Scottish Parliament, 15 March 2023

144 contributions from 34 members. The official report.

Rural Affairs and Islands

Liam McArthur (Liberal Democrat, Orkney Islands)

Good afternoon, colleagues. The first item of business is portfolio question time, and the first portfolio is rural affairs and islands. I ask any member who wishes to pose a supplementary question to press their request-to-speak button during the relevant question.

Short-term Let Licensing (Impact on Rural Economy)

Graham Simpson (Conservative, Central Scotland)

1. To ask the Scottish Government what discussions the rural affairs secretary has had with ministerial colleagues regarding an assessment of the impact of short-term let licensing on the rural economy. (S6O-01996)

Mairi Gougeon (Scottish National Party, Angus North and Mearns)

I regularly engage

with colleagues on a variety of issues that affect our respective portfolios. In relation to short-term lets, the Scottish Government published seven impact assessments to accompany the licensing legislation, including a business and regulatory impact assessment and an island communities impact assessment.

The licensing scheme offers considerable flexibility to local authorities on how it is implemented. We recognise the challenges that businesses face at this time, which is why we have extended by six months—from 1 April to 1 October this year—the deadline for existing hosts to apply for a licence. We remain committed to monitoring the implementation of the scheme, and we will undertake a review in 2024.

Graham Simpson (Conservative, Central Scotland)

The Moffat Centre for Travel and Tourism Business Development has found that 77 per cent of operators feel that their business is threatened by the new licensing scheme. Rural businesses are struggling to keep afloat, and the regulations are making things worse. How is the cabinet secretary supporting owners of rural businesses who fear that they will have to close their business as a result of the legislation?

Mairi Gougeon (Scottish National Party, Angus North and Mearns)

I thank the member for raising that important point. Obviously, this work is being led by my colleague the Cabinet Secretary for Social Justice, Housing and Local Government. I will be happy to pick up those issues with her and get back to the member with a response.

We need to try to get the balance right. We should ensure that the scheme is flexible because it is, ultimately, for local authorities to implement the scheme in their own way. Monitoring of the scheme’s implementation is vital, and the review that will take place next year will be critical in that regard.

I am more than happy to raise those issues with my colleague.

The Deputy Presiding Officer

A number of members would like to ask a supplementary question. I would be grateful if the questions could be as brief as possible.

Alasdair Allan (Scottish National Party, Na h-Eileanan an Iar)

Short-term lets have contributed positively to our tourism industry, but high numbers of them can make it harder for people to find homes to live in. Data indicates that house prices in the Western Isles have risen by 135 per cent over the past 18 years. Given that such increases are likely to price young islanders out of areas that retain large numbers of second homes, does the cabinet secretary share my view that it is crucial to address those concerns?

Mairi Gougeon (Scottish National Party, Angus North and Mearns)

I do, and I thank the member for raising that issue, which is raised with me whenever I am out and about visiting rural parts of Scotland and our islands.

Local areas need to have the tools and powers to take action to address imbalances between tourism, second homes and residential housing that are causing problems for local communities and economies and affecting the sustainability of public services.

In addition to providing more than £43 million over the current parliamentary session to support the delivery of affordable housing in the Western Isles, we agree that action needs to be taken on second homes. That is why, with the Convention of Scottish Local Authorities, we are exploring proposals to give local authorities powers to increase council tax on second homes.

The Deputy Presiding Officer

I call Rachael Hamilton.

Rachael Hamilton (Conservative, Ettrick, Roxburgh and Berwickshire)

To ask the Scottish Government what its response is—

The Deputy Presiding Officer

Ms Hamilton, is this a supplementary question?

Rachael Hamilton (Conservative, Ettrick, Roxburgh and Berwickshire)

No. I am sorry.

The Deputy Presiding Officer

In that case, I call Willie Rennie. I will come back to Rachael Hamilton shortly.

Willie Rennie (Liberal Democrat, North East Fife)

I would welcome seeing the details of the plans on second homes.

I have been critical of the licensing scheme, which has been particularly burdensome, but I am a strong supporter of short-term let control areas. My frustration is that Fife Council says that it has to wait until the licensing scheme is in place, but it wants the local development plan to be developed in tandem with the implementation of control areas. Will the cabinet secretary and her colleagues have a discussion with Fife Council to encourage it to move a little bit faster?

Mairi Gougeon (Scottish National Party, Angus North and Mearns)

Yes. I am more than happy to raise that issue with colleagues.

Food Security

Rachael Hamilton (Conservative, Ettrick, Roxburgh and Berwickshire)

2. To ask the Scottish Government what its response is, regarding the implications for the food and drink supply chain in Scotland, to the National Farmers Union’s petition on improving food security. (S6O-01997)

Mairi Gougeon (Scottish National Party, Angus North and Mearns)

I fully agree with the National Farmers Union on the importance that it places on our food security and the need for the United Kingdom Government to have plans in place to deal with the UK’s security of food supply. I have raised repeatedly with the UK Government the critical issues that are impacting on the sector and the need for it to intervene to provide more support to the food and drink sector. I have also set up a food security unit in the Scottish Government to monitor supply chain vulnerabilities and strengthen food security and supply in Scotland.

Rachael Hamilton (Conservative, Ettrick, Roxburgh and Berwickshire)

Given the critical importance of food security in the current climate, will the cabinet secretary use the opportunity to revisit the benefits of genetic technology, which will enable Scotland’s farmers to sustainably grow food, lower their emissions, reduce the risks of a poor harvest and improve the health of the nation?

Mairi Gougeon (Scottish National Party, Angus North and Mearns)

I am sure that Rachael Hamilton is aware of our position on that. I have talked about the immediate concerns and some of the immediate issues that we face

, which are really important, and the action that we have taken in setting up the food security unit in the Scottish Government, which will monitor the on-going supply chain vulnerabilities that exist to ensure that we are not caught out again should there be further challenges. We have already been through the pandemic, Brexit and war in Ukraine, and we have seen the impact that they have had on our food supply. Therefore, we want to ensure that we have resilience.

The Deputy Presiding Officer

There are a couple of brief supplementary questions.

Jim Fairlie (Scottish National Party, Perthshire South and Kinross-shire)

Martin Kennedy said:

“we have a UK Government that wants to blame everyone except themselves for the current and impending food shortages.”

In a speech at the NFU conference, Minette Batters highlighted three areas that threaten to jeopardise the industry: labour shortages, the uncertainty that is posed by the phasing out of direct payments, and soaring energy prices. All those issues sit outside the Scottish Parliament’s remit. Does the cabinet secretary share my view that, if the Tories want to discuss food security, a good place to start would be to get the Department for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs secretary in front of the Rural Affairs and Islands Committee?

Mairi Gougeon (Scottish National Party, Angus North and Mearns)

Who the committee invites to give evidence will ultimately be a decision for it to take. Obviously, it is not for me to account for the actions of the secretary of state, but I absolutely agree that the food and drink sector has been beset by a wide range of issues arising from some of the things that I have mentioned—the pandemic, Brexit and the conflict in Ukraine, which is now having further impacts.

It is important to focus on the action that we have taken in Scotland to mitigate some of the impacts. Together with industry, I established a short-life food security and supply task force in March last year. The outcome of that work was a report that we published in June, in which we recognised that the UK Government ultimately holds many of the levers to address the cumulative issues that are impacting the sector, which Jim Fairlie has mentioned. Labour and skills shortages, rising costs and energy costs are among the most significant issues.

I have written repeatedly to the UK Government to highlight the need for it to intervene and provide vital support for the industry. I received a response only this week. We are still waiting for meaningful engagement and action to be taken.

Finlay Carson (Conservative, Galloway and West Dumfries)

Other than writing to the UK Government, given that the responsibility is largely down to the cabinet secretary, what has the short-term task force delivered, or what is it expected to deliver?

The Deputy Presiding Officer

You should be brief, cabinet secretary.

Mairi Gougeon (Scottish National Party, Angus North and Mearns)

I do not think that Finlay Carson could disagree with me about the fact that the issues that I have talked about are ultimately up to the UK Government. Ultimately, some of the biggest risks that the sector currently faces, such as energy costs and labour shortages, are the responsibility of the UK Government.

We recognise that we need to take action in Scotland. That is why I set up a task force. If Finlay Carson had listened to my response to the previous question, he would have heard me say that a direct outcome of that work has been the establishment of a food security unit in the Scottish Government.

All the recommendations in the task force’s report, which was published in June last year, have been completed.

The Deputy Presiding Officer

Kenny Gibson should be brief.

Kenneth Gibson (Scottish National Party, Cunninghame North)

Can the cabinet secretary advise what impact Brexit has had on the food and drink supply chain, most recently with the shortage of fresh fruit and vegetables?

The Deputy Presiding Officer

You should be as brief as possible, cabinet secretary.

Mairi Gougeon (Scottish National Party, Angus North and Mearns)

We know, of course, that there have been weather challenges in other parts of the world that have affected fruit and vegetables and the supply chain during the winter period in the UK. However, those have, of course, been exacerbated by the UK Government’s approach to Brexit. Scotland’s food and drink sector lost many of the benefits that we once had when we were trading with the European Union and were part of the single market.

The impact is clear and evident when we look at the figures. Many Scottish food industries continue to suffer from lower exports to the EU. We saw a 49 per cent fall in fruit and vegetable exports and a 15 per cent fall in dairy and egg exports in the first nine months of last year compared with the same period in 2019.

Proposed Agriculture Bill (Consultation)

Pam Gosal (Conservative, West Scotland)

3. To ask the Scottish Government whether it will provide an update on when its response to the agriculture bill consultation will be published. (S6O-01998)

Mairi Gougeon (Scottish National Party, Angus North and Mearns)

The Scottish Government is committed to introducing a new agriculture bill to Parliament this year. A public consultation on the proposed bill, which sought views on proposals to assist with delivering our vision for agriculture and the legislative framework that will be required to replace the current common agricultural policy from 2025-26 onwards, closed on 5 December. We are carefully considering the diverse range of views provided, and we aim to publish responses in the spring.

Pam Gosal (Conservative, West Scotland)

We will undoubtedly hear more about the plans for agricultural reform during this afternoon’s debate. Without pre-empting what the cabinet secretary might have to say about that in a few moments’ time, is she able to say whether the Scottish Government has made any assessment of the potential for existing proposals in the agricultural support package to reduce food production on productive land in favour of carbon sequestration measures? If the Government has not done so, does she accept that its failure to do so could jeopardise our nation’s food security?

Mairi Gougeon (Scottish National Party, Angus North and Mearns)

We are not jeopardising our nation’s food security. We need to be clear about the fact that, when it comes to what we introduce in our future framework, it is not a choice between food production and taking action for nature and the climate. Ultimately, it is a case of making our food production systems and our businesses more resilient to some of the changes that we know are coming down the line.

In this job, I am really fortunate in that I get to travel the length and breadth of Scotland to meet our farmers and producers and to see the action that they are taking on the ground in producing food in a way that works with nature and for the climate, and which, ultimately, will help to make businesses more sustainable, resilient and profitable. [

Interruption

.] We are keen to ensure that we enable that and that we enhance our activity in that area.

The Deputy Presiding Officer

Mr Carson, please desist from chucking comments across the front benches.

Emma Harper (Scottish National Party, South Scotland)

The industry has repeatedly told us how important it is that we get the new agricultural support system right, given the importance of the proposed bill and the Scottish Government’s commitment to listening to the sector.

Co-development, co-design and discussions with farmers and crofters are fundamental to that approach, which is in contrast to the shambles that the environmental land management schemes have caused south of the border. Does the cabinet secretary share my view that it is right that we take our time and that we need no lessons from the Tories when it comes to safeguarding the interests of farmers, crofters and growers in Scotland?

The Deputy Presiding Officer

Be as brief as possible, cabinet secretary.

Mairi Gougeon (Scottish National Party, Angus North and Mearns)

I will try to be as brief as possible. It is important to remember how vital it was that we committed to a period of stability and simplicity, and that we delivered on that commitment, to ensure that our farmers, crofters and land managers would continue to receive direct payments.

The work that the member touched on is vital. As we look to develop our future policy, we want to make sure that we do it right, in a way that works for the industry and for our farmers and crofters, so that we bring them along with us. It is critical that they help us to develop future policy. That takes a bit more time, but it is vital to ensure that we get the process right.

Agricultural Support

Joe FitzPatrick (Scottish National Party, Dundee City West)

4. To ask the Scottish Government when it last engaged with the United Kingdom Government regarding support available through future budgets to support agriculture in Scotland, including the replacement of European Union agricultural funding. (S6O-01999)

Mairi Gougeon (Scottish National Party, Angus North and Mearns)

EU exit means that we no longer have long-term certainty of funding. HM Treasury has provided yearly allocations for the current UK parliamentary session, but there is no funding commitment from 2025 onwards.

The UK Government promised full EU replacement funding and collective engagement on future funding, which was reaffirmed by previous secretaries of state.

The Scottish ministers raised the issue of replacement funding for the rural affairs and islands portfolio at prior meetings of the interministerial group for environment, food and rural affairs, as well as directly, and we continue to make representations to the UK Government that it should fulfil its commitments.

Joe FitzPatrick (Scottish National Party, Dundee City West)

Last Wednesday, the Rural Affairs and Islands Committee heard from members of the ARIOB—the agriculture reform implementation oversight board. The evidence that was given to the committee highlighted the long-term nature of the agriculture sector and the concerns that exist regarding the inability of businesses, following Brexit, to plan ahead.

Does the cabinet secretary share my view that the Tory UK Government is completely failing our farmers, crofters and growers? Will she continue to advocate active farming and food production? Will she commit to having continued engagement with the UK Government, with a view to securing some clarity for the industry?

Mairi Gougeon (Scottish National Party, Angus North and Mearns)

Yes, I will. I know how important future funding certainty is. One of the biggest issues that I hear about directly from farmers, crofters and other businesses is the ability to plan for the future and know what funding will be in place. Unfortunately, we are not in a position to provide that certainty, for the reasons that I outlined in my initial response.

We share the frustration that our stakeholders have expressed about the lack of clarity, the lack of collective engagement on future funding and the impact that that has on the development of future policy. That is before we even look at the impact of trade and migration policies and the threats that are posed by the United Kingdom Internal Market Act 2020 and the Subsidy Control Act 2022.

I remain committed to supporting active farming and food production in Scotland with direct payments, because that provides certainty to the industry, and we will deliver on our commitments.

Agricultural Support (Ayrshire)

Willie Coffey (Scottish National Party, Kilmarnock and Irvine Valley)

5. To ask the Scottish Government how it supports agriculture in Ayrshire. (S6O-02000)

Mairi Gougeon (Scottish National Party, Angus North and Mearns)

The Scottish Government provides access to agricultural support from a number of payment schemes that are open to eligible farmers, crofters and land managers. We have committed to support active farming and food production with direct payments to provide certainty to the industry, and we brought forward the 2022 common agricultural policy payment date to provide support to businesses with immediate cash-flow challenges.

Willie Coffey (Scottish National Party, Kilmarnock and Irvine Valley)

The cabinet secretary will be aware that Ayrshire plays a prominent role in farming in Scotland and that the quality of our beef, sheep and dairy sectors is among the best in the world, with produce of the highest standard. With significantly rising costs affecting production, our farmers are facing an extremely challenging task simply to keep pace. Will the cabinet secretary outline the Government’s plans to help them to meet that challenge, to increase local food production in Scotland and, of course, to encourage everyone to buy Scottish farming produce in support of our local farmers?

Mairi Gougeon (Scottish National Party, Angus North and Mearns)

I could not agree more with the member’s point about the fantastic produce that comes from his region. I had the pleasure of visiting a dairy farm with him a wee while ago now. The Ayrshire agriculture sector is hugely important to Scotland and, over the past year, we have provided around £31 million in support payments for the various schemes that I talked about.

The member raises important points about something that we could all do more to encourage: buying local produce and supporting local production. We have set out a local food strategy and, last year, I took the Good Food Nation (Scotland) Act 2022 through the Parliament. That is about Scotland being that good food nation, ensuring that people in Scotland have access to the food that we produce in this country and strengthening local food supply chains. We are of course looking to do all that we can to encourage that and encourage people to buy local produce and support local production.

Decarbonisation of Transport (Rural Economy)

Brian Whittle (Conservative, South Scotland)

6. To ask the Scottish Government what discussions the rural affairs secretary has had with ministerial colleagues regarding how it will ensure that the needs of the rural economy are considered in its plans for the decarbonisation of transport. (S6O-02001)

Jenny Gilruth (Scottish National Party, Mid Fife and Glenrothes)

I regularly engage with my ministerial colleagues, including the Cabinet Secretary for Rural Affairs and Islands, on transport matters. For example, I do that through the islands strategic group, which met last week. The Government’s ambitions for future transport investment priorities for the whole of Scotland are included in the second strategic transport projects review, which was published in December last year. They have the potential to decarbonise transport and transform the way that we travel in rural areas. The recommendations focused on active travel, bus priority and the safety and resilience of the transport network, all of which will support the rural economy.

Brian Whittle (Conservative, South Scotland)

The minister will know that our rural areas are being left behind when it comes to the decarbonisation of transport. We have a huge opportunity here and I wonder whether the cabinet secretary recognises it. We have an opportunity to connect main arterial routes such as the A75, the A77 and the A9 in an electric and hydrogen superhighway that will bring up our rural economy to the standards that we are looking at in urban areas. Does the minister accept that that investment is required?

Jenny Gilruth (Scottish National Party, Mid Fife and Glenrothes)

I recognise the sentiment of Mr Whittle’s question. It is worth saying that a lot of cross-Government work is on-going on this matter. For example, only last week, as I alluded to in my first response, the islands strategic group met and, as a result of a request from me, transport will now be a standing agenda item for that group. It is important that we have a cross-Government approach to transport, particularly where there is a connection across portfolio areas.

I would also point to the fact that the convention of the Highlands and Islands will be in the Western Isles next week and, again, transport will feature on the agenda. There are undoubtedly challenges in rural Scotland that do not exist in other parts of the country.

The member makes a fair point in relation to electric vehicles. It is worth pointing out that, in Scotland, we have the most comprehensive public charging network in the United Kingdom outside of London. However, there is more that we need to do, working with our local authority partners and particularly in rural areas.

The Deputy Presiding Officer

I will take a brief supplementary from Beatrice Wishart.

Beatrice Wishart (Liberal Democrat, Shetland Islands)

Although ferries are integral to the transport of livestock, fish and aquaculture produce throughout Shetland and for export, our interisland ferries also contribute significantly to Shetland’s carbon emissions. How will the Scottish Government assist island communities in decarbonising ferry transport while meeting their economic needs?

The Deputy Presiding Officer

As briefly as possible, minister.

Jenny Gilruth (Scottish National Party, Mid Fife and Glenrothes)

The member might be aware that the Deputy First Minister and I met Shetland Islands Council yesterday to discuss this very matter of the sustainability of Shetland’s interisland ferries. That work is on-going with the local authority. We absolutely need to focus on the decarbonisation of the fleet, which at the current time is, of course, the local authority’s responsibility.

The Deputy Presiding Officer

I call Kenneth Gibson for a brief supplementary.

Kenneth Gibson (Scottish National Party, Cunninghame North)

The carbon neutral islands project demonstrates that Scottish islands and their economies are at the vanguard of innovation and are leading the way in the journey to net zero. Can the minister advise how the experience of delivering the carbon neutral islands objective, specifically in relation to transport, can be applied to other parts of Scotland, both rural and urban?

The Deputy Presiding Officer

As briefly as possible, minister.

Jenny Gilruth (Scottish National Party, Mid Fife and Glenrothes)

The carbon neutral islands project is intended to benefit all of Scotland, not only those islands that have been directly included in it, but of course that will happen through knowledge exchange and the sharing of good practice. The project is very soon to release the community climate change action plans that have been developed by island communities; those plans will be hugely important and we look forward to analysing their content and working closely with our delivery partners.

Windsor Framework (Impact on Food and Drink)

Clare Adamson (Scottish National Party, Motherwell and Wishaw)

7. To ask the Scottish Government what its initial assessment is of the potential impact of the Windsor framework on the food and drink supply chain in Scotland. (S6O-02002)

Mairi Gougeon (Scottish National Party, Angus North and Mearns)

First of all, we need to be clear that the dispute over the Northern Ireland protocol was of the United Kingdom Government’s own making, threatening what would have been a catastrophic trade war with the European Union in the middle of a cost crisis. Therefore, although the Scottish Government broadly welcomes the Windsor framework agreement, Scotland did not vote for Brexit, which has brought nothing but harm to people, communities and businesses in Scotland. The UK Government must also clarify policy on Northern Ireland to Great Britain trade and the impact on devolved responsibilities, including physical checks on food safety and animal and plant health and on associated infrastructure, such as a border control post at Cairnryan.

Clare Adamson (Scottish National Party, Motherwell and Wishaw)

Indeed, Scotland is the only constituent nation of the UK to have had its vote on Brexit comprehensively ignored, threatening our food security in the process.

Given NFU Scotland president Martin Kennedy’s description of what has been

“significant and costly disruption to long-established trading arrangements between Scotland and Northern Ireland”,

does the cabinet secretary agree that Scotland must be given dispensation similar to that given to Northern Ireland in the Windsor framework so that our food and drink sector has the economic security of access to the EU single market?

Mairi Gougeon (Scottish National Party, Angus North and Mearns)

We have repeatedly called for the UK Government to find a negotiated solution to this entirely avoidable dispute with the EU. The Scottish Government unequivocally supports the Good Friday agreement, and we welcome the new agreement that has been announced on the Northern Ireland protocol, but the fact is that Scotland did not vote for Brexit and yet we continue to suffer from its consequences, including the exacerbation of the current cost of living crisis.

The member is quite right. Northern Ireland has now been given preferential access to the huge European single market, while Scotland, which voted overwhelmingly to remain in the EU, has been ignored by the UK Government and subjected to the full damage of a disastrous hard Brexit. Brexit has brought nothing but harm to people, communities and businesses in Scotland, and the Scottish Government remains committed to realising Scotland’s potential as an independent nation within the European Union.

The Deputy Presiding Officer

I will take a brief supplementary from Alexander Burnett.

Alexander Burnett (Conservative, Aberdeenshire West)

I am glad that the Windsor framework will enable the resumption of trade in seed potatoes between Great Britain and Northern Ireland, something that the NFUS has called a “significant

breakthrough”. What assessment has the Scottish Government made of the impact of that on Scottish farming?

The Deputy Presiding Officer

As briefly as possible, cabinet secretary.

Mairi Gougeon (Scottish National Party, Angus North and Mearns)

We broadly welcome that element of the framework, because that was trade that was switched off overnight and which we have not been able to access since. Again, though, all of this could have been avoided in the first place. Although we broadly welcome the move, the fact is that we did not need to be in this position.

Rural Economy (Sustainability)

Jenni Minto (Scottish National Party, Argyll and Bute)

8. To ask the Scottish Government what discussions the rural affairs secretary has had with ministerial colleagues regarding supporting sustainability of the rural economy in areas such as Argyll and Bute. (S6O-02003)

Mairi Gougeon (Scottish National Party, Angus North and Mearns)

I am in regular contact with my ministerial colleagues with regard to supporting the sustainability of our rural and island communities and economies. We actively work together to support the rural economy, including through different fora such as the islands strategic group, the convention of the Highlands and Islands and the convention of the south of Scotland.

Jenni Minto (Scottish National Party, Argyll and Bute)

Over the past few weeks, I have been meeting farmers and fishers in my Argyll and Bute constituency, and both groups have raised the importance of investing in local infrastructure. How is the Scottish Government ensuring that local knowledge and good practice in rural and island communities are fully harnessed?

Mairi Gougeon (Scottish National Party, Angus North and Mearns)

The member raises an important point. If we want to deliver on our ambition for a fairer Scotland, we have to start at the local community level. Our infrastructure investment plan and islands programme set place-based investments that reflect the needs of our communities and the delivery of this Government’s priorities of a net zero, place-based, wellbeing economy.

Our planned investments for Argyll and Bute’s transport infrastructure, for example, include solutions to address the landslip risks on the A83 at the Rest and Be Thankful. I know that the transport minister continues to engage with local stakeholders via the A83 task force meetings, the most recent of which was chaired by my colleague on 25 January this year. Again, it is vital to get that local engagement and listen to our local communities.

Edward Mountain (Conservative, Highlands and Islands)

I refer members to my entry in the register of members’ interests as I am a member of a farming partnership.

Farmers often play an important part in keeping rural businesses open and trading by opening up the roads during bad weather. Will the cabinet secretary speak to local councils about the importance of them providing equipment such as snowploughs to help farmers to do that?

Mairi Gougeon (Scottish National Party, Angus North and Mearns)

I am more than happy to raise that with local government colleagues or the Convention of Scottish Local Authorities.

The Deputy Presiding Officer

That concludes portfolio questions on rural affairs and the islands. There will be a brief pause while the ministers change over and we move on to the next portfolio.

Health and Social Care

The Deputy Presiding Officer

The next portfolio is health and social care. As ever, if a member wishes to ask a supplementary question, I invite them to press their request-to-speak button during the relevant question.

Question 1 has been withdrawn.

NHS Tayside (Recruitment of Oncologists)

Willie Rennie (Liberal Democrat, North East Fife)

2. To ask the Scottish Government whether it will provide an update on the recruitment of breast cancer oncologists in NHS Tayside. (S6O-02005)

Maree Todd (Scottish National Party, Caithness, Sutherland and Ross)

NHS Tayside cancer services are currently operating at a stable level with mutual aid from other health boards for systemic anti-cancer therapies for breast cancer. The health board is actively recruiting and has recently seen positive developments that will be shared with the public if and when confirmed.

Willie Rennie (Liberal Democrat, North East Fife)

It is frustrating that we do not have any more detail. I have heard positive reports about recruitment, but the problem has been going on for some time. The indications are that hundreds of people have had to go outside NHS Tayside for treatment, and we are still way short of the number of consultants that we need. Some posts have been advertised and vacant for 900 days. When can we expect some real positive news for the people of NHS Tayside and Fife? This has been going on for far too long.

Maree Todd (Scottish National Party, Caithness, Sutherland and Ross)

As I said, we will share the positive news with the public as soon as we possibly can. I reassure patients in Tayside that the oncology service is now able to offer the majority of breast cancer treatments to patients wholly in Tayside, and only a small number of people—in single figures every week—require to travel to other specialist centres.

We well understand the impact of that. Mr Rennie is talking to a rural member of the Scottish Parliament, and from my constituency inbox and from my friends and family, I understand the challenging situation faced by patients who have to travel for care.

There are hopeful signs of recovery in international interest in the recruitment of senior clinicians. Dialogue is on-going on that. We are also fairly certain that we have managed to develop a pipeline of clinical oncologists to take up posts as soon as their training is completed.

Tess White (Conservative, North East Scotland)

The reality is that a large part of the oncology department in Tayside has gone and, as we have heard, vacancies have proved to be impossible to fill. Does the minister think that it is acceptable that women in Tayside must travel miles from home for breast cancer treatment? Can she tell us what the threshold is for these arrangements to come to an end?

Maree Todd (Scottish National Party, Caithness, Sutherland and Ross)

As I said, I understand how difficult it is for individual women to have to travel for treatment for breast cancer. I know how difficult that situation is because I represent and live in a rural constituency, where many of the women have to travel long distances to seek specialist cancer treatment.

I am absolutely certain that we are seeing green shoots of recovery in relation to that historical situation in Tayside, which has been so difficult for all the people who live in Tayside, and certainly for all the people who work in that department. I am very certain that the situation is going to improve. I very much look forward to the day that I, or my replacement, can update the Parliament on that good news.

Hospital Waiting Lists

Russell Findlay (Conservative, West Scotland)

3. To ask the Scottish Government what its response is to reports that over 600,000 people are on a hospital waiting list. (S6O-02006)

Humza Yousaf (Scottish National Party, Glasgow Pollok)

We have already seen a huge effort by our national health service to clear the backlog caused by the pandemic. The total number of patients waiting more than two years for an out-patient appointment was reduced by 60 per cent in six months, and the majority of in-patient day-case specialities now have fewer than 10 patients waiting more than two years.

We have also progressed significant immediate and long-term solutions to support boards to clear the significant backlog that remains. In addition to the targets that were introduced last year, the centre for sustainable delivery is supporting boards to maximise their capacity and increase theatre efficiencies. Of course, four new treatment centres will also open later this year.

Russell Findlay (Conservative, West Scotland)

Patients across Scotland agree with Kate Forbes on Humza Yousaf’s disastrous handling of Scotland’s NHS. Evidence of his incompetence was laid bare in a recent BBC “Disclosure” investigation, but medics say that they were banned from speaking to the BBC and that every mainland health board refused the BBC access to hospitals, despite that being routine elsewhere in the United Kingdom. Will Mr Yousaf reveal whether his Government had any involvement in blocking media access to the NHS? If it did not, in his final days as health secretary, will he put an end to this secrecy culture?

The Deputy Presiding Officer

I am not sure whether that question relates to hospital waiting lists, but I will invite the cabinet secretary to respond.

Humza Yousaf (Scottish National Party, Glasgow Pollok)

No, it does not—it is, of course, politicising the health service.

I urge Russell Findlay to take off that tinfoil hat that he wears so often in the chamber. There is no conspiracy. Nobody in the Government is trying to silence anybody in the health service—in fact, quite the opposite is the case. I have had a number of conversations with whistleblowing champions, and I encouraged them to raise staff concerns directly with management.

As for incompetence, maybe I should listen to Russell Findlay, because he is certainly an expert in it.

Kenneth Gibson (Scottish National Party, Cunninghame North)

Can the cabinet secretary advise how waiting times in Scotland compare with those in England—where Mr Findlay’s party is in power—and, indeed, with those in Wales? [

Interruption

.] Does the cabinet secretary agree that the shortage of health professionals is due to the rapid rise in demand since the pandemic, which the Tories’ Brexit, now enthusiastically backed by Labour, has only exacerbated?

Humza Yousaf (Scottish National Party, Glasgow Pollok)

I can hear the Conservatives shouting, “Give him a job!” I will tell them one thing: none of them will be getting a job, because they will be sitting in Opposition for a long, long time to come.

Kenny Gibson is absolutely right. The Tory Brexit, backed by the Labour Party, has had a detrimental effect not only on health services but on social care services up and down the country. It makes health workers and social care workers sick to the stomach to listen to a Prime Minister extolling the virtues of the Northern Ireland protocol while denying that very same right to the people of Scotland, who, of course, voted against Brexit.

On the question about comparisons, some direct comparisons cannot be made because of the way that data is recorded. Nonetheless, it is worth saying that data to December 2022 shows that, in Scotland, 114 patients per 1,000 of the population were waiting for treatment time guarantee and new out-patient appointments. That is fewer than in England, where 127 patients per 1,000 of the population are on the referral to treatment waiting list, and it is fewer than in Wales, where the figure is 237 patients per 1,000 of the population.

The Deputy Presiding Officer

Question 4 has been withdrawn.

NHS Boards (Cost of Capital Projects)

Colin Beattie (Scottish National Party, Midlothian North and Musselburgh)

5. To ask the Scottish Government what impact increases in prices and energy costs have had on the ability of national health service boards to deliver capital projects. (S6O-02008)

Humza Yousaf (Scottish National Party, Glasgow Pollok)

The Scottish Government has been notified of significant increases in the cost of capital projects by NHS boards due to inflation. Increases in energy costs have an effect at all points in the construction supply chain and are contributing to the overall increases in construction costs. We are, of course, reviewing the projects that are under way.

Colin Beattie (Scottish National Party, Midlothian North and Musselburgh)

It is clear that increases in prices and energy costs have had an impact on all budgets. Has the Scottish Government undertaken any assessment of the risks of delayed implementation of future capital projects?

Humza Yousaf (Scottish National Party, Glasgow Pollok)

Colin Beattie is right that inflation and high energy costs have had an impact on capital projects across the entire Scottish Government, including our health capital projects. In the United Kingdom Government’s budget announcement, it could have taken action to drastically reduce energy bills, but it has chosen not to do so. That will have an impact on capital projects right across the UK, including health projects.

We continuously review capital projects because of those inflationary pressures. If Colin Beattie is concerned about a specific project, I am more than happy to hear directly from him.

The Deputy Presiding Officer

A number of members want to ask a supplementary question.

Douglas Lumsden (Conservative, North East Scotland)

Last week, it was announced that Aberdeen’s new Baird family hospital and the ANCHOR—Aberdeen and north centre for haematology, oncology and radiotherapy—project would be delayed yet again. As they are now three years late and the costs are now more than double the original budget, can the cabinet secretary give an update on when those two hospitals will be open?

Humza Yousaf (Scottish National Party, Glasgow Pollok)

The member asks a question without any self-awareness of the inflationary pressures that have been caused by his Government. His party’s economic vandalism has caused high energy costs and high inflation. He also knows that Covid had an impact on a number of our capital projects.

The Baird family hospital and ANCHOR projects are very important, and I am pleased that John Swinney confirmed funding for them. I will write to the member with the latest information on the timescales for opening.

Beatrice Wishart (Liberal Democrat, Shetland Islands)

Shetland needs a modern hospital that is fit for the 21st century. The last time that I asked the health secretary about Shetland’s hospital, he said that he would update me on the situation when the Scottish Government was able to make further progress on the site. That was in November. I recognise that other things have cropped up in the health secretary’s diary, but how is the Scottish Government assisting NHS Shetland in developing a new facility, as well as supporting the service with rising energy and construction costs?

Humza Yousaf (Scottish National Party, Glasgow Pollok)

I work closely with health boards. If the member did not get a response, I will make sure that she does. I hope that she will forgive me if a response was not forthcoming.

I have made the point already that our budget—particularly our capital budget—is extraordinarily stretched because of high inflationary costs, including higher energy costs. Under our current capital programme, we have committed to a number of projects right across the country. The member knows that a replacement hospital for Shetland is not one of the projects on which I am able to give absolute certainty and confirmation. However, having visited Shetland not too long ago, I recognise the strong case for a replacement hospital there.

Stuart McMillan (Scottish National Party, Greenock and Inverclyde)

The cabinet secretary will be aware that I have been campaigning for a new Port Glasgow health centre, because the current facility is ageing and is very much in need of replacement. I have engaged with NHS Greater Glasgow and Clyde and with the cabinet secretary on the issue.

Can the cabinet secretary provide an update on potential proposals to deliver a new Port Glasgow health centre?

Humza Yousaf (Scottish National Party, Glasgow Pollok)

Again, I will write to the member with the detail. Members are rightly asking questions about their constituencies and regions, but such questions demonstrate the pressure that we are under. There is significant pressure on our health capital budget, which is used to deliver a number of projects right across the country. We will take each project on a case-by-case basis. I will give an update in writing to the member on the business case for the Port Glasgow health centre.

Sue Webber (Conservative, Lothian)

The national treatment centre that is scheduled to be built at St John’s hospital in Livingston has doubled in price to £184 million, while the cost for the replacement for the Edinburgh eye pavilion has increased from £112.5 million to £123 million. That additional capacity is essential to tackle the waiting lists for treatment across the Lothian region. Both sites have a projected operational date of 2027. What reassurance can the cabinet secretary offer to those who are suffering while waiting for treatment that they are a priority of his? Is he waiting until 2027, too?

Humza Yousaf (Scottish National Party, Glasgow Pollok)

I would say to them that we are very sorry that the UK Government’s economic vandalism has meant that the prices of those projects have risen so much due to inflationary pressures. Sue Webber might want to think about saying the same to the constituents whom she represents.

I support the national treatment centre programme and the delivery of the new eye pavilion. However, we need to review the investment programme so that it remains affordable, particularly given the high levels of inflation. The very large inflationary increases might mean that some NHS projects have to be delayed. I am urgently reviewing the plans for a new national treatment centre in Livingston, and when we have gone further through the process of a full business case review, I will ensure that the member is updated.

NHS Golden Jubilee (Additional Capacity)

Kaukab Stewart (Scottish National Party, Glasgow Kelvin)

6. To ask the Scottish Government whether it will provide an update on any on-going work with the NHS Golden Jubilee to make additional capacity available for elective operations in order to minimise pressure on waiting times. (S6O-02009)

Humza Yousaf (Scottish National Party, Glasgow Pollok)

The national eye centre at the Golden Jubilee hospital ran 18 months of weekend cataract sessions, over and above standard provision, to December last year, supporting the treatment of 1,251 patients in 2022. The facility is on target to deliver more than 11,000 cataract operations through core activity in the year to March 2023. The board’s endoscopy plan will also provide capacity for more than 7,500 patients in 2023-24.

Kaukab Stewart (Scottish National Party, Glasgow Kelvin)

I pay tribute to the staff at the Golden Jubilee hospital for their valued work in providing the highest-quality treatment and care for NHS Scotland patients. As elected members, we are all aware of cases where referral for treatment at the Golden Jubilee for cataract surgery has reduced the prospect of potentially lengthy waiting times by a significant number of weeks or months. Does the cabinet secretary agree that redirection to the Golden Jubilee eye centre is having a significant positive effect on local health board cataract waiting lists?

Humza Yousaf (Scottish National Party, Glasgow Pollok)

I agree and, for the life of me, I cannot understand why there are mumbles and groans from Conservative members when Kaukab Stewart is rightly raising concerns and praising the staff at NHS Golden Jubilee for their phenomenal work in ensuring that people get cataract operations on time. I am really grateful to those NHS staff. I applaud all our NHS staff, particularly those in the Golden Jubilee, who managed to phenomenally increase the volume of cataract procedures that are undertaken per session, supported by the Royal College of Ophthalmologists. That will provide sustainable improvements.

That is the value of our national treatment centres—they are national. The clue is, of course, in the name and the four that will open later this year will support people right across Scotland.

Sandesh Gulhane (Conservative, Glasgow)

The only grumbles that the cabinet secretary heard were from Kate Forbes yesterday. Increasing capacity requires staff to do the operations, so does the cabinet secretary welcome the UK Government’s removal of the lifetime limit for pensions and a 50 per cent increase to the annual limit, because that will allow senior consultants to come back to work to do extra? Will the cabinet secretary now do his bit for NHS pensions?

Humza Yousaf (Scottish National Party, Glasgow Pollok)

Let me remind

Dr Sandesh Gulhane that the only nation in the entire UK not to have lost a single day to NHS workers’ strikes is Scotland, under my leadership, of course—not under that of the Conservatives, who have ignored, stonewalled and treated our NHS workers with complete and utter contempt. This Government, of course, has ensured that they remain the best-paid staff in the entire UK, and that is a record that I am very proud of.

The Deputy Presiding Officer

There is a further supplementary question, but I again remind members to keep the supplementary questions relevant to the initial question.

Edward Mountain (Conservative, Highlands and Islands)

I wonder what the cabinet secretary would like me to tell my constituent who was told in November that she would be able to join the cataract waiting list in July this year. Does he think that that is acceptable?

Humza Yousaf (Scottish National Party, Glasgow Pollok)

Again, I am happy for Mr Mountain to raise that case with me directly. He will know that, because of the impact of the Covid pandemic, there has undoubtedly been an increase in backlogs. However, I go back to Kaukab Stewart’s original question. We have a fantastic facility in NHS Golden Jubilee, which has increased capacity. The centre for sustainable delivery is working right across health board areas to see what more we can do to increase capacity, and I am looking forward to the opening of the treatment centre in NHS Highland, too.

The Deputy Presiding Officer

Question 7 has been withdrawn.

Fetal Alcohol Spectrum Disorder

Gillian Martin (Scottish National Party, Aberdeenshire East)

8. To ask the Scottish Government what it is doing to prevent fetal alcohol spectrum disorder. (S6O-02011)

Kevin Stewart (Scottish National Party, Aberdeen Central)

The Scottish Government is committed to preventing the harm that is caused by alcohol consumption during pregnancy and to supporting those who are impacted by fetal alcohol spectrum disorder.

The clear message from the chief medical officer on alcohol during pregnancy remains “no alcohol, no risk”. That message features in the booklet “Ready Steady Baby!” and on NHS inform, where there is information on why women should avoid alcohol when pregnant or trying to conceive.

All pregnant women in Scotland are asked about their drinking habits as part of their booking appointment with maternity services. If required, they are also provided with an alcohol brief intervention—a short conversation that aims to get them to think about their alcohol consumption and how they might cut down.

Gillian Martin (Scottish National Party, Aberdeenshire East)

I thank the minister for his answer and for the reply that he sent to my office in response to my constituents’ concerns about the issue. It is estimated that between 3 and 5 per cent of people may be undiagnosed with FASD. It is the most overlooked neurodevelopmental condition in Scotland. What is being done to ensure that health providers have the tools to diagnose cases of FASD and to provide support for people who have complex needs as a result of the condition?

Kevin Stewart (Scottish National Party, Aberdeen Central)

The Government has provided more than £1 million in funding during the past four years to the fetal alcohol advisory support and training team—FAAST—which is based at the University of Edinburgh. The funding supports the delivery of training to improve knowledge of and attitudes towards FASD as well as confidence among professionals who are working with individuals who have it. That includes training on diagnosing the condition.

FAAST has devised a tiered approach to training. In November and December 2022, the team delivered its training on the fundamentals of FASD for health and social care practitioners to more than 300 health and social care workers, and more dates have been organised for 2023. That training will increase the knowledge and skills of practitioners so that they are able to better support people who have FASD. Training on diagnosing FASD for professionals commenced in December, with 34 participants from across the country. The course will enable those professionals, who include clinical psychologists, paediatricians, occupational therapists and speech and language therapists to have the knowledge and skills to be able to support and diagnose FASD. The course also includes information about how to translate assessment findings into meaningful indications of what post-diagnostic support will be required.

Russell Findlay (Conservative, West Scotland)

In his answer to the first question, the minister referred to something called, “Ready Steady Baby!”, and I would be grateful if he could tell me what that is.

Kevin Stewart (Scottish National Party, Aberdeen Central)

I will ensure that all members get information about that publication, and I will also send copies of it to Mr Findlay and others so that they can peruse it for themselves.

Kenneth Gibson (Scottish National Party, Cunninghame North)

Fetal alcohol spectrum disorders have a devastating impact on the lives of children who have been impacted by alcohol in the womb. What further action will the Scottish Government take to raise awareness of FASD among prospective parents in order to reduce the number of children who are born with this debilitating syndrome?

Kevin Stewart (Scottish National Party, Aberdeen Central)

We all have a part to play in highlighting FASD. It is one of those areas that the public are not completely aware of. I pay tribute to Siobhian Brown for recently holding a members’ business debate on this important subject. Mr Gibson has raised the issue on many occasions, too.

We will look to see what we can do with our marketing budget to promote more awareness of FASD and highlight the difficulties that drinking alcohol during pregnancy can cause to babies while they are in the womb.

The Deputy Presiding Officer

That concludes portfolio question time.

Agriculture

Liam McArthur (Liberal Democrat, Orkney Islands)

The next item of business is a debate on motion S6M-08212, in the name of Mairi Gougeon, on delivering the Scottish Government’s vision for agriculture through the agricultural reform route map. I invite members who wish to participate in the debate to press their request-to-speak buttons now, or as soon as possible.

Mairi Gougeon (Scottish National Party, Angus North and Mearns)

It was a little over a year ago that I set out the Government’s vision for the future of agriculture in Scotland. Our vision is positive and puts farmers, crofters and land managers at its core and values their efforts to help feed the nation and steward our countryside. It also recognises their essential role in delivering climate adaptation and mitigation and in biodiversity recovery and nature restoration. Our vision makes clear that our nation has a duty to support our producers and ensure that our world-leading climate and nature targets are realised.

Farmers, crofters and land managers are vital to our ambition to make Scotland fairer and greener. That journey will be challenging and will carry risks, but it also presents opportunities and can be transformative. I and the Government remain committed to working with and listening to our industry and all who have the interests of a vibrant and successful rural Scotland at heart, so that we can achieve our ambition.

We want Scotland to be a leader in sustainable and regenerative farming. Many are already leading the way, and they deserve praise for farming to produce food sustainably in ways that actively benefit nature and the climate. They need to know that we remain committed to supporting them to produce high quality food while also delivering for climate and nature restoration.

Brian Whittle (Conservative, South Scotland)

Would the cabinet secretary agree that one of the best things that we could do is ensure that our farming produce is procured locally, especially in public procurement, and that a lot of work still has to be done in that area to support our farming communities?

Mairi Gougeon (Scottish National Party, Angus North and Mearns)

The member raises an important point. We have so much power through public procurement, and a lot of improvement can be made in that area. A lot of that will also tie into what we intend to bring forward through the Good Food Nation (Scotland) Act 2022, which was passed by the Scottish Parliament last year and what we can produce through our good food nation plans. I look forward to working with the member as we develop that.

The approach that I talked about will sit at the heart of what we legislate for, and how, in the future. It is my intention to introduce a new Scottish agriculture bill this year to provide a replacement for the common agricultural policy and to provide the required powers and framework to deliver our vision for agriculture.

The proposals for the bill will seek to provide an adaptive framework to respond to future social, economic and environmental changes, challenges and opportunities. I will continue to actively work with and alongside the agriculture industry to develop those proposals. I accept that not everyone will agree with our approach, but I hope that we arrive at a policy and support framework, underpinned in statute, that will deliver outcomes that will help us meet our goals to benefit all of Scotland as well as farmers, crofters and land managers.

Rachael Hamilton (Conservative, Ettrick, Roxburgh and Berwickshire)

During the past few days, Shepherd and Wedderburn said that farmers will have short notice of the conditions and payment details to comply with ahead of implementation.

What would the cabinet secretary say to the Climate Change Committee, which has also said that the route map is too slow to meet emission target goals?

Mairi Gougeon (Scottish National Party, Angus North and Mearns)

I have not seen the comments that the member referenced, but I would be happy to look at that matter in more detail. It is important that we can set out in our route map when we can implement those changes—as I will discuss later—because showing when the transition will happen is critical to give the industry more clarity and certainty as we move forward. There is only so much that we can do at each stage, but

the phasing of that, and informing people of what we look to implement as we make those changes, are critical as we deliver a just transition.

What I have mentioned will involve change, but change and adaptation has long been at the heart of the Scottish agriculture sector, and many have already embarked on this transformational journey. We will incorporate what we learn—including new and best practice, improvements in technology and evidence on climate impacts—and we will evaluate delivery to monitor how well we are doing and where we need to act more urgently or change our approach.

Last year, we undertook a consultation on the bill. We are carefully considering the diverse range of views provided, and I intend to publish responses later this spring.

However, we are not waiting for legislation to act. In the meantime, we will progress our agriculture reform programme. On 10 February, I published the agriculture reform route map, which sets out the timescales for information and interaction with the agricultural industry. The route map provides Scotland’s farming and food production industry with clarity and confidence on key dates, expectations, the various measures being proposed and the support that will be available to prepare for implementing change.

There are still questions to be answered, which can only be answered in the bill and the measures flowing from it, but the route map provides a clear set of steps and dates to explain when current schemes will transition or end and when more guidance, support and information will become available.

The route map fulfils one of my key pledges: that there will be no cliff edges for the farmers and crofters of Scotland. It is worth saying again that no matter what Westminster does the Government in Scotland will maintain direct payments and support our nation’s producers.

However, there will also be changes. A proposed future support framework will provide conditional payments under four tiers: base, enhanced, elective, and complementary. The existing framework of support will continue in 2023 and 2024 to provide stability to farmers and crofters.

From 2025, new conditionality will be delivered under existing powers for the 2025 single application form calendar year. That will include the foundations of a whole farm plan, which is a tool that we will co-design with the industry to help our farmers and crofters to plan their businesses in a more sustainable way.

Rachael Hamilton (Conservative, Ettrick, Roxburgh and Berwickshire)

Will the cabinet secretary give way?

Mairi Gougeon (Scottish National Party, Angus North and Mearns)

I have already taken a couple of interventions so I would like to make progress unless it is a brief point.

Rachael Hamilton (Conservative, Ettrick, Roxburgh and Berwickshire)

Yes, it is really important. The route map is not much comfort to farmers because it is not structured enough to allow them to take seasonality into account. They need to plan ahead five or 10 years, particularly for breeding patterns and crop rotations.

The Deputy Presiding Officer

Cabinet secretary, I can give you back the time for the interventions.

Mairi Gougeon (Scottish National Party, Angus North and Mearns)

Thank you, Presiding Officer.

I say to Rachael Hamilton that that is where our work in co-developing the system with the industry is important. I would like to think that, in the meantime, the route map provides stability and clarity as to how long the schemes that are in place at the moment will continue and when we expect them to transition. I come back to the point that there will be no cliff edges in the support that we are providing for our farmers and crofters. We will ensure that there is a transition. We do not have all the answers and details on the route map, but it points out when that information will become available.

New conditions will be applied to some existing schemes to deliver on our commitment to shift from unconditional to conditional support on half of all funding by 2025. The current region model will remain in place in the early stages of the transition. However, it will be reviewed to ensure that tier 1, base, is fit for purpose for the future.

From 2026, with the approval of the Parliament, new powers from the proposed agriculture bill will be used to launch the new enhanced payment. The enhanced payment will be the key mechanism to incentivise farmers and crofters to undertake actions to deliver positive outcomes for the climate and for nature. Co-development of that element is being prioritised through the preparing for sustainable farming programme under the national test programme, which launched in spring 2022. Central to that track is the provision of funding for conducting carbon audits and soil testing. Over three years until 2025, the national test programme will invest up to £51 million to help farmers and crofters undertake those essential first steps towards more sustainable farming.

On 10 February, I also published a list of potential future support framework measures. The list sets out the sort of actions that we will expect farmers and crofters to undertake under the new framework. It is based on the actions that have been identified by academic research and the farmer-led groups as being essential to meeting Scotland’s climate and biodiversity targets. The measures are focused on their suitability for the enhanced tier. There is likely to be a range of additional measures to help to achieve Scotland’s nature and climate targets in other tiers of the future support framework.

Underpinning all those measures is the principle that farmers and crofters should choose measures that are right for their business and based on their farm plans, audits and expert advice. The final list of actions in a future support framework will be not prescriptive but elective to encourage choice, flexibility and adaptability. It will not seek to penalise those who already achieve a certain level or threshold. Therefore, farmers and crofters do not need to wait before taking action that has been built into the preparing for sustainable farming programme and the national test programme.

Producing more of our own food more sustainably is at the heart of our vision for the future of Scottish agriculture because it will enable us to be more food secure. As a result of Brexit and the continuing Russian invasion of Ukraine, we are now more aware of, and alert to, food supply vulnerabilities and price shocks.

Last year, I established, together with industry, a short-life food security and supply task force, which reported in June. I am pleased to report that the immediate recommendations from the task force are now complete or substantially complete. For example, I have also now established and resourced a dedicated food security unit within the Scottish Government. That unit will allow us to continue to monitor and respond to issues in food supply and production to bolster confidence and address risks and issues as they arise.

However, all our work and planning is compromised by financial uncertainty. Brexit means that we no longer have long-term certainty of funding. HM Treasury has provided yearly allocations for the current United Kingdom parliamentary session and there is no funding commitment from 2025. That has direct implications for the management of the current CAP, including the Scottish rural development programme, and the work that is under way on the agriculture reform programme. That is unacceptable and far from the sunlit uplands that the Brexiteers promised. Scotland needs long-term funding certainty to enable farmers and crofters to plan, invest and deliver, just as we had through CAP.

That funding uncertainty is one reason why we would have preferred to remain in the European Union and will stay aligned to the new CAP approach that our European neighbours are now implementing. However, I reiterate that we expect full replacement of EU funds to ensure no detriment to Scotland’s finances. I will continue to press for that from Westminster at every opportunity, no matter who is in government there.

Westminster has not only short-changed Scotland; it has systematically undermined and diminished devolution through its approach to international trade deals and the United Kingdom Internal Market Act 2020. The Scottish Government—and indeed the Scottish Parliament—remains fundamentally opposed to the 2020 act, which is an assault on devolution that has been imposed on us without our consent and should be repealed. The act has allowed UK Government ministers to introduce the Subsidy Control Act 2022, which has agricultural support within its scope. Therefore, we now find ourselves in the egregious position of being one of the few countries in the world to treat support for growing and producing food in this way, and that might prevent us from tailoring agriculture payments to the specific needs of Scottish farmers, crofters and land managers in future.

Rachael Hamilton (Conservative, Ettrick, Roxburgh and Berwickshire)

Will the cabinet secretary give way

?

Mairi Gougeon (Scottish National Party, Angus North and Mearns)

I have already taken a few interventions so I need to make progress.

All that matters because of the marginal nature of our land, the relative size of our holdings and businesses, and our on-going commitment to support farmers and crofters directly. The Retained EU Law (Revocation and Reform) Bill that is currently going through Westminster only adds to our concerns—not least because of the existential threat that it poses to our high animal welfare, plant health, food safety, water quality and environmental standards.

Westminster might not care about its environment and countryside, but we do. That is why Scotland needs the right to choose its own future. Independence would give us the opportunity to use new powers to pursue priorities that are tailored to our needs. The UK economy is on the wrong path, with no real alternative on offer in the current system. Not being independent means that Scotland is being dragged down the wrong path, too—one that people in Scotland did not vote for. Only through having the full powers that independence brings will Scotland have the full range of economic and other policy tools to take decisions based on our own needs, which would allow us the chance to replicate the success of the many neighbouring countries that are more prosperous, productive and fairer than the UK. That is why the Scottish Government is committed to giving the people of Scotland a choice about the future that they want: a greener, wealthier and fairer economy within the European Union or a sluggish, stagnating economy outside it.

We have embarked on a journey of transformational change, working with the industry to farm more sustainably in the future, for the benefit of climate and nature and, ultimately, for the benefit of us all. It will not be an easy journey—nothing worth doing ever is. What I see and hear from all the farmers and crofters I meet are a willingness to do things differently, an appetite for change and often an impatience for us to get on with it. However, we must also ensure that the transition is a just one that takes everyone who wants to stay in or move into farming and food production with us. That is my goal. We have the ambition, the optimism, the enthusiasm, and the talent and skills that we need to become a global leader in sustainable and regenerative agriculture.

I move,

That the Parliament welcomes the Scottish Government’s Vision for Agriculture, which outlines its aim to transform how it supports farming and food production in Scotland to become a global leader in sustainable and regenerative agriculture, commits to supporting farmers and crofters to produce more of Scotland's food more sustainably to contribute to food security, and acknowledges the need for change to make sure that farming plays its part in cutting emissions, mitigating climate change and restoring and enhancing nature and biodiversity; agrees that there is no contradiction between high-quality food production and producing it in a way that delivers for climate and nature restoration; welcomes the recently-published Agricultural Reform Route Map, which sets out the phased implementation of the four-tier Future Support Framework in order to deliver the Vision and avoid any cliff edges; further welcomes the Scottish Government’s commitment to co-development, demonstrated through its consultation on a Scottish Agriculture Bill and its commitment to working with all partners committed to a vibrant and successful rural Scotland; recognises the uncertainty and limitations on planning, caused by Brexit, and calls upon the UK Government to fulfil its outstanding commitments to fully replace EU funds, and to engage collectively and meaningfully on future agriculture funding.

The Deputy Presiding Officer

Before I call the next speaker, I invite members who wish to speak in the debate but who have not yet pressed their button

to do so as soon as possible. I call Rachael Hamilton to speak to and move amendment S6M-08212.1, for a generous nine minutes.

Rachael Hamilton (Conservative, Ettrick, Roxburgh and Berwickshire)

I welcome the chance to debate how we can deliver a positive vision for the future of Scotland’s agriculture. The importance of food security has never been greater. Agriculture remains at the forefront of efforts to reach our net zero targets, and Scottish farmers need support at this critical juncture to enable them to keep providing the high-quality affordable food that they are famous for.

The Scottish Government has a crucial role in providing the platform on which farmers can thrive. It must allow agriculture to have the means to innovate, advance and build a positive future. That is essential not only for our farmers but for everyone in Scotland. Only by fully committing to farming can we be sure that supermarkets will be stocked with the best meat, fruit and vegetables.

However, for too long agriculture in Scotland has been succeeding despite SNP Government policies rather than because of them. The same is true for rural Scotland. In its motion, the SNP-Green Government talks of delivering, but delivering anything for anyone in rural Scotland has repeatedly been proved to be beyond its capability.

Jim Fairlie (Scottish National Party, Perthshire South and Kinross-shire)

In the spirit of co-operation that will be needed in the debate, will the member please try to keep some of the politics out of her speech so that we can get a solution to the problems that we face?

Rachael Hamilton (Conservative, Ettrick, Roxburgh and Berwickshire)

I thank Jim Fairlie for that intervention, but it is almost a case of the pot calling the kettle black, given the last few paragraphs of the cabinet secretary’s speech—unless, of course, that was written by one of her civil servants.

The Government has failed to deliver promised upgrades to rural roads, failed to deliver ferries for our islanders and failed to give farmers the support and the tools that they need to progress. In every corner of rural Scotland, we find evidence of an SNP-Green Government that simply does not understand the needs of Scotland’s rural population and the land that rural people manage. The Government is out of touch with rural Scotland. Worse than that, it has ignored rural Scotland completely.

To the detriment of our farmers, the coalition Government has been led by ideology rather than evidence. It puts a higher priority on politics than it does on doing the right thing. It chooses to oppose gene editing, ignoring the potential benefits of more food coming from our land, so that it can stoke its age-old constitutional grievances. The Government chooses to let the best land for farming become land for planting trees—the wrong tree in the wrong place—ignoring the fact that that ultimately could harm the environment, as we might be forced to import more food, and more costly food, from abroad rather than grow it here. The Government chooses to make superficial changes that look green on the surface but, underneath, if one looks beyond the political spin, do more damage to the climate, which it claims to care about.

In recent sittings of the Rural Affairs and Islands Committee, we have heard scathing comments that the SNP, hamstrung by the radical Green Party, has left Scottish farmers playing catch-up to others across the world with similar resources, including those just south of the border. Our farmers are at the forefront of the climate and biodiversity crises. Few people are more invested in dealing with the issues than they are and, without agriculture on side, net zero is just a pipe dream. Scotland’s ambitious targets can be met only if farmers are given the necessary opportunity, incentives and helping hand to make a difference.

As well as hearing the evidence in committee, I am fortunate to represent a constituency with dozens of amazing farmers, whom I meet regularly. They are all saying the same thing: “We’re working flat out to boost biodiversity and farm for the future. Give us the support we need, and we will do the rest.” They understand that that is in the interest of the future of their industry. Sustainability has always been part of farming in Scotland, and without it there would be no future.

However, the Government’s attempt to support farmers in that endeavour is falling woefully short of the mark. Examples of that were heard in a recent committee evidence session at which experts discussed carbon audits, slurry storage, green nitrogen, upland management and carbon neutral beef farming. On carbon audits, the committee heard that farmers are already spending thousands of pounds on soil testing and that the scheme that forms part of the current proposals accounts for just 10 per cent of that figure, which was described as “embarrassing”. The Government’s carbon audit scheme sits idle as farmers choose to get on with the work themselves. The data that the Government wants to collect through its scheme already exists but, instead of collating it, the Government is trying to spend public money on collecting what is already collected.

In the same committee session, we heard that Scotland’s pig sector is in a generational meltdown. It is clear that solving the slurry storage issue should be a priority, yet we heard that the Government’s scheme for that, which is worth £5 million, will barely touch the sides, given that storage solutions can cost upwards of £250,000.

Former NFU Scotland president Jim Walker called out the Scottish Government for its “infantile” discussions on the route map. Farmers in countries such as Australia and Ireland have been enabled to rear carbon neutral beef herds. Here, the Government is yet to get its head round the grass on which such herds graze. The distinct lack of understanding of that issue was laid bare by those giving evidence in that committee meeting.

That was just one committee session, and there are many more to come. In a recent meeting with representatives from NFUS, a similar critical picture was painted of the proposals. Those representatives encapsulated the situation perfectly when they accused the Scottish Government of trying to have its cake and eat it.

Karen Adam (Scottish National Party, Banffshire and Buchan Coast)

Does the member agree that she is cherry picking what has been said in the committee and that she is not explaining in a well-rounded way what was said? NFU Scotland president and agricultural reform implementation oversight board chair Martin Kennedy told the Rural Affairs and Islands Committee that, in relation to coming out of the EU and no longer having long-term certainty of funding,

“we need to be able to look five or six years ahead ... We got used to”

the framework

“that was delivered by Europe, which covered a seven-year period, so people knew what was going to be available. We do not have such a framework at present, which is really concerning.”—[

Official Report, Rural Affairs and Islands Committee,

8 March 2023; c 20.]

I thought that I would intervene just to give balance to the argument.

The Deputy Presiding Officer

I can give you that time back, Rachael Hamilton.

Rachael Hamilton (Conservative, Ettrick, Roxburgh and Berwickshire)

I went to the protest that was held outside the Parliament a few months ago and listened to all the farmers, and not one of them was complimentary about the SNP-Green Government.

The importance of food security came to the fore after Putin’s invasion of Ukraine, which led to global supply shortages. Clearly, farming plays an integral role in ensuring Scotland’s food security; after all, the more top-quality and affordable food we grow locally, the less food we need to bring into this country at great cost to our environment. However, much of the concern around the proposals that we are debating today stems from the impression that the Scottish Government is asking farmers to place carbon sequestration and environmental concerns above food production.

Mairi Gougeon (Scottish National Party, Angus North and Mearns)

I made this point in response to an earlier question, but I really do not think that it is fair to pit food production against nature and climate concerns. Does the member not agree that those are not conflicting priorities and that all three things can be done? Indeed, that is why they are the three pillars of our vision.

The member has just talked about the environmental damage that imports can do—why, then, did the UK Government sell us down the river when it came to trade deals?

Rachael Hamilton (Conservative, Ettrick, Roxburgh and Berwickshire)

In summary, the solution to this is to ensure that, as the cabinet secretary has said, food security is aligned with biodiversity gain. Time and again, we have heard that that is not happening; the Scottish Government has put food security at the bottom of the pile. Why are farmers talking about food security? Why are they concerned about clarity and concerned about their future? Is the cabinet secretary listening to farmers? We on these benches are doing so, and that is exactly what they are saying.

The Government is reaping what it has sown. It is sowing the seeds of decline in Scottish agriculture, and our food stocks as well as our environment will pay the price for that. Food that is produced, sold and consumed in Scotland is less harmful to our environment than food that is imported from the other side of the world, and a policy that rewards tree planting over crop planting or livestock grazing on productive land serves only to harm our environment and not, as the Government would claim, to heal it.

Farmers must be supported to do their job, and they deserve to be recognised for the vital role that they play in producing the first-class ingredients that we enjoy every day in our breakfast, our lunch and our dinner. They should, as they so often do, strive to do that work sustainably, but their role in providing food security for our nation must not be forgotten. I will never apologise for making that point time and again in the chamber.

I have already highlighted the frustration at the heart of last year’s “food needs a farmer” protest outside the Parliament. It was a point that the farmers who descended on the Parliament in their hundreds made to the SNP and Green parties, but today’s statement from the cabinet secretary is just confirmation that those parties have completely failed to listen.

However, as we continue our pre-legislative scrutiny of the proposed agriculture bill, there is still time to change tack, listen to farmers and get this right for them. From the evidence that we have heard so far, we should be in no doubt that Scotland’s farmers know an awful lot more about managing their land than those writing policies at St Andrew’s house do. We have an opportunity to utilise the abundance of knowledge that we have in the agricultural industry, and I urge the cabinet secretary to take full advantage of that and commit to ensuring greater transparency of how those views are listened to and how individuals will bear the brunt of the proposals in the bill when it is introduced to Parliament.

We need a plan to help farmers produce more top-quality food here in Scotland, a plan to reduce our reliance on other foods coming in and a plan to create more jobs in the wider food industry. What we need is a plan that puts farmers first, not the one-track, short-sighted and ideology-driven proposal that is before us today. The question for our next First Minister is this: will they ditch the hated Bute house agreement—hated by so much of rural Scotland—or will they plough on for the sake of the dying dreams of independence to the peril of our rural communities?

I move amendment S6M-08212.1,

to leave out from “to become” to end and insert:

“; welcomes the ongoing commitment from Scotland’s agricultural sector to meet net zero by 2045; notes the sector’s contribution of £2.9 billion to Scotland’s economy, with one in 10 jobs being dependent on agriculture; further notes that the Climate Change Committee has highlighted that, as things stand, the Scottish Government will miss its targets to reduce agricultural emissions; recognises that agricultural businesses plan years in advance and that the Scottish Government has failed to provide these businesses with funding certainty, including clarity on whether farmers will be able to apply for all tiers of funding in the new proposed payment system; congratulates farmers and crofters for putting high-quality food on people's plates; urges the Scottish Government to put food security at the heart of its new vision, with a pragmatic land use strategy; calls for farmers in Scotland to be allowed to use gene editing technology to help drive innovation and keep costs low for the agricultural sector, and welcomes the Scottish Government's engagement with farmers and crofters from across Scotland to shape a viable and successful future for generations to come.”

The Deputy Presiding Officer

I call Beatrice Wishart. You may have a generous six minutes, Ms Wishart.

Beatrice Wishart (Liberal Democrat, Shetland Islands)

In reforming and transforming our agriculture sector, everything that we do will need to be in the context of adhering to our net zero targets, facing the climate and nature emergencies, and recognising the impact of Brexit and Russia’s invasion of Ukraine on UK food security.

The war in Ukraine has driven up the cost of products that are essential to food production and the supply chain, including fuel, fertiliser, feed and energy, thus jeopardising global and domestic food security.

The war and its impacts will not last for ever, but there might be some long-lasting impacts that we can address now.

As you will not need reminding, Presiding Officer, just this week, farmers on the island of Westray in Orkney have written to the Scottish Government outlining the stark reality of soaring inflation, rising input costs and piecemeal support. As a result of that reality, farmers in Westray are anticipating the largest-ever drop in cattle numbers in a single year. Without a change in course, critical mass could be lost entirely by 2025. This is a crisis that demands urgent and targeted intervention.

Both the UK and Scottish Governments have been slow to respond on the multiple threats that agriculture faces. The lack of certainty around the future of the post-CAP schemes is deterring investment, and that will be detrimental to the future of the industry. Farming is on a journey, but the destination is not clear, as we heard at last night’s meeting.

Last autumn, Scottish Liberal Democrats passed a conference motion on growing Scottish agriculture. We want an agriculture sector that is as ambitious as our crofters and farmers. Future financial support in agriculture should be built on the principles that it will encourage active farming, promote environmental sustainability and restore biodiversity, in order to manage change in farming and crofting to tackle the climate and nature emergencies. It must support employment and turnover, while maintaining a critical mass in the supply chain and associated industries to enhance the processing of food in Scotland, reduce food miles and fully support the vibrancy and viability of rural and island communities.

The UK Government’s approach to trade deals risks undermining Scottish and UK agriculture by undercutting the goods that we produce to high environmental and animal welfare standards. Post-Brexit trade agreements with Australia and New Zealand have been described by NFU Scotland as

“one sided, with little to no advantage for Scottish farmers”

and as posing

“a long-term threat to key Scottish agricultural sectors, such as beef, lamb and dairy”.

Scottish Liberal Democrats want to reaffirm that all trade deals should meet UK standards on environmental protection and animal welfare.

We also want to see the UK Government commission an independent review of the role of the Groceries Code Adjudicator Act 2013, to establish how it could be further strengthened. The strength of the big supermarkets is being used to drive down prices at the farm gate. Although the major supermarkets have consistently reported large profits, most farms rely on grants and subsidies to make any revenue.

Critically, the UK Government needs to provide relief in the face of rising costs. In recent weeks, exacerbated by poor weather in Europe and North Africa, we have seen how a lack of support for UK glasshouse farming energy bills resulted in shortages on supermarket shelves. We cannot allow food shortages to become commonplace, nor food prices to rise too high for consumers.

Scottish Liberal Democrats secured additional agriculture transition funding in 2021. We call on the Scottish Government to build on that by rewarding environmental stewardship and helping agricultural businesses make investments that will rapidly reduce emissions.

We also call for a fresh food campaign to improve consumer awareness of the benefits of cutting food miles and using local produce, alongside the reform of procurement processes, to better value seasonal Scottish produce and help producers and processors navigate tendering.

We need to get farming practices right for our rural and island communities, and to tackle the climate and nature emergencies. The UK Climate Change Committee’s report “Is Scotland climate ready?” warns that

“There is currently no strategy in place to ensure the agricultural sector in Scotland remains productive as the climate changes”,

despite forecasts of more floods and periods of water scarcity.

NFU Scotland also warns that wholesale land-use change to support climate change mitigation, if it takes agricultural land out of sustainable food production, would lead to

“rapid socio-economic decline across Scotland”.

We advocate robust food security assessments. Is productive agricultural land well suited to supporting food production and sustainability? That needs to be assessed prior to land being used for non-agricultural purposes, such as forestry. That would ensure that carbon offsetting projects do not jeopardise the ability of food-producing land to feed families across Scotland.

A new system of croft proofing needs to be introduced in future agricultural support and other relevant regulations. Not all growers operate in the same way and we should protect the crofts that have served us well for generations.

We will look closely at the Government’s proposals and will support means to keep farming profitable and sustainable with a focus on the need to ensure that the food that we want to put on the dining table is affordable and, importantly, available.

The Deputy Presiding Officer

We move to the open debate. I call Alasdair Allan. You have a generous six minutes, Dr Allan.