to afford to pay for legal services privately. As the Law Society have noted, proposals put forward by the UK Government have not addressed the distinct issues facing the legal sector in Wales and that the part or full devolution of justice, if implemented and funded appropriately, offers significant potential opportunities to the people of Wales. What advice has the Counsel General given the Welsh Government on the adequacy of legal aid in Wales?

Marc Jones (Plaid Cymru, Fflint Wrecsam)

This feel slightly strange, asking a question to the person next to me. [Laughter.]

Marc Jones (Plaid Cymru, Fflint Wrecsam)

7. What legal advice has the Counsel General provided to the Welsh Government on the devolution of justice? OQ64506

Marc Jones (Plaid Cymru, Fflint Wrecsam)

Thank you, Counsel General. The need to devolve justice has been outlined several times in this Chamber by the Independent Commission on the Constitutional Future of Wales and by the Law Society. We know that the current system deteriorates outcomes for people in Wales. And I've been frightened, truth be told, that 40 per cent of the funding comes from the Welsh Government, although justice has not been devolved. That isn't sustainable. So, does the Counsel General agree that devolution of justice is vital to improve outcomes for those who go through the system?

Huw Irranca-Davies (Labour, Afan Ogwr Rhondda)

Finally, question 8—Kiera Marshall.

Kiera Marshall (Plaid Cymru, Caerdydd Penarth)

8. How is the Counsel General promoting access to justice for rape survivors? OQ64490

Kiera Marshall (Plaid Cymru, Caerdydd Penarth)

Thank you for that. I was pleased to see the UK Government announcement that specialist courts to deal with rape and sexual offences are to be introduced across England and Wales, and, hopefully, this begins to tackle the shamefully low prosecution rates of rape in the UK, which has, effectively, been decriminalised.

However, we also must look at prevention, not just justice. I met with a group of young women at Cardiff University, so I was glad to hear you talk about the university sector. They're called Time to Act, and they've been campaigning to eliminate sexual assault and sexual harassment from campuses, alongside supporting survivors. In England, as you'll know, there are currently regulatory consequences for institutions that fail to prevent and to tackle harassment and sexual misconduct. Students in Wales don't have this equivalent protection, so I was wondering if you would, potentially, look at what avenues are available for the Welsh Government to legislate and prevent sexual harassment and violence on university campus.

Kerry Ferguson (Plaid Cymru, Ceredigion Penfro)

Thank you very much, Counsel General.

3. Business Statement and Announcement

Kerry Ferguson (Plaid Cymru, Ceredigion Penfro)

We'll move now to item 3, the business statement and announcement. I call on the Trefnydd, Heledd Fychan.

Heledd Fychan (Plaid Cymru, Pontypridd Cynon Merthyr)

Thank you, Dirprwy Lywydd. Two oral statements have been added to today's agenda, namely 'New Ambition for Wales', the programme for government, and also the Welsh defence ethical framework. Draft Plenary business for the next three weeks is shown on the business statement, which is available to all Members electronically.

Llŷr Powell (Reform UK, Blaenau Gwent Caerffili Rhymni)

Trefnydd, I'd be grateful if I could have a statement on local train overcrowding. Transport for Wales's service for Bridgend to Rhymney is currently the third most overcrowded service between peak hours in the UK. That service now is affecting commuters, affecting their transport into work. It's not very easy for elderly people to get a seat, and it's something that my constituents are raising with me quite often. So, I'd be grateful, Trefnydd, if the Minister sitting here could come forward with something so that we can address the overcrowding on Welsh trains. Diolch.

Heledd Fychan (Plaid Cymru, Pontypridd Cynon Merthyr)

I thank the Member for raising that matter. Fortunately, the Deputy Minister for Transport is here, and he'll be writing to you. I would encourage you also to share any information that you have, and encourage any Member here to always share information where services need further attention from us as a Government.

Jayne Bryant (Labour, Casnewydd Islwyn)

Last week, I was glad to be joined by my Welsh Labour colleague Ken Skates at Llanwern steelworks in my constituency. Llanwern is strategically important to Wales and the whole of the UK, and it must not be lost in the wider debate on the steel industry. Steel making is in Newport's DNA, and it should have a proud future, but the workers that I spoke to last week were concerned about that future and that it's under threat from cheap galvanised steel imports. The Welsh Government must work with the UK Government to protect steel jobs in Wales and engage with the unions to support the workforce. So, Trefnydd, can we have a statement from the Welsh Government confirming that you will do everything in your power to ensure a sustainable future for the steel industry in Wales?

Heledd Fychan (Plaid Cymru, Pontypridd Cynon Merthyr)

Well, I thank the Member for raising an issue that is, of course, hugely important. You will be highly aware, I'm sure, that the Deputy First Minister, when she met with the new UK Prime Minister, Andy Burnham, over the summer, expressed this new Government's concerns about the lack of action taken by the Labour Government in not securing a future for steel in Wales and ignoring the steel industry here. Certainly, the Cabinet Minister for Enterprise, Connectivity and Energy is in the Chamber and has heard what you had to say, and, as always, we are more than willing to have discussions with local Members where necessary. But, unambiguously, I can say that we do see a future for the steel industry, and we do want to work with those who are concerned about this issue, and, of course, are constantly making the case at a UK level for the UK Government to give sufficient attention to the steel industry here in Wales.

Paul Davies (Conservative, Ceredigion Penfro)

Trefnydd, continuing on the theme of trains, I'd like to request a statement from the Deputy Minister for Transport on the delivery of rail services in west Wales. I'm regularly contacted by constituents from across Ceredigion Penfro who express concerns about the frequency, reliability and overall availability of rail services in the region. They want to see more regular and dependable train services operating across all rail lines in west Wales throughout the week, because for too long west Wales has not received the level of attention it deserves when it comes to rail connectivity and service delivery, and I believe there should be a review of rail provision in the region to assess whether current services are meeting the needs of local communities, and indeed to identify where improvements are required. Therefore, I'd be grateful if the Welsh Government could provide a statement outlining what steps it intends to take to improve the delivery, frequency and reliability of rail services in west Wales so that we can understand how it plans to address the long-standing concerns of passengers in Ceredigion Penfro.

Heledd Fychan (Plaid Cymru, Pontypridd Cynon Merthyr)

I thank the Member for raising those issues. Dirprwy Lywydd, of course, every Member will have heard previous statements, including statements on priorities, including those from the Deputy Minister for Transport. We too share that vision in terms of ensuring that public transport is available in every part of Wales, and that vision includes the work in train to look at that provision. As that work continues, the Deputy Minister will be providing updates to the Senedd and will, of course, be very willing to engage with Members, who will want to make the case for their constituencies.

Andrew Griffin (Reform UK, Gwynedd Maldwyn)

Trefnydd, we just heard questions to the Counsel General about the legal position surrounding health service reconfiguration. Last week, Powys Teaching Health Board decided to press ahead with consultation on proposals that could remove in-patient beds from a number of our community hospitals. There is considerable concern across Powys and many of us are far from convinced that the voices of local people or their elected representatives are being heard. Will you therefore arrange for an urgent statement from the Cabinet Minister for Health and Care setting out the Government's position, what discussions he has had with the health board, and, crucially, whether he is prepared to intervene?

Heledd Fychan (Plaid Cymru, Pontypridd Cynon Merthyr)

I thank the Member for raising this issue. Clearly, it's an issue that was raised last week as well, and, as I outlined at that time, dealing with that initial engagement, that's what the health board is doing. No decisions have been made. And what I would ask every Member who has constituents who have been affected by the possibilities raised in this consultation to do is to become involved in the consultation, and to encourage others to engage, and to be clear that the health board has yet to make any decision on its clinical services plan.

Matthew Jones (Plaid Cymru, Sir Fynwy Torfaen)

Trefnydd, we know that many people were preparing for surgery when they heard, by word of mouth or by social media, that their surgeries under the Welsh Gender Service had been paused during the Senedd's summer recess. One of my constituents was actually in hospital for surgery when they were told that their operation was cancelled, with no further support provided since then. You'll know that I've written, with other Members, to the NHS Wales Joint Commissioning Committee, who were responsible for this decision, asking about the evidence that informed this decision, the lack of communication with patients, and how patients' voices were not heard.

I know that this decision was made by a medical body, rather than a political one, but I'd like to request a statement outlining how the Government will ensure that this community will be listened to, how their concerns will be central to any further decisions made about trans healthcare, and how they will be supported. Diolch.

Heledd Fychan (Plaid Cymru, Pontypridd Cynon Merthyr)

I thank the Member for raising such an important matter. I'm sure that many of us will have heard from friends, from constituents, who've been impacted, and have heard about the very powerful impact that this has had.

Heledd Fychan (Plaid Cymru, Pontypridd Cynon Merthyr)

Please be assured that this Government stands with the trans community and will continue to protect and promote trans rights in line with our commitment to a welcoming and inclusive Wales. Members will be aware that a debate is tabled tomorrow by Anthony Slaughter. There will be an opportunity then to ask questions of the Cabinet Minister for health, and he will also be responding in full then.

Laura Anne Jones (Reform UK, Sir Fynwy Torfaen)

To be fair, you, like me, Trefnydd, have been an advocate for ensuring children and young people get to school safely and happy, and I'm sure that you'll agree with me that the first priority of governments at every level should be to protect children's and young people's well-being and not leave them anxious and worried. This policy of getting as many pupils as possible onto public buses rather than school buses is majorly flawed. It may work in urban areas, but it certainly doesn't work in rural areas, where routes like the Usk to Monmouth are long and winding, with national speed limit roads. Children packed in like sardines, standing for 40 minutes, is just not acceptable, and I'm sure you'll agree with that. But, sadly, this was the case in Monmouthshire on the first day of term, with multiple parents and pupils contacting me, with issues—similar issues, actually—flagged all over Monmouthshire and Torfaen. How can we possibly be in a situation where children have to have their own seat and even wear a seat belt for school trips, but this is acceptable?

Cost-cutting exercises by councils—and we all know they're strapped for cash—should never come at the expense of children's safety and well-being. Trefnydd, on that note, I would like to request an urgent statement from the Cabinet Minister responsible as to when this policy will be reviewed to ensure all children and young people get to school safely, on time and ready to learn. Diolch.

Heledd Fychan (Plaid Cymru, Pontypridd Cynon Merthyr)

I thank the Member for raising this issue. It is a very live issue as part of our discussions as a Government. It's a cross-portfolio issue. I'm pleased that the Deputy Minister for Transport is here. We have had discussions even this week, as Ministers, looking at the impacts in terms of barriers to people's access to education, and that does affect how much money families have too. This is a very live issue. The work is ongoing. As there are updates, the Deputy Minister will, of course, engage with Members of the Senedd who are concerned about this issue.

Darren Millar (Conservative, Clwyd)

Trefnydd, can I call for a statement from the Cabinet Minister for Enterprise, Connectivity and Energy on access to banking services in Wales? I appreciate that banking is not a devolved matter, but banking services really do matter to people across the country, particularly in communities that don't have access to a bank. I've been blessed in my own constituency to have two banking hubs, which are serving the communities of Abergele and Prestatyn, but there are other communities, places like Llangollen that lost its last bank a couple of years ago, that don't have a bank present. At the moment, the FCA, the Financial Conduct Authority, simply do assessments of access to cash, rather than access to banking services.

Shortly after the election, the UK Government did announce a review of access to banking services. That consultation finished over the summer. I wonder whether the Welsh Government has made a submission to that about the particular circumstances in Wales, particularly given our rurality, to make sure that people have access to these vital services. If it hasn't, is there any way we can work together to make sure that we make a call and a demand for legislation in this area, to ensure that banking services are available?

Heledd Fychan (Plaid Cymru, Pontypridd Cynon Merthyr)

Thank you. I'm sure that you're not the only one and I know that we've been part of campaigns in the past when banks have been at risk, and have seen the impact when they have gone from those places, and what impact that has then had on some of the most vulnerable residents or the oldest people in that society. This is also an issue that the Deputy First Minister and Cabinet Minister for Social Justice and Equality has been raising, because this is a social justice issue: ensuring those services. I am very pleased that the Cabinet Minister for Enterprise, Connectivity and Energy heard what you said just then. We will consider that, and I'm sure that the Minister will engage with you.

Lis McLean (Plaid Cymru, Pontypridd Cynon Merthyr)

Given the significant impact of storm Bert in November 2024, when the community centre in Aberfan and the leisure centre in Merthyr Tydfil opened their doors to support residents who had had to evacuate because of the destructive floods, many constituents across Pontypridd Cynon Merthyr are very concerned about the increasing risk of flooding over the coming winter. The Taff and Cynon rivers pose a serious threat to homes, businesses and community infrastructure. Given these concerns, I would like to ask for a statement from the Cabinet Minister for Rural Resilience and Sustainability outlining how the Welsh Government is strengthening Wales's preparedness for floods over the winter months. This should include details about current resilience planning, support at a community level, the readiness of infrastructure, and any additional measures being taken in order to safeguard areas that are at risk in our region. Given the scale of recent events, clarity and assurance for residents is crucial.

Heledd Fychan (Plaid Cymru, Pontypridd Cynon Merthyr)

I thank the Member for raising that issue, and it was spoken about earlier today in First Minister's questions. I should declare that I share a constituency with you and I have been a strong advocate of taking action in terms of supporting communities who face this continuing risk. I've seen the impact that this has, not just when the floods happen, but any time it rains heavily, and that continuing fear that people have that they are going to suffer further flooding and the impact that that will have on their day-to-day lives.

The Cabinet Minister for Rural Resilience and Sustainability will be making a statement in these next weeks about preparing for the winter. And certainly, what we have seen now, with this extreme weather, is that we have to do this work throughout the year, because one of the challenges that we have seen is that some of the storms happen earlier or later in the year, and that then that preparedness is needed. Certainly, that statement will be coming in the next few weeks. And I think, from what the First Minister said earlier today, that the work that we can do as each Member of the Senedd, in terms of supporting communities with that resilience and advocating for them, is incredibly important.

Carmelo Colasanto (Reform UK, Sir Gaerfyrddin)

I'm raising this as an MS for Carmarthenshire, but I need to declare that I am also the Chair of the Local Government, Housing and Planning Committee. Trefnydd, can I ask for a statement from the Welsh Government on nutrient neutrality and its impact on housing delivery in west Wales?

Following Natural Resources Wales's marine assessment and subsequent planning advice to councils last year, social and affordable housing schemes across Carmarthenshire and Pembrokeshire face significant delays. I have been contacted by one contractor who builds almost exclusively for affordable social housing, and he has an order book of £30 million-worth of secured work that has now stalled. Its turnover has halved, it supports approximately 80 staff and 320 subcontractors, from groundworkers and bricklayers through to merchants, plant hire firms and delivery drivers. Everyone accepts in this Chamber the need to protect our rivers and estuaries, but nutrient pollution comes from a wide range of sources across whole catchment areas. These delays are affecting both families waiting for homes and the firms ready to build them.

So, can we have a statement on what has replaced the marine nitrates development taskforce, what further mitigation measures are being considered, and when these housing schemes can realistically move forward? Thank you.

Heledd Fychan (Plaid Cymru, Pontypridd Cynon Merthyr)

I thank the Member for raising that issue. The Cabinet Minister for Local Government, Housing and Planning will have heard your calls and the issues that you've raised. And I will discuss with her the most appropriate way of responding to those, be that a statement or by correspondence.

Janet Finch-Saunders (Conservative, Bangor Conwy Môn)

I'd like to request two statements, one from the Cabinet Minister for Social Justice and Equality on how they are working with councils and the UK Government to prevent rogue builders and their ability to phoenix, which is starting up again after you've left people with incomplete builds and in lots of debt, and also on identity fraud, quishing and other scams that are taking place in north Wales, where it has emerged that there is a higher degree of scams now affecting our older constituents. I'm working with trading standards and the BBC, as north Wales does seem to be this key place where it's happening. The Federation of Master Builders Cymru have called on the Welsh Government to work alongside the UK Government to produce a mandatory licensing scheme for building companies. Will your Government support that?

And a second one from the Cabinet Minister for Health and Care on the parking provision at Ysbyty Gwynedd—and Ysbyty Glan Clwyd is just as bad. Patients and visitors are continuously struggling to find appropriate parking, despite driving around continuously for almost an hour sometimes, and sometimes they will actually accept that they're going to get a fine because otherwise they would miss that appointment. This has been going on for too long now, so we need something from the health Minister to say that he's accepting that this isn't adequate. Please help.

Heledd Fychan (Plaid Cymru, Pontypridd Cynon Merthyr)

Thank you. The points made by the Member are on the record. I'm not sure if there was a request for a statement on the second point that she raised, but certainly I will make the Cabinet Minister aware of the issue that you have raised. As always, if there are any specific examples that you want to raise, I would encourage you as a Member to raise those issues. I certainly know that Members representing other health boards have been raising concerns around parking in hospitals. So, it would be good to know about any problems so that we too can have those conversations with the health boards.

Jane Dodds (Liberal Democrat, Brycheiniog Tawe Nedd)

I want to continue on transport, if that's okay.

Jane Dodds (Liberal Democrat, Brycheiniog Tawe Nedd)

I want to ask about speed limit guidance, and it's great to have the Deputy Minister here. I've raised this repeatedly in the Senedd, because communities across Brycheiniog Tawe Nedd— Rhayader, Llanspyddid, Libanus, Cwmdu and others—have been waiting for many months and years for revised guidance on the speed limits. And we've had correspondence, and I understand it will be some time in 2027. But I just wonder if we could just be clearer and more specific, given that we represent communities—and it's not just me—who really need this speed guidance in order to ensure they're safe. Diolch yn fawr iawn.

Heledd Fychan (Plaid Cymru, Pontypridd Cynon Merthyr)

I thank the Member for raising that point. The Deputy Minister has heard what you've had to say. In terms of a more specific timetable, I don't have that information beyond what's already been shared with you, that is, that we do anticipate that the new guidance will be published in 2027. Officials are working with local government officers to update the guidance, and their feedback on the latest draft is being considered at the moment. So, that work is ongoing, and I thank you for raising the issue.

Cai Parry-Jones (Reform UK, Caerdydd Ffynnon Taf)

Trefnydd, I would like to call for a Welsh Government statement from the Minister for Finance regarding the Welsh rates of income tax during the Senedd term, in particular whether she has made any request to any civil servant on assessing the impact of an increase in taxes and what impact that would have on her finances.

Heledd Fychan (Plaid Cymru, Pontypridd Cynon Merthyr)

I thank the Member for the question. I would suggest that that type of question—. I didn't hear anything about a specific statement there. It was more of a scrutiny question, or a question for you to put to the Minister when you have that opportunity. But, certainly, the Cabinet Minister for Finance is present and she has heard what you've raised, and I'm sure you'll have an opportunity to discuss this further.

Peredur Owen Griffiths (Plaid Cymru, Casnewydd Islwyn)

Trefnydd, as vice-chair of the executive committee for the Urdd Eisteddfod in Bro'r Wenynen, I'm pleased to say that holding the Urdd Eisteddfod in Newport next year will be an important and historic moment for our area. It's an opportunity not only to welcome thousands of visitors, but also to introduce more families, young people and children to the Welsh language and our national culture.

On Saturday, the welcome festival will take place in the centre of Newport, and everyone is welcome to join us at the celebration. For me, the important thing will be the legacy left by the Eisteddfod. Can I therefore ask for a statement describing how the Government will work with the Urdd, local authorities, schools and community groups to ensure that the Eisteddfod has a permanent impact on the use of the Welsh language, and on confidence in terms of community use across Casnewydd Islwyn, and Bro'r Wenynen in its entirety?

Heledd Fychan (Plaid Cymru, Pontypridd Cynon Merthyr)

I thank the Member, and good luck to everyone who is involved in that welcome festival. And I look forward to attending Eisteddfod Bro'r Wenynen next year. As the Member has said, it will be an excellent opportunity for the area. And we know of the boost that comes to an area and its Welshness when Eisteddfod yr Urdd goes to that area.

Certainly, one of the things that I felt very frustrated about as an opposition spokesperson was that there was not enough planning being done in terms of legacy. And the assurance I'd like to give the Member, and every other Member, is that I and the Cabinet Minister for Education and the Welsh Language are having discussions at the moment about how to put that legacy framework in place in terms of the Urdd Eisteddfod and the National Eisteddfod, and you will have heard me speaking about other events across Wales.

There is investment, of course, from this Government going into that, and ensuring that that legacy work does not just fall on the very busy people who are currently fundraising for these eisteddfods, but that we can work with people such as the mentrau iaith on the ground to ensure that legacy, is very important. So, as that work continues, I will be very ready to share that with Members, and to take your ideas and input on board as well. Because these are important events. They do leave a legacy. But if we can have more of a legacy by planning more strategically, then that's where I and the Cabinet Minister for Welsh education want to reach.

John Clark (Reform UK, Bangor Conwy Môn)

Trefnydd, can I request a statement from the Cabinet Minister for Local Government, Housing and Planning on the extent of houses in multiple occupancy in Bangor Aberconwy Môn being used by Government-contracted organisations to house people via Home Office schemes? And what assessment has been made of the effect on local housing costs and supply for constituents on waiting lists, some of whom have been waiting for over a year?

Heledd Fychan (Plaid Cymru, Pontypridd Cynon Merthyr)

I thank the Member for raising this issue. Clearly, you are discussing an issue that is not devolved to this Senedd. If the Member wants contact details in order to raise any questions that he has in the most appropriate way, of course I would be happy to facilitate that. But, in terms of what is within the control of the Cabinet Minister, you are talking about an issue that is not devolved.

Kerry Ferguson (Plaid Cymru, Ceredigion Penfro)

Penultimately, David Mills.

David Mills (Reform UK, Brycheiniog Tawe Nedd)

Thank you, Deputy Presiding Officer. I'd like to call for a statement from the Cabinet Minister for Health and Care on the increasing prevalence of antisemitism in the healthcare sector. The Campaign Against Antisemitism is today publishing a groundbreaking documentary featuring patients and practitioners describing experiences, including Nazi salutes, antisemitic death threats and patients refusing treatment from Jewish doctors. There has been a meteoric increase in antisemitism over the last three years, and British Jews have been taking steps to conceal their Jewish identity. Whilst most evidence focuses on England, I'd be surprised if Wales were immune from this problem. So, can we have a statement outlining how the Welsh Government is monitoring antisemitism in our healthcare services, and what action is being taken to root it out?

Heledd Fychan (Plaid Cymru, Pontypridd Cynon Merthyr)

Thank you. Can I be very clear that antisemitism is something that we should all condemn? We should all work proactively to ensure that no-one is targeted in such a way and feels unsafe. The growth of antisemitism and hatred is something that should unite all of us in condemning and working hard within our communities to ensure that there is community cohesion and that nobody is targeted in such a way. The Deputy First Minister and Cabinet Minister for Social Justice and Equality leads on this work on behalf of the Welsh Government, though it's of course owned collectively by each of us, and the 'Anti-racist Wales Action Plan' is being reviewed to ensure that it's fit for purpose in light of the rise that we're seeing in antisemitism and hate crimes. Therefore, any Member here who is concerned about such issues, please engage with this work, because it's crucial that we work together.

Huw Thomas (Labour, Caerdydd Penarth)

Trefnydd, I would like a statement from the relevant Minister on the criteria used in allocating additional funding to support people living in poverty. A press release last week on emergency food and poverty support noted that funding would not be allocated on the basis of the number of people living in poverty, but, rather, that an additional percentage of the funding will be distributed according to how rural a community is.

Huw Thomas (Labour, Caerdydd Penarth)

There's a long-established formula for the distribution of such funding, and well-established processes for making changes to this formula. Your Government has torn that up via a press release, and I'm told councils are still waiting for details nearly a week after the announcement was made. I find it deeply concerning, without debate or scrutiny, that the Plaid Government would divert potential funding away from communities such as Ely, Caerau, south Riverside, Pentrebane, Grangetown, Butetown and Splott, despite the significant challenges of poverty faced by residents there. Surely there's consensus across this Chamber that the most effective way to target funding intended to alleviate poverty is to allocate it according to the levels of poverty and need. The Minister needs to urgently explain why she believes differently. Diolch yn fawr.

Heledd Fychan (Plaid Cymru, Pontypridd Cynon Merthyr)

Thank you. So the Member will be aware, the Cabinet Minister for Social Justice and Equality is the relevant Member; you asked at the start of your question who the relevant Minister was, so just to give you that assurance.

Could I make it clear? It has been unequivocal in terms of this Government that tackling poverty in all parts of Wales is a priority for us. Or entire programme for government, if you look at it, that cross-Government focus, in every portfolio, is entirely clear that tackling poverty is incredibly important and is something that we prioritise. The Member will also be aware, I'm sure, that there are problems in terms of rural poverty in particular that need to be tackled. Often, that has been something that has been hidden, and it's very important that the support that we provide in order to ensure that everyone, in all corners of Wales—. We know that, in every constituency, there are people living in poverty who should not be living in poverty, and that the last Labour Government's record was to increase the number of children living in poverty. That is why it is a priority for this Government to work across Ministers to get to the heart of the problem.

Kerry Ferguson (Plaid Cymru, Ceredigion Penfro)

Thank you very much, Trefnydd—16 questions covered in 29 minutes.

4. Statement by the First Minister: 'New Ambition for Wales: Programme for Government 2026-2030'

Kerry Ferguson (Plaid Cymru, Ceredigion Penfro)

We'll move on to our next item, a statement by the First Minister, 'New Ambition for Wales: Programme for Government 2026-2030'. I call on the First Minister, Rhun ap Iorwerth.

Rhun ap Iorwerth (Plaid Cymru, Bangor Conwy Môn)

In May, the people of Wales said clearly that they wanted a new level of ambition for our nation. Acting on the mandate to set our sights higher than previous Governments have done and forge a more hopeful future for Wales, I am today proud to publish our programme for government. 'New Ambition for Wales' builds on the foundations established during the Government’s first 100 days and sets out how we will deliver the priorities identified in our manifesto over the Senedd term.

This programme is built around the issues that matter most to people’s everyday lives: the sustainability of the health and care service; the cost of living; high-skilled, well-paid jobs; driving up standards in education; tackling child poverty and opening doors for young people; and standing up for Wales at every turn.

Rhun ap Iorwerth (Plaid Cymru, Bangor Conwy Môn)

For too long, the Welsh Government has been measured on the number of actions it takes and not the outcomes it delivers. That changes now. From now on, every action will have a clear purpose, namely to improve people’s lives. Prioritisation will be central to our approach. Effective government means focusing our efforts and resources on the areas where they can have the greatest impact, being clear about the outcomes that we want to achieve and being accountable for delivering them. That must always be the case, but it’s especially true at a time like this when resource is limited.

Rhun ap Iorwerth (Plaid Cymru, Bangor Conwy Môn)

Dirprwy Lywydd, for too long, silo working has stood in the way of progress. This new Government will work across traditional boundaries to address the greatest challenges facing our society. That is why prevention, productivity, the climate and nature emergency and the Welsh Language—Cymraeg—are embedded throughout every aspect of our programme. They are not separate priorities, they underpin every aspect of how we will deliver change and improve outcomes across Wales. They will shape the work of every Minister and every part of Government.

Rhun ap Iorwerth (Plaid Cymru, Bangor Conwy Môn)

At its heart, the aim of this programme is building a better future for Wales. Guided by the principles of the Well-being of Future Generations (Wales) Act 2015, we have brought together our well-being objectives and our programme for government into one single framework—a framework that sets out the future that we want to build and the actions that we will take to deliver it.

So, what does this mean in practice? It means prioritising the areas where we can have the greatest impact. A health and care service that is fit for the future is something that every Welsh citizen needs and deserves. This not only means taking immediate action to bring down waiting lists, which remain unacceptably high, but also ensuring that our most precious public service is sustainable and resilient for the future.

Rhun ap Iorwerth (Plaid Cymru, Bangor Conwy Môn)

We'll rebalance resources towards the prevention of ill health, better access to services and improved social care. We want a future where preventing ill health is given the same priority as treating illness, where services are designed around people and communities, and where every part of Government works together to improve health and well-being. And as the cost-of-living crisis continues to bite and global headwinds threaten further volatility in coming months, my Government will help households make ends meet.

At a time when many families are facing significant financial pressures, we will take action to make everyday life more affordable. Central to that effort is our transformative new childcare offer, which will help families with the cost of living, support parents into work and training and make a significant contribution to tackling child poverty. We will also tackle one of the biggest pressures on household budgets by improving access to affordable and secure housing, including through our commitment to deliver at least 20,000 additional social homes by 2030.

Rhun ap Iorwerth (Plaid Cymru, Bangor Conwy Môn)

Last week, my colleague the Cabinet Minister for Finance announced a 30 per cent cut to business rates for the leisure and hospitality sectors. This decision was widely welcomed by the industry, and it reflects this Government's determination to give people practical support in challenging times. This, of course, is inherently linked to our aim to unleash the potential of Wales's economy and to create high-skilled jobs that pay well.

Rhun ap Iorwerth (Plaid Cymru, Bangor Conwy Môn)

Our ambition for Wales rests on a flourishing economy that fuels our public services, creates fulfilling and rewarding jobs, and provides the foundation for a stronger future. Through our productivity mission, we'll work to halve the productivity gap with the rest of the UK within 10 years. We'll also establish a new national development agency to help Welsh businesses to grow, innovate and create good jobs. Every part of the Government has a role to play in growing the Welsh economy.

Dirprwy Lywydd, every child and young person deserves the opportunity to fulfil their potential and succeed in the future. But they've been failed by previous administrations whose lack of ambition has left Wales languishing at the bottom of league tables.

Rhun ap Iorwerth (Plaid Cymru, Bangor Conwy Môn)

That is why the Cabinet Minister for Education and the Welsh Language has already published a new literacy and numeracy plan and has set clear national expectations to raise standards and help every learner to succeed.

Rhun ap Iorwerth (Plaid Cymru, Bangor Conwy Môn)

We cannot and will not accept that this is as good as it gets for our education system. We owe it to the next generation to match their hopes and aspirations for the future with a new level of ambition never before determined by any Welsh Government. That commitment to improving the lives of our young people is just as relevant to their formative years. Years of flawed strategies and unfocused spending by previous administrations, compounded by destructive austerity policies pursued by Westminster, have left child poverty levels stubbornly high. Getting to grips with this is both a moral imperative and a defining mission of this Government.

Rhun ap Iorwerth (Plaid Cymru, Bangor Conwy Môn)

Neither family income nor the circumstances of a child's birth should ever determine their future. A Wales where every child can thrive is a Wales where opportunities are available for all, and where every community is stronger. That's why, through this programme, we will act across Government to break the cycle of poverty and create opportunities for every child in Wales.

Rhun ap Iorwerth (Plaid Cymru, Bangor Conwy Môn)

Finally, my Government will be unwavering and unapologetic in standing up for Wales and demanding fairness from Westminster at every turn.

Rhun ap Iorwerth (Plaid Cymru, Bangor Conwy Môn)

We believe in our nation, and we will take every step possible to unlock its potential and build a stronger, fairer and more resilient Wales. We will continue to make the case to the UK Government for the funding, the investment and the powers that Wales needs to thrive. As such, I look forward to meeting with the Prime Minister at the National Economic Council next month.

Rhun ap Iorwerth (Plaid Cymru, Bangor Conwy Môn)

Underpinning all of this is our determination to deliver through better Government. Better Government means focusing on what matters most, working across traditional boundaries and ensuring that our efforts make a real difference. We're also committed to being open and transparent about our progress. We will strengthen our use of evidence and data, learning always from what works. Dirprwy Lywydd, after years of missed opportunities and stagnation, we are getting Wales moving.

Rhun ap Iorwerth (Plaid Cymru, Bangor Conwy Môn)

By focusing on what matters most to the people of Wales, working together and taking a long-term approach, we can build a more confident nation that is ready to fulfil its wealth of untapped potential and give people hope for the future.

Helen Jenner (Reform UK, Bangor Conwy Môn)

Prif Weinidog, can I begin by thanking you for delivering your programme for government today? There's plenty in this programme that Reform can agree with. We want waiting lists down, we want standards in our schools to improve, we want better paid jobs, stronger businesses, and a health service that people can access when they need it. Where there is common ground, I will say so.

Reform went into the election supporting greater surgical and diagnostic capacity, stronger literacy and numeracy in schools, reform of the additional learning needs system, more vocational opportunities for young people and a stronger future for family farms up and down the country. But the real test of this programme is not how many promises are made today, it's whether we can come back to this Chamber in a year, two years and four years from now and measure whether anything has actually improved.

Helen Jenner (Reform UK, Bangor Conwy Môn)

Holding you to account is our responsibility as an effective opposition. Take the NHS. You're promising up to 10 surgical hubs, more diagnostic capacity, stronger clinical pathways and up to 100 more general practitioners. Those are ambitious commitments and people will expect this Government to deliver them. So, my first question is this: by the end of this Senedd term, how much lower should the overall waiting lists be, when will those surgical hubs be operating at full capacity and how many additional patients will they treat? Give us the baseline. Give us the target. Give us the date. Then, this Senedd can hold you to it.

The same applies to education. Your programme says that raising literacy and numeracy is one of the most urgent challenges facing our schools. I would agree. It also accepts the problems around persistent absence, behaviour and the pressure on the additional learning needs system. I welcome the fact that the Government recognises those problems, but recognition is the easy part. Schools cannot employ additional support with warm words, and local authorities cannot satisfy the growing demand for support with another review.

So, my second question is this: what improvement in attendance, literacy and numeracy should we expect to see by 2030, and what additional resource will actually reach the schools and councils to make the ALN system sustainable? Again, put the numbers against it. Parents and teachers need to know what success looks like. We on these opposition benches need to know what your idea of success looks like.

There is a much clearer political difference between us on the economy. This Government wants new agencies, commissions and programmes. Reform went into the election offering a different approach. We want lower taxes, better roads, stronger infrastructure and a Government that makes it easier for businesses to invest and grow here in Cymru. Your programme talks about productivity and good jobs. Fine. Productivity can be measured. Pay can be measured. Economic inactivity can be measured. Business creation can be measured. So, my third question is this: which economic measure does the First Minister want us to judge him by in 2030, and what target is he setting himself? Because if the answer is that Wales will be more prosperous, that is not enough. We need to know what progress looks like in hard figures.

I will now move on to the areas on which Reform fundamentally disagrees. First Minister, your Government remains committed to a pathway to net zero by 2040. Reform does not support that devolved target. We put greater weight on affordability, energy security and nuclear power, including the economic opportunity through small modular reactors at Wylfa in north Wales, which did not feature at all in Plaid Cymru's election manifesto. In fact, there's not much talk of north Wales at all in your programme for government, which is extremely disappointing.

On farming, you intend to continue and refine the sustainable farming scheme. We campaigned for much more substantial reform, with food production taking precedence and bureaucracy taking a back seat, rather than form filling and farming by calendar, which risks driving livestock numbers down in Wales. Those are fair and genuine differences, and people can judge the outcomes for themselves.

I also want to address the constitutional section of this programme, because it goes well beyond asking Westminster for a fair funding settlement. You are establishing a new national commission for Wales. You want justice and policing devolved, welfare devolved, further powers over energy, broadcasting, water and the Crown Estate. And Government is formally asking for the power to determine the timing, question and process of an independence referendum. Plaid Cymru is entitled to argue for those things. Reform is equally entitled to oppose them. I will never accept the notion that you have to support independence and constitutional chaos to prove you believe in Wales.

First Minister, I'm interested in what works, not what fits an ideology. Being Welsh does not require supporting independence, and standing up for Wales does not require wanting to leave the United Kingdom. So, my fourth question is this: how much public money and civil service resource will be committed to this constitutional programme during this Senedd term, and what practical outcome will you use to show that the expenditure has improved people's day-to-day lives?

Your own well-being statement says that the programme for government will be reviewed every year, and that progress will be reported annually. Good. And those reports must contain enough hard information for this Senedd and the public to judge whether you are delivering. By 2030, will people be waiting less time for treatment? Will children be attending school more regularly and achieving better results? Will wages and productivity be higher? Will businesses have confidence and invest in Wales? Will Welsh farmers be unshackled from burdensome red tape and incentivised to increase food production? I'm asking you to tell us what success looks like in numbers and time frames. Set the measures now, publish them every year, and then we will see whether this Government delivers what it has promised. Diolch yn fawr.

Rhun ap Iorwerth (Plaid Cymru, Bangor Conwy Môn)

Thank you for those comments.

Rhun ap Iorwerth (Plaid Cymru, Bangor Conwy Môn)

I'm grateful to the leader of Reform for agreeing that we are getting our priorities right in this programme for government and pledging to work in a co-operative way to help us deliver. That's exactly how I think we should operate here.

The Member is quite right that we need a Government that is willing and wants to be held to account. Scrutiny is important. That is why we have already published the first iteration of our digital dashboard. It will develop, it will grow, enabling you, and the Welsh public, to see how we are performing against a range of targets. Yes, and of course we have elements of targets throughout our programme for government.

There are some things that we have done already. We don't need a target to say that we will deliver that £1 billion that shows Welsh agriculture that this is a Government that believes in them and wants to support them. These are actions already taken. We don't need to set a target for how much funding we think needs to go into the health service. We've already taken those actions.

But the Member is quite right, so let's have a look at a number of the really key targets. We couldn't be clearer about what the childcare offer means. We have already been able to get to a point where the outcome at the end of this financial year is the roll-out of 12.5 hours of funded childcare for every two-year-old in every part of Wales. That's something the previous administration singularly failed to do. They got up to three. We're getting up to 22.

On education, interestingly, the work that we need to do—you have a background in education—is find a baseline from which we then are able to build. There will be targets around elements such as the Programme for International Student Assessment, which is only one measure, but we absolutely are putting those baselines in place so that we can build exactly that framework around which schools and parents and pupils know what they're aiming for.

There's a question about productivity. What are our targets on productivity? The Cabinet Minister for enterprise has literally published the first proper target for economic growth in Wales for a quarter of a century. It’s pretty ambitious, but I know that we have got the means to get there. It is, as it happens, not within the life of this Senedd, because we have to think long term about the economy. This is halving the productivity gap with the rest of the UK within 10 years. Now, that is a significant target, and throughout the term of this Senedd and beyond, as a nation, we need to be working towards those kinds of ambitious targets.

So, the targets are there. The differences that the Member emphasised are ones that are clear for everybody to see: that Reform do not believe in Wales as a nation, that we are a nation that builds our own future. That is my belief. I believed in devolution in 1997, when we had the chance to vote. I believed in strengthening it when we had the referendum in 2011. I believe we need to strengthen it further. What we have from the leader of Reform is a blanket ‘no’: ‘We do not want Wales to have the tools. We do not want Wales to be able to succeed by having the powers or the finances in order to build a better future for Wales.’ That is fine, that is a fundamental difference between us. I'll be the one here standing up for Wales. She can do as she pleases.

Ken Skates (Labour, Fflint Wrecsam)

First Minister, can I also thank you for your statement today and congratulate you on publishing your programme for government? This, of course, is the first non-Welsh Labour-led programme for government this Senedd has seen, and we aim to respond to it in a dignified manner, putting the people that we serve and represent first, and of course working in common cause where and when we can. I look forward to working constructively on legislation in particular.

Now, governing, as I believe you recognise, is hard, and we do not intend to make your task unnecessarily harder, but we do represent in our party a great Welsh tradition with deep bonds of solidarity across Britain on the basis that we achieve more together than we can achieve alone. And our role in this Chamber is to stand up for the most vulnerable and to be a voice for those who don't have inherited wealth and privilege, but who graft and work for a better tomorrow. We were therefore disappointed that one of the first things this Plaid Cymru Government did was to water down its offer on free school meals. Plaid Cymru promised in its first 100 days document to commit to expanding free school meals to all secondary school pupils in households claiming universal benefit from September of this year. But by June, of course, just weeks after the election, you stated that this year it would only be available to parents of children in years 7 and 8. No date, indeed, has been given for extending this to years 9, 10 and 11.

Now, Bevan said that socialism is the language of priorities, and one of your first decisions was that you decided that keeping an election promise to some of our poorest children was not a priority. When over £300 million of ALN consequentials came to Wales, again you decided that the most vulnerable children were not a priority and not a penny was allocated to them. Welsh Labour had published plans in Government and in our manifesto for a negotiating body for school support staff, and despite the Senedd voting in favour of it, your Government has refused to commit to supporting school support staff on this.

Now, First Minister, you told traditional Labour voters in your election campaign that you were a safe pair of hands for progressive voters, and yet your group is now welcoming right-wing Reformers. And in your first decisions on education and opportunity for everyone, you've prioritised expanding Welsh Labour's childcare offer to millionaires. First Minister, can I ask you today to commit that your policies in this programme for government will not result in the removal or reduction in support aimed at working class or vulnerable children, such as Flying Start?

Turning to healthcare, under this Plaid Cymru Government, both overall waiting lists and two-year waiting lists are rising again, having fallen for 10 months in a row under Welsh Labour. Before the election, you promised that, within months, the number of people waiting for more than two years would be zero. Can you confirm that the priorities that you set out in this programme for government will not see you renege on another promise—a promise, not just an ambition, that we will see two-year waits reduced to zero within months? And can you confirm how many months that will be?

Weeks before the election—in an attempt, obviously, to get Wales's trade union movement on side—you also wrote to Cwm Taf health visitors supporting their call to upgrade all band 6 health visitors to band 7. Ministers, again, have reneged on this promise, and health visitors rightly feel betrayed. So, can I ask you, First Minister, will you now make good on your promise to these workers and to Unite the Union?

Others who will feel ignored and betrayed by this programme for government are the people of north Wales, as Helen Jenner has already identified, specifically those in Flintshire and Wrexham, because as Wrexham.com have observed, for north-east Wales, a notable feature is absence. It's as though parts of Wales are already being left behind. Standing up for Wales means uniting the people of Wales, not seeking a course of action that will divide Wales, divide the nation, divide our families and divide our communities, as Brexit did. Standing up for Wales means taking action to improve Wales, not producing a plethora of plans.

It's not too late, though. It's not too late. I ask you, finally, First Minister, to work with us in the spirit that you campaigned, in the spirit not only of constructive politics, but also progressive politics, because when the people of Wales are prioritised, I can assure you that you will find in us a willing and constructive partner.

Rhun ap Iorwerth (Plaid Cymru, Bangor Conwy Môn)

I thank the Labour leader for beginning his contribution in a positive way. Governing is hard, as he knows. There has never been a majority in the history of devolution, and we recognise that we need to work across this Chamber in many ways, including through the development of legislation, which he suggested he wants to work with us on.

Unpicking a bit more some of the points that were raised there—on the NHS, it was and is priority No. 1. This is a Government that has already made choices, including on a budget deal with the last Labour Government, to ensure that we have the resources to make sure that we build a more sustainable future for the NHS. We begin now from the point of the legacy that we inherited from the last Labour Government. Data is just coming through now from the time of the election and the weeks following that, and, yes, it confirms how dire the situation is that we are trying to resolve. But through the measures outlined in this programme for government, building towards the introduction of up to 10 hubs, a change in emphasis in terms of the work patterns of doctors—this is clinically led, remember, to free up time, to get more people through the system—the injection of £150 million, some of it clinical, some of it on the actual buildings themselves, which will be the home of a sustainable NHS for the future, we stand firm by the pledges that we have made and in making this a priority.

On this element of somehow north Wales not being mentioned in this programme for government, I come from even further north than he does, and this is a Government—and I have made it clear—that isn't about the tokenism of having a north Wales Minister; every single Minister in this Government is a north Wales Minister and a south Wales Minister and a west Wales Minister, because we believe in bringing Wales together and building a brighter future for people, wherever they are. And to attack the first north Wales First Minister for somehow not caring about the north isn't something that people are going to even believe makes sense, frankly.

I come back to additional learning needs and remind the Member again that he had £9 million that Labour were going to put into something that we consider to be very important; we're glad that he does too. We had £100 million on the table; we have £40 million that we can spend this year. That is what this party put on the table, seriously, in a way that isn't just money but is money that can be spent—money that can be spent to make a real difference to councils, to schools, to parents, to children. The offer is still very much available. This has to be about more than politics.

And I will end, if I may, on this attack, which I've heard mentioned and read about it in the paper—and I was thinking, 'Surely, he's not going to make this accusation here in the Senedd Chamber'—that the childcare offer is something that he objects to in its universality. So, suddenly, the Labour Party objects to the universality that provides bus passes for pensioners, so we can assume that Labour wants to take away bus passes for pensioners, we can assume that they're against the universality of free prescriptions. Can we start thinking that also they want the universality of the NHS, even, to be taken away from people? Is he happy to create a two-tier system where rich people are to be supported to go off into private healthcare, or does he, like me, believe that the more we can build together—yes, including that principle of universality—binds us together as a nation and gives us solutions for the long term that address the needs of people in all parts of Wales from all backgrounds?

We have here a programme for government that is about transforming Wales, and I guess the point to make on governing being difficult is that government is difficult, especially when you inherit a broad range of issues that don't put us off, that don't make us diminish our ambitions, but make us work harder to deliver them for the people of Wales.

Darren Millar (Conservative, Clwyd)

It's always interesting watching a messy divorce—[Laughter.]—and, my goodness, has it been an untidy one.

Can I thank you, First Minister, for advance notice of your statement, although not quite as in advance as the Western Mail's notice of your statement today, which seemed to have more detail than any Member of this Senedd prior to the release of it at 9.34 a.m. this morning? I'm afraid to say, again, a bit of a sense of déjà vu, a lot of recutting and rehashing of your manifesto, recutting and rehashing of your 100-day plan, and there's only so much rehashing that you can do with the same sorry document so many times to try and polish what many people would describe as something that I won't refer to. Because that, I'm afraid, is what many people will see it as.

I have to say that I was listening carefully to the radio this morning, as you found out in First Minister's questions today, and Laura McAllister referred to your 100-day plan as a 'gimmick'—I agree with her, and it's not always that I agree with Laura McAllister, but I agree with her on that. And now, of course, the rubber needs to hit the road in terms of getting some delivery for the people of Wales. And it's not going very well so far, is it? Waiting times up, PISA scores down, your grandstanding on independence really not making much of a difference, no matter how loud you scream. Now, I will say that, look, there is a lot of ambition in this document that we on the Conservative benches share—we want to see a more prosperous Wales, we want to see a better educated Wales, we want to see a healthier Wales; we want to see all of those things—but I'm afraid that it's lighter on detail than I would like in terms of the availability to deliver on those things.

Let me just turn to the NHS for a second, because I'm very concerned about the NHS, as are you, and I know that it's something that is close to your heart. You referenced the climate emergency and the nature emergency; you didn't seem to reference a crisis in the NHS, which I'm afraid it is, and many people perceive it as such. One thing that we do know is that that crisis is largely caused, according to the clinicians themselves, and according to the royal colleges, including the Royal College of Nursing, which was here last week in the Senedd, as a result of the beds situation in our NHS. There simply aren't enough beds. The Labour Party was disastrous in terms of its management of the NHS; I agree with you on that. They cut the number of beds too far, too fast, and people now are paying the consequences.

Just over the last three years, I am told by the Royal College of Nursing, 21 per cent of acute surgical beds have gone in the Welsh NHS, a fifth of our capacity. Thirteen per cent of acute medical beds have gone. It's no wonder that our emergency departments can't find the beds in those hospitals when patients need them. You didn't reference that situation. I want to know what are you going to do to surge those beds in the short term to fix that issue. Because let me tell you: you create surgical hubs, you need beds for people to go into after they're recovering from surgery, particularly if something goes wrong. So, I want to know what are you doing on that front.

You also suggested that there's going to be a switch in the way that the NHS is funded, with more going to primary care. Now, I want more money to go into our primary care services, but I don't want it to be to the detriment of hospital care. What assurances can you give me today, First Minister, and the people of Wales, that you won't be cutting funding to our hospitals in Wales in order to compensate for that extra investment in primary care? Because we need to know.

You referenced the cost of living. I agree with you that we need action on that. That's why I raised the need to do something on council tax today in First Minister's questions. We need action to extend free childcare. We had a free childcare plan as well, and we'll support you to be able to try to deliver some more free childcare. Ours was slightly different; we wanted more parental choice so that grandparents could look after their children too, and that was better for the taxpayer in terms of cost. But I want to know what you're doing to cut taxes. Can you cut some taxes for us? A penny off income tax. Is it not possible to shave some money off the budget where we've got waste, where we've got largesse, so that we can put money back into people's pockets so that they can decide how to spend it in the economy themselves?

You referenced in your document—. By the way, when the statement came through, I clicked on the well-being link. It didn't work. I hope that's not an omen for the future in terms of whether you'll be able to deliver things. I eventually got around to finding the right link. You talked in there about the desire to allow people to buy their own community assets. I support that; we'll support you with that. I want people to be able to buy their own home. I want stamp duty gone. I want the right to buy back. I want to bring empty homes back into use. There's insufficient detail on those things in your plan.

I've got all sorts of other things that I'd like to discuss, but the clock's against me. Let me say this: if you're able to deliver on your ambitions, many of them which we support, we will try to work collaboratively with you. It might be difficult. There may be some stumbles along the way, but we're prepared to reach out on a cross-party basis, and it was good to hear the same message coming from Reform as well, to try to make Wales a better place. But be under no illusions: we want to see a Wales where there are lower taxes, where there's an end to wasteful spending, where there's less emphasis on the grandstanding and more emphasis on the day-to-day jobs and using those powers and resources that you already have in your armoury to deliver a better future for our country.

Rhun ap Iorwerth (Plaid Cymru, Bangor Conwy Môn)

Diolch yn fawr iawn. Again, the common ground that we have, and I also take a real positive from the fact that we have three party leaders now who say that they want to work positively and constructively. It won't be on everything—there are differences between us, we know that—but there's that positive sense here that there are elements of the work that we do in this place, from legislation to budgets and all sorts of other things, where we need to work together.

I must say that the accusation that somehow this is a rehash of our manifesto, that you have a manifesto, you stand in an election, you get elected, you have a mandate, and somehow then you tear up the manifesto and start again—. That's not how it works. That's not how it works. If this feels like our manifesto, as in if this feels like that it reflects what we promised the people of Wales that we would do, with the priorities on health and education and job creation and childcare and child poverty and standing up for Wales, it's doing its job, so thank you very much for confirming that, Darren.

You also criticise—. I get it; scrutiny includes criticism. I honestly say, on health, we face an uphill struggle because we inherit some serious issues, not all of which are the fault of the last Government, but that is what we inherited.

On PISA, don't criticise us on PISA scores. Those PISA tests were taken in 2025, before we came into power. But it does, of course, reflect again the scale of the challenge that we face.

The Member focuses, in particular, on health, and, yes, it is something that is important to me, but it's important to all of us here, I think, getting the NHS right. The Member's party has often made the case that we should declare a crisis. I do certainly believe that there's a crisis in many parts of the NHS. I'm not convinced that a declaration of crisis in that kind of way is particularly useful. There are suggestions there that we should have more about beds here. I have made the case for making sure that we maximise the capacity of our health system in the past, but it's not quite that simple either. Our surgical hubs—most of the people that will go through surgical hubs will be going home the same day. Also, in my local district general hospital, it's not a lack of beds; it's the lack of throughput and the number of people. It's the same wherever we are. The numbers of people who are medically fit for discharge and who are still in our hospitals, those are the issues. Should we have an ambition to absolutely grow where we can, including bed capacity, with the staff to go with them? Yes, absolutely. But we're also working within constraints. Remember that the plans that we have put in place and that are reflected in this document are clinically led, and they're not telling us what we need is more beds—they're saying we need a number of steps to be taken. But I'm not dismissing the point that the Member is making.

On the shift of resource towards primary—and I include preventative, I guess, in that, though preventative is a little bit different too—the Member's right that you have to be careful. We're not suggesting going in one leap. We're talking about 0.5 percentage point per year of an increase. But it happens in a slow and sustainable way because you don't want a detrimental impact on secondary care, which, in many ways, is the expensive end of the health service. And getting those waiting lists down, the higher waiting times in particular, takes then the pressure, hopefully, off secondary care, which helps then that transition to primary care.

The leader of the Conservative group says that there's a lot of ambition in this document that we share. That's good. So, let's work on those areas. The same invitation goes to Members in other parties. This is about ambition, as it says, but, at the end of the day, we're going to be measured on whether we are able to realise, if not 100 per cent, the thrust of what we say we're going to try to achieve on behalf of the people of Wales here.

Sera Evans (Plaid Cymru, Afan Ogwr Rhondda)

Thank you for your statement, First Minister. It's great to see that raising standards in our schools continues to be one of this Government's key aspirations. And I believe that this was also clear from the statement made by the Cabinet Minister for Education and the Welsh Language last week. The foundational literacy and numeracy plan offers a golden opportunity to get the infrastructure right. There's little doubt that the process of implementation and of delivering better results will be a major challenge. But, as the Cabinet Minister said last week, we must not apologise for setting our standards and our expectations high. There is a clear timetable for completing this task and it is an ambitious programme.

It comes at a time when schools are already dealing with increasingly complex pupil needs, concerns regarding student behaviour, teachers' workload, and challenges in recruiting and retaining staff. Bearing in mind the plan's importance and our aspirations for education, what further support will the Welsh Government be providing to teachers and to staff more broadly during this Senedd term in order to ensure that they receive the appropriate support to deliver this plan?

Rhun ap Iorwerth (Plaid Cymru, Bangor Conwy Môn)

Thank you very much for those comments and for that question. Yes, this is one of our key priorities. Standards in our schools aren't where, I think, all of us in this place can agree that they should be. The new literacy and numeracy framework, I think, will turn out to be something very valuable in taking a new view as to how we strengthen those fundamental skills. But the Member, Dirprwy Lywydd, refers to more than just what is taught in the classroom; it is about the support provided to staff too. We know that issues such as school attendance percentages and behaviour in schools are all part of the factors that create pressures on teaching staff. Those issues are very interconnected, and are often tied in to poverty and disadvantaged backgrounds and so on. But what we intend to do is to bring different agencies together—the schools, health and care services, youth services and so on—in a framework that's properly integrated in order to tackle these problems in a holistic manner, which is something that has, perhaps, been missing in the past.

Benjamin McKenna (Reform UK, Afan Ogwr Rhondda)

During the election campaign, the First Minister said that the election was not about independence and that it would not be a priority during this Senedd term. Then, last week, he signed a joint statement with Sinn Féin and the SNP saying that Westminster's time was at an end. And now, today, in the programme for government that was published, it lists in the section of devolved powers the desire to pursue the devolved power to hold an independence referendum in Wales. Given the First Minister's comments during the election and then his comments today about his determination for an honest politics, I'd like to ask: what's changed between now and then?

Rhun ap Iorwerth (Plaid Cymru, Bangor Conwy Môn)

Well, nothing's changed. I believe in Wales being able to pursue its future as a normal country. I believe in independence for Wales. I think everybody knows that. Our manifesto stated clearly that we believe that the shape of our constitutional future should be in the hands of the people of Wales. I mean, I think that's a fundamental right, and that is precisely what we're saying, in that we should be the ones, as a Senedd, calling it, as the people of Wales, asking for it, who are able to set the timetable for this. Yes, I did say that the last election wasn't about independence, and I think I have had lots of opportunities to explain what I meant by that.

There's no referendum being pushed for by this Government now, but we absolutely believe that the people of Wales should be allowed to decide. I will use the influence that I have, hopefully, as Wales's leader, to try to persuade people to think about the challenges, the opportunities and what we might be able to do in future that we aren't able to do now. These paths are challenging and full of opportunity at the same time. The Commission on the Constitutional Future of Wales isn't an independence commission. It is about, 'How do we arm ourselves to make us, as a nation, fit for the future?'

Now, Reform, we know—we've heard it again today from your leader, and again, you're being honest about this—don't believe in giving us any more powers. You think we should settle as we are. You think that we should, at best, put what we have in aspic and just hope that somehow, through our actions as Governments, that we can make things better. I just don't see it in that way. I think, where there are things that all the evidence points to it making sense for us to have control over—policing, where we pay for most of it directly in Wales now, but have no accountability for it; justice, so that we can serve people better in constituencies all across Wales; so that we can make decisions about our natural resources—I just think that's common sense.

What the commission does is provide us a platform through which you can say you don't want it to happen, and I can say, and others, 'Do you know what? We should look at this and see how we can deliver this.'

Huw Thomas (Labour, Caerdydd Penarth)

First Minister, it's encouraging to see the first visible signs that this Government has a programme at last. Many who read the statement by the First Minister will have smiled to see the claim that the Government made a good start during its first 100 days. For many across Wales, however, a series of reviews and a series of postponed decisions felt like anything but progress.

Huw Thomas (Labour, Caerdydd Penarth)

More concerning, however, is the continued failure to prioritise funding to areas of genuine need. Many in Cardiff will have heard the Trefnydd's contemptuous dismissal of my question earlier today. We've heard claims from Plaid Cymru MSs in the past that the additional learning needs funding gap was less severe in Wales than elsewhere—comments that teaching unions quickly criticised as out of touch with the reality facing schools.

And last week, there was an appearance of going even further, with Government Ministers appearing to cast doubts on the future of Flying Start. Whether or not that suggestion proves accurate, it has caused significant concern among those people delivering and benefiting from the programme. Will the First Minister take the opportunity right now to provide clarity and guarantee that funding for Flying Start will continue, as well as the prioritisation of those most in need? Children in some of Wales's most deprived communities should not pay the price for the Government's failure to properly cost its election promises.

Rhun ap Iorwerth (Plaid Cymru, Bangor Conwy Môn)

To be open here, I was listening to the Trefnydd giving what the Member called a 'contemptuous' answer. What the Trefnydd said earlier was that she believed there was poverty in all parts of Wales that needed addressing. And I absolutely get—I absolutely get—the fact that the Member is standing up for the people of his constituency, as I would expect him to, but we have to, as a Government, recognise that we have urban poverty that we desperately need to get to grips with and we have rural poverty that we desperately need to get to grips with. In some instances, they're the same answers; in some instances, they're different answers. So, there's no contempt whatsoever there.

There's a specific question on Flying Start, and I have heard Labour Members raise questions about the future of Flying Start. We're somehow being accused of wanting to take money away from fighting child poverty when this is the party that has been criticised by his too often for wanting to spend too much on tackling child poverty through the childcare offer. This phase of the childcare offer is literally being delivered through Flying Start. This is building on what Flying Start has done. More families living in poverty, incidentally, are not in Flying Start areas than the ones that are in Flying Start areas. Both are really, really important. We want to help them all. I hope that's clear enough.