Scottish Parliament, 18 November 2021

358 contributions from 66 members. The official report.

General Question Time

Alison Johnstone (Presiding Officer, Lothian)

Good morning. I remind members about the Covid-related measures that are in place, and that face coverings should be worn when moving around the chamber and across the Holyrood campus.

The first item of business is general questions. In order to get in as many people as possible, I would prefer short, succinct questions and answers to match.

Disability Benefits (20m rule)

Pam Duncan-Glancy (Labour, Glasgow)

1. To ask the Scottish Government what its position is on whether the “20m rule” within eligibility criteria for disability benefits is dignified, fair, respectful and consistent with the values of Social Security Scotland. (S6O-00396)

Ben Macpherson (Scottish National Party, Edinburgh Northern and Leith)

From the launch of our replacement benefit, we will be significantly improving how eligibility for adult disability payments will be decided, and dignity, fairness and respect will be at the heart of our approach.

We have also, rightly, prioritised safe and secure transfer of disability assistance to Social Security Scotland. Fundamental changes to the eligibility criteria during the period of transition would put the transfer of nearly 300,000 clients at risk, which is something that no responsible Government would do.

We have committed to a full-scale review of adult disability payment, which will explore how further changes can be implemented, following safe and secure transfer of the benefit.

Pam Duncan-Glancy (Labour, Glasgow)

No evidence yet exists that people who can walk more than 20m have less need for mobility support or that the 20m rule is an effective way to measure mobility. The rule does not take into account the fluctuating nature of many conditions. I, along with the MS Society and others, believe that until policy experts can look at the issue again, changing to a 50m rule in the qualifying criteria would not impact on passported benefits. Will the Scottish Government replace the 20m rule with the previous disability living allowance 50m rule in the interim? It is far from perfect, but it is a better measure than 20m.

Ben Macpherson (Scottish National Party, Edinburgh Northern and Leith)

As I set out in my first answer, safe and secure transfer of benefits will be critical in the period ahead. Disabled people have repeatedly told us that protecting their payments through safe and secure transfer is a key priority, as are passporting issues.

However, as I emphasised, our approach will be different. We will ensure that the impact on individuals of disability or health conditions, including fluctuating conditions, will be fully taken into account. We know that is not the case under the current system. We are introducing a person-centred way of making decisions on entitlement; we are removing degrading and inaccurate functional examinations and are putting an end to decisions being made on the basis of uncontested observations made by personal independence payment assessors. The approach of Social Security Scotland will be significantly different; I know that the Cabinet Secretary for Social Justice, Housing and Local Government set that out in a letter to Pam Duncan-Glancy on 5 November.

Marie McNair (Scottish National Party, Clydebank and Milngavie)

On social security decisions, the minister will be aware that Tory and Labour Governments favoured private sector assessments that lined the pockets of the rich while letting disabled people down. Does the minister agree that that inhumane approach, which caused great misery, will have no part to play in our system in Scotland, which has dignity, fairness and respect at its heart?

Ben Macpherson (Scottish National Party, Edinburgh Northern and Leith)

That is in important point. We know that PIP assessments that are carried out by the private sector often cause a great deal of stress and anxiety to the people who are required to go through them. They also fail to produce accurate decisions, which prolongs stress for clients and costs the public more money in appeals.

We are scrapping that approach and removing degrading examinations. Instead of snapshot judgments, we will base entitlement decisions on a range of supporting information. In-house person-centred consultations will happen only when they are absolutely necessary. In contrast to PIP, choice and flexibility will be embedded in our system.

The Presiding Officer

Questions and responses need to be quicker.

Jeremy Balfour (Conservative, Lothian)

The minister has made it clear that there will be a review. Is he willing to commit today to the review’s decisions being implemented during the current session of the Scottish Parliament, and to their not having to wait for a future session of Parliament for implementation, which would make people with disabilities wait even longer to get the benefits that they are due? Will he commit to full implementation of review recommendations?

Ben Macpherson (Scottish National Party, Edinburgh Northern and Leith)

I have already talked about the importance of safe and secure transfer. It would be wrong for any Government to commit to implementing the findings of an independent review before the review has even commenced. We will take the recommendations of the review extremely seriously, but we will have to consider budgeting concerns and ensure that changes are accounted for.

Willie Rennie (Liberal Democrat, North East Fife)

The minister is setting a lot of store by the different approach to potentially eradicate the 20m rule’s downsides. Does he think that that approach will eradicate all the problems? If not, can he quantify what the issues will be?

Ben Macpherson (Scottish National Party, Edinburgh Northern and Leith)

Given time constraints, I would be happy to meet Mr Rennie to talk about the matter in more detail.

It is important that we make changes in delivery through Social Security Scotland while undertaking safe and secure transfer of existing cases and ensuring that we protect people’s passported benefits. The current time is crucial; we need to balance all the various considerations.

Veterans (Services)

Karen Adam (Scottish National Party, Banffshire and Buchan Coast)

2. To ask the Scottish Government what reassurances it can give to any veterans facing challenges in relation to their local healthcare, housing and accessibility needs. (S6O-00397)

Keith Brown (Scottish National Party, Clackmannanshire and Dunblane)

Last year, we published our response to the veterans strategy, which set out our commitments through to 2028 to improve service delivery and support. We report progress against those commitments through our annual update to Parliament, which I delivered last week.

Furthermore, Scotland was the first country in the United Kingdom to establish an independent veterans commissioner, whose recommendations continue to assist—and occasionally challenge—our work, and ensure that wider policies are developed with the views of the veterans sector represented. I continue to explore additional measures that might be appropriate to provide further reassurance to veterans on those important concerns.

Karen Adam (Scottish National Party, Banffshire and Buchan Coast)

I a

m sure that many of us were touched in some way last week during the remembrance day events. I often think about my grandfather in particular, and how grateful I am to have known him and to have heard his witness of war before he passed. As we remember that past, we must not forget those who need help in the present.

In constituencies including Banffshire and Buchan Coast, a large armed forces community has specific housing needs. How will the Scottish Government ensure that the armed forces will continue to be taken into consideration as the housing sector deals with the challenges that the on-going disruption to supply chains causes, which will undoubtedly impact veterans disproportionately?

Keith Brown (Scottish National Party, Clackmannanshire and Dunblane)

I associate myself with Karen Adam’s remarks about her grandfather, about those who have previously served and about the need for us to continue to remember them.

Through our affordable housing supply program, funding continues to be available to build homes that are specifically for veterans. I say “veterans” because responsibility for housing for people in the armed forces rests, as a reserved function, with the UK Government, although we will look to work with it.

When local authorities identify the housing issue as a strategic priority, we will work with them in relation to veterans. We are aware of the current shortages of materials and labour that parts of the construction sector face, and we continue to be advised of developments in that regard, as well as of impacts on the affordable housing supply programme. We are working closely with the construction sector, through the construction leadership forum, to understand and address the factors behind the issue.

Alcohol Licensing (Sales Data)

Joe FitzPatrick (Scottish National Party, Dundee City West)

3. To ask the Scottish Government what consideration it has given to reported calls for licensees to be required to provide alcohol sales data to their local licensing board. (S6O-00398)

The Minister for Community Safety (Ash Regan)

Data on alcohol sales in Scotland is available through the Public Health Scotland annual publication, “Monitoring and Evaluating Scotland’s Alcohol Strategy”. That data from 2020 shows that the amount of alcohol that is sold per adult drinker in Scotland has fallen to its lowest level for the past 20 years.

The day-to-day administration of the alcohol licensing system in Scotland is the responsibility of the independent licensing boards. Operational decisions about specific requirements that fall on licensed premises, such as the data that should be ingathered to help to inform the development of each licensing board’s statement of licensing policies, is a matter for each individual licensing board to take a view on, based on the needs of its own locality.

Joe FitzPatrick (Scottish National Party, Dundee City West)

Alcohol Focus Scotland has expressed to me that it believes that alcohol sales data is critical for assessment and development of effective policies to reduce the harms that alcohol causes. However, boards cannot get real-time data from license holders directly, and they are particularly concerned about receiving data from off-sales premises, particularly given the impact of the increase in off-sales during Covid restrictions. Could the Scottish Government look at the options, whether through legislation or other means, to compel license holders to provide the data directly to licensing boards?

Ash Regan

I respect the view of Alcohol Focus Scotland, but I am not sure that that level of data is necessary to help us to assess the effectiveness of minimum unit pricing. We have in place data gathering to enable monitoring and evaluation of minimum unit pricing. More generally, that information on alcohol sales is available across Scotland.

I take the member’s point. There are likely to be some commercial sensitivities in obtaining the information that he has described at a local level, but once I have looked into the issue further, I will be happy to write to him with more information.

The Presiding Officer

Question 4 has been withdrawn.

Smoking Reduction

David Torrance (Scottish National Party, Kirkcaldy)

5. To ask the Scottish Government what steps it is taking to emphasise the harmful effects of tobacco as part of its aim to reduce smoking and protect public health. (S6O-00400)

Maree Todd (Scottish National Party, Caithness, Sutherland and Ross)

Our 2018 action plan commits us to interventions and campaigns aimed at discouraging smoking. We aim to make the practice less acceptable and protect others from the damaging effects of second-hand smoke. However, we are not complacent. In 2022, we will introduce an offence for smoking near hospital buildings. We will also continue to promote our free stop smoking services and other targeted media and social media campaigns. We have also committed to a refreshed tobacco action plan, which will include several new actions and interventions, as we continue towards our goal of raising Scotland’s tobacco-free generation by 2034.

David Torrance (Scottish National Party, Kirkcaldy)

The number of smokers across the country has almost halved in the past 20 years. Despite that drop, smoking continues to kill 10,000 Scots and creates 35,000 hospital admissions a year. Those who live in deprived areas are three times more likely to be smokers.

Across my constituency and in wider Fife, the smoking rate is 13.6 per cent. What action can the Scottish Government take to further raise awareness of the harmful impact of smoking as we continue to work towards our target of a tobacco-free generation by 2034?

Maree Todd (Scottish National Party, Caithness, Sutherland and Ross)

The member is absolutely correct to highlight the fact that smoking rates continue to fall in Scotland, but we have more to do, and we need to focus that work in more deprived communities. There is a real health inequality around smoking and its impacts. We are determined to pick up that thread throughout our work on smoking.

Like the member, I am keen to highlight the impact of smoking in Scotland, where 180 people a week are still dying of smoking. It is the fifth most common contributor to preventable deaths. We will tackle that, and I am more than happy to work with the member to ensure that the programmes that we introduce work in his constituency as well as across Scotland.

Carol Mochan (Labour, South Scotland)

The Scottish Government’s own 2019 Scottish health survey reported that the number of people in the most deprived areas of Scotland who smoke regularly is more than five times the number of people in the least deprived areas who smoke regularly. Given that there is a direct link between smoking and the increased likelihood of those from deprived areas experiencing ill-health or early death, does the Government think that it is doing enough to look specifically at reducing smoking in our most vulnerable communities?

Maree Todd (Scottish National Party, Caithness, Sutherland and Ross)

I am aware of those statistics and I agree with Carol Mochan that we need to do as much as we possibly can and focus our attention on smoking in the most deprived communities.

As I have the opportunity, I want to say that stopping smoking is one of the most important steps that anyone can take to improve their health. The free smoking cessation service is available right across Scotland and I am keen for people to take steps towards stopping smoking in all our communities.

The Presiding Officer

I would be grateful if members could pick up the pace, please.

National Health Service Workforce (Winter Pressures)

Neil Bibby (Labour, West Scotland)

6. To ask the Scottish Government what discussions it has had with trade unions regarding the impact of winter pressures on the national health service workforce. (S6O-00401)

Humza Yousaf (Scottish National Party, Glasgow Pollok)

The Scottish Government continues to have regular and extensive engagement with trade unions. In relation to the £300 million winter package, I met trade union representatives on 5 October, the day on which the package was announced. More recently, I also met with them at a round table earlier this month. Our partnership model is designed so that decisions are informed by health and social care partners and are in the best interests of patients and staff. The trade unions and staff representative organisations are key players in the decision-making process.

Neil Bibby (Labour, West Scotland)

When I met Unison representatives at the Royal Alexandra hospital in Paisley last month, they described in detail serious concerns about staffing and disruption to local services. They were concerned about not just the workforce but the people they care for. I shared those concerns with the Cabinet Secretary for Health and Social Care in writing on 8 October, but I have yet to receive a response.

Will the health secretary agree to meet those front-line workers, who can see the human impact of delayed screenings and appalling waits in accident and emergency, and explain to them why his recovery plan is not working?

Humza Yousaf (Scottish National Party, Glasgow Pollok)

I apologise to Neil Bibby if there has been a delay in responding to him. I met Unison just last week—forgive me; it might have been earlier this week. I am always more than happy to meet site representatives and staff. I look forward to visiting the RAH when it is appropriate to do so. I would be happy to do that, and to get a full response to Mr Bibby.

The feedback on the £300 million winter package that we announced is that it can make a substantial difference, if we are able to get people whom it is clinically safe to discharge out into care settings in our community.

In response to Mr Bibby’s question, I will, of course, be happy to visit the RAH when it is appropriate to do so.

Long Covid

Jeremy Balfour (Conservative, Lothian)

7. To ask the Scottish Government whether it recognises long Covid as a disability. (S6O-00402)

Humza Yousaf (Scottish National Party, Glasgow Pollok)

A person is disabled under the Equality Act 2010 if they have a physical or mental impairment that has a “substantial” and “long-term” negative effect on their ability to do normal daily activities. If long Covid has such an effect on an individual, they would be likely to be considered to be disabled under the 2010 act.

The Scottish Government encourages all employers to apply fair work principles and a flexible approach in dealing with the impacts of Covid-19 in order to protect the health and wellbeing of their workforce.

Jeremy Balfour (Conservative, Lothian)

What conversations has the cabinet secretary had with his colleagues in Social Security Scotland to make sure that the appropriate benefits will be paid to those who have long Covid? Going forward, will the condition be defined in any guidance, so that tribunals and others, in making decisions, will be able to recognise it?

Humza Yousaf (Scottish National Party, Glasgow Pollok)

I will ask the cabinet secretary who has responsibility for social security to write to Jeremy Balfour on those specific issues. We meet regularly. Much of that work is done through the role of, and is the responsibility of, the Deputy First Minister.

We want to ensure that our social security system is based on dignity and respect. Jeremy Balfour and I will have many constituents coming to us who are suffering from the long-term effects of Covid and who will be out of work for the first time. Among the benefits that they will look to for help is the safety net of universal credit. Scottish National Party members, along with members across the Parliament, demand that the United Kingdom Government reverse its universal credit cut. It is not too late for it to re-establish the additional £20, which can make a big difference to people with disabilities and those who suffer from the long-term effects of Covid.

Economic Growth

James Dornan (Scottish National Party, Glasgow Cathcart)

8. To ask the Scottish Government what it considers to be the underlying strengths of any economic growth in Scotland. (S6O-00403)

Ivan McKee (Scottish National Party, Glasgow Provan)

Despite the damaging impacts of Brexit across many vital sectors, Scotland’s economy has significant strengths. We have a thriving tech ecosystem, and a renewable energy sector that provides quality jobs and opportunities for innovation. We have strengths in food and drink, life sciences, financial services and advanced manufacturing, as well as a strong skills and entrepreneurial base, all of which has made Scotland the United Kingdom’s top destination outside London for foreign direct investment.

We are pushing forward with an ambitious 10-year agenda of economic transformation to seize Scotland’s potential and deliver a more prosperous, fairer and greener wellbeing economy. Our national strategy for economic transformation will set out how we will deliver a green economic recovery and support new, good green jobs, businesses and industries for the future.

James Dornan (Scottish National Party, Glasgow Cathcart)

I note that the minister mentioned the damaging impact of Brexit on our economy. The chairman of the Office for Budget Responsibility recently indicated that the impact of Brexit on the UK economy will be worse in the long run than the impact of the coronavirus pandemic.

Does the minister agree that it is high time that the UK Government provided the additional funding that was promised to Scotland to mitigate the impacts of a hard Brexit that people in Scotland did not vote for in the first place?

Ivan McKee (Scottish National Party, Glasgow Provan)

The UK Government’s Brexit deal has removed Scotland from a market that is worth more than £16 billion to Scottish exporters, and our companies now face additional costs, delays and barriers. As Mr Dornan has highlighted, the OBR’s latest forecasts show that leaving the European Union will reduce the UK’s potential productivity by 4 per cent in the long run. That compares with a reduction of 2 per cent as a result of the pandemic.

We also know that, in the year up to June 2021, exports of Scottish goods fell by 24 per cent compared with the figure for the equivalent period in 2019.

I agree that the UK Government must provide the additional funding that was promised to Scotland to mitigate the harmful impacts of a hard Brexit, which people in Scotland did not vote for.

Justice System (Release from Prison)

Douglas Ross (Conservative, Highlands and Islands)

1. Sixty-seven-year-old Esther Brown was raped and murdered by Jason Graham. This is a man who was a registered sex offender and had 23 previous convictions. In 2013, he was given a seven and a half-year sentence for the rape of a retired nurse, but he got released early on licence. After Graham was sentenced yesterday for this brutal attack and murder, one of Esther’s friends said:

“She was the type of person that would go and help anybody.”

Can the First Minister honestly say that her Government’s approach to justice is keeping the people of Scotland safe?

Nicola Sturgeon (Scottish National Party, Glasgow Southside)

First, and most important, my thoughts and sympathies are with Esther Brown’s family and friends. Absolutely nothing, including nothing that I or anybody else in the chamber can say, will ease the pain that the family is suffering or the pain of anyone who knew her. I hope that the sentence yesterday will bring some closure to the family, but I do not underestimate the pain that they will be suffering and will continue to suffer for some time.

Obviously, I cannot comment on the detail of individual cases. First, it is important to recognise that, in this case, there will be a significant case review, which will assess the circumstances of the protection arrangements that were in place and the roles of the operational agencies that were involved. That will be done with a clear view to learning any lessons. It is right and proper—indeed, it is essential—that lessons are learned and acted on as appropriate.

Automatic early release has, of course, been an issue of contention for many years in the Parliament. Back in 2015, the Government legislated to end the previous system of automatic early release for prisoners. Of course, that legislation could not apply retrospectively, but it was an important move to make. We will continue to ensure that our justice system protects people from criminals and ensures that victims get the justice that they deserve. I am not talking about this case when I make this point, but we also want a justice system that tries to ensure that the principles of rehabilitation and reducing reoffending are at its heart.

Douglas Ross (Conservative, Highlands and Islands)

This case is yet another damning example of the glaring flaws in Scotland’s justice system. Jason Graham was released early. He was not monitored properly. Yesterday, he got 19 years in prison—yes, that is a long sentence, but it is not nearly enough for such a horrific crime.

This week, the Scottish Government launched a consultation, proposing that violent criminals could get out of prison after serving just six or seven years of their sentence. The Government’s document suggests that long-term prisoners could be considered for release after serving just a third of their sentence. Does the First Minister not see that the proposals would take our justice system even further in the wrong direction and would risk public safety?

The First Minister

These are very serious issues. Before I come on to early release and the consultation that the Government published in recent days, it is important to say that processes and procedures are in place—they clearly did not work in this tragic case—through the multi-agency public protection arrangements to minimise the risks that are posed by registered sex offenders. As I said, in such cases, it is right that there will be a significant case review to ensure that any appropriate lessons are learned.

My Government did not introduce the previous automatic early release arrangements, but we did legislate to end them. It is important that we recognise that it is necessary to have in place a justice system that punishes those who deserve to be punished—that is always an important principle of the justice system—but that also promotes rehabilitation and tries to reduce reoffending.

One thing that is often lost in these discussions—I reiterate that I am talking in general terms here, not about the case of Esther Brown—is that, in Scotland, we imprison a higher proportion of our population than any other country in western Europe does. It is not that we do not send a lot of people to prison. The question is whether prison is always the effective punishment for people. It will be in many, many cases.

We want to have a system of release from prison that, first, has risk assessment and victim safety at its heart, and that also looks at what is most effective in reducing reoffending. The consultation that was published this week is a consultation, and I encourage people across the chamber and indeed the wider public to respond to it.

It is important to say—this will be my last point in this answer, Presiding Officer—that the abolition of automatic early release for the most dangerous, long-term prisoners is not affected by any of the consultation proposals that were published earlier this week.

Douglas Ross (Conservative, Highlands and Islands)

The First Minister started her answer by saying that there are processes and procedures in place. Those processes and procedures did not save Esther Brown from being raped and murdered, so I am sorry, but that does not cut it when we are dealing with lives being lost, and it is not an individual case.

The SNP Government consultation does not stop there, however. It also proposes automatically releasing short-term prisoners after just a third of their sentence. The First Minister previously told the Parliament:

“Our objective remains to end the policy of automatic early release completely as soon as we are able to.”—[

Official Report

, 2 April 2015; c 19.]

That was six years ago, yet now, far from keeping dangerous criminals off our streets, this Government is proposing to let them out even earlier. Is it not the case that this Government’s course of action has let some of the worst offenders back on to our streets, where they are free to commit further offences?

The First Minister

First, and the record will bear this out, I said in my previous answer that the arrangements that are in place through the multi-agency public protection scheme to protect people from registered sex offenders clearly did not work as intended in the case of Esther Brown. I know that nothing that I can say on the generality of these issues will bring any comfort to her family. I want to make that clear again.

I have also been at pains to say that I appreciate that some of the comments that I am making—because there are clearly wider issues here, which Douglas Ross is right to raise—are not applicable to the specifics of Esther Brown’s case. I want to be clear, again, about that. I absolutely understand that anybody who loved her, listening to me right now, will take no comfort whatsoever from anything that I say, but the Government has a duty to ensure that the overall justice system has the right principles at heart when things go wrong and that lessons are learned, and that is what we will always seek to do.

This Government did legislate to end automatic early release for certain categories of prisoner—those serving sentences of four years or more. I do not want to get into politics on such a serious issue, but the Conservatives did not vote for those reforms. Other parties in the chamber did vote for them. It is important that, as we move forward, we continue to keep all the arrangements under review.

The consultation that was published this week is a consultation. It seeks views on whether certain prisoners who are serving short-term sentences could be released earlier than halfway if—and this is an important “if”—that was felt to better support their successful reintegration into society and, therefore, help to reduce the risk of reoffending. We look forward to seeing the responses to the consultation and we will consider them all carefully.

Rates of crime in Scotland—again, I appreciate that this is no comfort at all for any victim of crime—are at their lowest level for many years, and we send a higher proportion of our population to prison than any other country in western Europe does. We have to ask ourselves whether the way that we use prison is as effective as it could be. It is therefore right that we consider these things carefully, and we will certainly do so. As we do that, we will of course learn lessons from tragic cases such as the one that we are discussing today.

Douglas Ross (Conservative, Highlands and Islands)

More dangerous offenders such as Jason Graham are being released all the time. The most recent annual figures show that more than 95 per cent of the criminals who are sent to prison in Scotland will be eligible for automatic early release—more than 95 per cent. Far too often in the Scottish National Party’s soft-touch justice system, criminals are put first, not victims. It is too late for

Esther Brown, but that must change.

Our victims law would restore confidence that is sadly lacking. This Government has a choice to make: having emptier prisons from letting out early even more criminals, or protecting the public and putting victims first. I choose public safety and supporting victims. Which side is the First Minister on?

The First Minister

We should all be on the side of victims of crime, but we should also all be on the side of making Scotland as a whole safer. That means trying to ensure that we have in place a penal system that not only punishes—–a vital principle in any justice system—but helps us to reduce the risk of those who serve sentences in prison reoffending. That is the wider issue that we have a responsibility to consider.

I know that it is an easy soundbite for the Conservatives, but it is simply not accurate to describe our country as having soft-touch justice when we have some of the lowest crime rates in many years and, as I have already said today, send a higher proportion of our population to prison than any other country in western Europe.

The question that we have to ask ourselves is whether our justice system and the approaches that are taken to dealing with offenders are always as effective as they should be, both in punishing and reducing reoffending. I accept that that presents difficult, challenging and, at times, contentious issues, which is why we are consulting carefully on the proposed reforms. We will listen carefully to all the responses that we receive.

Queen Elizabeth University Hospital

Anas Sarwar (Labour, Glasgow)

2. I have repeatedly come to the chamber to raise tragedy after tragedy at the Queen Elizabeth university hospital. Despite that, we still have a culture of cover-up, denial and families being failed. Everyone should read the heartbreaking words of Louise Slorance, the widow of Andrew Slorance, who died in December after being treated for cancer in the hospital. Andrew was the First Minister’s official spokesperson in 2007, then head of the Scottish Government’s response and communication unit. He was at the heart of the Covid pandemic response.

Andrew went into hospital to get treatment that would prolong his life; instead, in hospital, he contracted Covid and a fungal infection—Aspergillus, which is a deadly bacteria that is often linked to water or mould. He died just days later. His wife, Louise, told me that she was never informed about the fungal infection. She had to uncover that in his medical notes after his death. She has spoken courageously of her anger, shock, distress and disappointment.

Why, despite everything that has happened, do we still have a culture of cover-up, secrecy and denial, with families being forced to take on the system to get the truth?

Nicola Sturgeon (Scottish National Party, Glasgow Southside)

I assure members that I have read Louise’s words very closely. I always do that when relatives of people who have died or received substandard care in our national health service speak out, as that is part of my duty. In this case, I have obviously also done that because I knew Andrew very well.

Andrew was a greatly valued member of the Scottish Government team. He is deeply missed by everyone who had the privilege of working with him, which certainly includes me. I first met Andrew on the very first day that I served in Government, back in 2007. He made an exceptional contribution to the Scottish Government’s work, and my thoughts are often with his loved ones and, in particular, his wife, Louise, and his children.

My officials have already engaged this morning with NHS Greater Glasgow and Clyde so that the concerns that have been raised are properly investigated. We will do everything possible to ensure that Andrew’s family members get the answers that they seek, and we will consider carefully whether the concerns that Louise Slorance has raised raise wider issues that require to be addressed. The chief operating officer of NHS Scotland has contacted NHS Greater Glasgow and Clyde this morning to start to establish the facts, and I have asked for information to be available later today, when we will assess what further steps require to be taken.

This Government and I will not tolerate cover-ups or secrecy on the part of any health board. Where there are concerns about that, we will address those concerns.

In relation to the issue at the Queen Elizabeth university hospital, and other issues that have been raised over the years about the hospital, including by Anas Sarwar, a public inquiry is under way. I hope that that is a sign of our determination to ensure that any issues that are raised are properly investigated and that answers are forthcoming. The Government and I are determined that that will be the case in relation to Andrew Slorance’s death.

Anas Sarwar (Labour, Glasgow)

The First Minister says that she has heard these concerns from me for years, so why are these things still happening? If even the widow of Andrew Slorance cannot get the truth and justice that he deserves, when he was at the heart of this Government, what chance does anybody else in our country have? This is a repeated pattern.

Consider the scandal at the children’s cancer ward that led to the tragic death of Milly Main. In that case, a bacteria linked to water, Stenotrophomonas, was identified by infection-control doctors, ignored by management and covered up. In this case, a bacteria linked to water and mould, Aspergillus, was identified by infection-control doctors, ignored by management and covered up. That is a culture of secrecy and denial, and the Government cannot escape that fact.

Such cover-ups have deadly consequences, so I ask the First Minister agree to Louise Slorance’s demands: first, an independent case note review into all Aspergillus cases at the hospital; secondly, an independent Crown Office-led investigation into hospital-acquired Covid infections; and thirdly, for the public inquiry remit to be expanded to include Aspergillus cases.

Crucially, though, the health board leadership has lost the confidence of clinicians, patients, parents and the public. Given everything that has already happened, and everything that has been uncovered, why is the health board leadership in Glasgow still in place?

The First Minister

I will continue to address the issues raised. I said in my initial answer that my officials have already engaged with the health board today, and I have asked for further information. Later today, when I have had the opportunity to look at and assess that information, I will consider, with the Cabinet Secretary for Health and Social Care, what additional steps are required.

I note that Louise Slorance has requested a case note review. A case note review was carried out in relation to earlier issues at the Queen Elizabeth, so it is a reasonable request, which I will consider with the health secretary later.

On Louise Slorance’s other two requests, I absolutely understand why the requests have been made but, as I know Anas Sarwar is aware, the Crown Office is independent of ministers and can look into any cases that it deems appropriate. It is not appropriate for me, as First Minister, to instruct the Crown Office in these matters. Similarly, the public inquiry is, rightly and properly, operating independently of ministers. It is able to look at any issues associated with the Queen Elizabeth that it considers appropriate. To be beyond any doubt, there is no objection on the part of the Government to the public inquiry looking into any of the issues that have been raised in relation to Andrew Slorance by his wife today. However, it is not for me to instruct the public inquiry, because it is operating independently of ministers and will decide which issues it wishes to consider.

Anas Sarwar (Labour, Glasgow)

I accept what the First Minister says, but I note that she dodged the question altogether about the leadership of the health board in Glasgow.

I am sorry—the answer is not good enough because, as the First Minister herself noted, these issues have been raised for years. The right thing to do would not be to ask an official to make contact with the leadership of the health board and have the process that comes back. The right thing to do would be for the First Minister to grip the issue, take ownership of it and get it sorted out.

Despite the tragic loss of life, the cover-ups and the denials, not a single person has been held accountable for the catastrophic errors at Queen Elizabeth university hospital. That cannot continue. From start to finish, the scandal has happened under Nicola Sturgeon’s watch. She was health secretary when the hospital was commissioned and built, and First Minister when it was opened. Since then, water reports have been ignored; there have been deadly building flaws; patients have been getting infections; wards have closed; there have been patient deaths; and staff have been bullied and silenced. There has been an independent review, a case note review, a public inquiry, criminal investigations and continued failings and cover-ups. Families are still having to go public to fight the system and get the truth.

Enough is enough. This is the worst scandal of the devolution era. In any other country in the world, there would be resignations and sackings, but under this Government, there is denial and cover-up. How many more families have to lose loved ones before anyone is held to account?

The First Minister

There is, right now, an independent statutory public inquiry under way. I think that that is right and proper. It was instructed by the previous health secretary of this Government. If the Government were to start to pre-empt the outcomes of that public inquiry, I think that, with some justification, Anas Sarwar and perhaps others would say that that is wrong as well, because we were seeking to interfere with the work that the inquiry was doing.

These are serious issues, and I think that they deserve to be treated seriously and on their substance. The public inquiry is doing that work right now. The findings and any recommendations that fall from that public inquiry absolutely should be, must be and will be acted upon.

I think that it is incumbent on all of us who care about these issues—and I know that that includes all of us in the chamber—to allow that public inquiry to do its work.

The Presiding Officer

We move to supplementary questions.

Weir & McQuiston (Administration)

Clare Adamson (Scottish National Party, Motherwell and Wishaw)

The First Minister might be aware that Wishart-based, family-owned Weir & McQuiston (Scotland) Ltd entered administration this week. WMQ was one of Scotland’s leading mechanical and electrical contractors, and that is a devastating development for the owners and the 90 members of staff who are affected. What engagement has the Scottish Government had with administrators through partnership action for continuing employment—PACE—and what support has been put in place for the people who are affected by those job losses in my constituency?

Nicola Sturgeon (Scottish National Party, Glasgow Southside)

I thank Clare Adamson for raising what I know is an important constituency issue for her. I was also very sorry to hear that Weir & McQuiston had ceased trading after such a long period of time—some 45 years. My thoughts are with the employees who are affected by that decision and their families. I can assure Clare Adamson that our local PACE team has already been in touch with the administrators. It is working closely with the redundancy payments office, which will ensure that information on pay support is issued to the affected employees. We stand ready to do anything reasonable that we can to support them at this very difficult time.

Booster Vaccinations (Ayrshire and Arran)

Brian Whittle (Conservative, South Scotland)

I have a constituent in the vulnerable category who went to book a booster vaccination and was told that there was no availability until mid-January. I have had it confirmed by NHS Ayrshire and Arran that booking is completely full. With that in mind, does the Government have any plans to expand the booster vaccination scheme to ensure that those who should get a booster jab have access to one?

Nicola Sturgeon (Scottish National Party, Glasgow Southside)

Yes, we do. I am happy to look into that particular case and into the wider issue in Ayrshire and Arran. We have plans in place and are working to ensure that all those who are eligible—and remember that eligibility for the booster means six months on from receiving the second vaccine dose—are vaccinated as quickly as possible and before the end of this year, wherever possible.

That is how we have designed the system—there is flex in it. Just this week, we are seeking to increase capacity further so that we can start vaccinating those in the over-40 age group. People should be getting appointments quickly. I will certainly look into any situation in which somebody who is eligible and has already passed the six months is being told that it will be January before they can get a booster. If there is not a good reason for that, we will certainly take that up with Ayrshire and Arran NHS Board.

Glasgow Transport Fares

Paul Sweeney (Labour, Glasgow)

Delegates to the 26th United Nations climate change conference of the parties—COP26—were handed free smart cards like the one that I am holding up to access integrated public transport across the central belt of Scotland. However, my constituent, who was cleaning toilets for the world leaders at the Scottish Event Campus in Glasgow, had to pay £5 for a bus ticket and another £3 for the subway every day, compared with £3 for publicly controlled Transport for London services or £3.60 on publicly controlled and owned Lothian Buses services. In Glasgow, on minimum wage, an hour’s pay each day is spent on getting to and from work.

Does the First Minister therefore agree that a green new deal for workers in Glasgow must include using the powers of the Transport (Scotland) Act 2019 to bring all public transport in greater Glasgow under a single, integrated, publicly controlled franchise, with London-style capped fares?

Nicola Sturgeon (Scottish National Party, Glasgow Southside)

There are two related issues there, and I certainly agree with the sentiment behind the question.

On the integration of ticketing, Transport Scotland is already working towards all journeys on our public transport networks being able to be made using some form of smart ticketing or payment. Progress has already been made towards that objective.

The second issue is affordability. I think that an important part of our journey to net zero and getting more people to use public transport is making public transport much more affordable and therefore more accessible. We need to do that in a way that we can accommodate within our budgets, and we are looking at that right now, in the context of our budget process.

One of the things that we were able to confirm during COP was the introduction of free bus travel for under-22s, which will come into force at the beginning of next year. We need to go further than that and we are considering how quickly we can do that within the resources that are available to us. Making sure that public transport is more accessible in terms of affordability and ease of use is a key priority for us.

Booster Vaccinations

Emma Harper (Scottish National Party, South Scotland)

Will the First Minister join me in thanking all the staff, volunteers and people in Scotland who have helped make Scotland the first United Kingdom nation to give the extra vaccine dose to half of over-50s? I remind members that I am part of NHS Dumfries and Galloway’s vaccination team.

Nicola Sturgeon (Scottish National Party, Glasgow Southside)

I again thank everybody who is working hard to design the vaccination programme and work out how we get the capacity that we need and where the capacity should be, and I thank those who are administering vaccines in vaccination centres the length and breadth of the country, which I know includes Emma Harper. The programme is going very well and we have become the first part of the UK to vaccinate more than 50 per cent of over-50s with the booster, but there is still a long way to go. Vaccination remains our best line of defence against the virus, so I encourage anybody who is not yet vaccinated with either their first or second dose and anybody who is eligible for the booster to get vaccinated, because it will protect them and others—please do it without delay.

Oil and Gas Jobs (North East Scotland)

Douglas Lumsden (Conservative, North East Scotland)

On Tuesday, the First Minister turned her back on 100,000 oil and gas workers, many of whom are in the north-east. Yesterday, the Scottish National Party turned its back on its commitment to fully dual the A96. Can the First Minister explain to the people of the north-east why she has turned her back on them?

Nicola Sturgeon (Scottish National Party, Glasgow Southside)

Like much else that comes from the Conservative Party, that is nonsense, and it completely ignores the responsibility that we all have to address climate change. These issues are complex, difficult and often contentious, but let us be clear that the transition away from oil and gas, which the science says is essential, must be just. It must not put 100,000 workers into unemployment or increase reliance on imports. The question that flows from that is the key question. Do we say that, because we have a current jobs and energy reliance on oil and gas, we continue with new developments and unlimited extraction, or do we say that we need to break that cycle of reliance by investing in the alternatives and speeding up our move away from fossil fuels?

Our obligation to the planet says that we need to do the latter. That is why the Scottish Government is investing in a just transition. That just transition would be easier if the United Kingdom Conservative Government had not turned its back on carbon capture and storage, the Scottish cluster and the Acorn project—perhaps the Scottish Conservatives should take that up with their colleagues in London.

Queen Elizabeth University Hospital

Paul O'Kane (Labour, West Scotland)

The heartbroken family of Andrew Slorance is not the only family seeking answers about what happened to loved ones at Queen Elizabeth university hospital. Theresa Smith, as reported on front page of the

Greenock Telegraph

today, has spoken of the deep pain that her family has endured since the death of her daughter, Sophia, in April 2017 at just 12 days old. Sophia died of an infection that she contracted at the Queen Elizabeth, despite initially responding well to treatment for breathing problems. The family was not informed and had to fight for a post mortem to know the truth. Theresa and her family have described the tortuous journey to try and get answers about what happened, with phone calls, emails and letters stonewalled. She, too, has pointed to a cover-up.

I heard what the First Minister said in response to Anas Sarwar about the public inquiry. Does she recognise that the inquiry did not save Andrew Slorance and will not save patients right now? What is the Government doing immediately to prevent such terrible and tragic deaths from happening again?

Nicola Sturgeon (Scottish National Party, Glasgow Southside)

Infection prevention and control is a priority in every hospital all the time, which is absolutely right and proper, as is the need to learn lessons when things go wrong. That is a daily priority for hospitals and health boards across the country.

I convey my sympathies to Sophia’s family. If the member wants to correspond with me, I am very willing to see whether there is something that the Government can do to help get the answers that Sophia’s family understandably want. In a situation such as this, it is right, and it was called for, that we have a proper independent statutory public inquiry. That is not the sign of a Government trying to cover things up; it is the sign of the opposite. It is the sign of a Government that is determined to get to the truth, determined to find the facts, determined to get the answers, and determined to learn the lessons, and that is what we should be seeing.

26th United Nations Climate Change Conference of the Parties (Impact)

Kaukab Stewart (Scottish National Party, Glasgow Kelvin)

3. To ask the First Minister what the Scottish Government anticipates the lasting impact of COP26 will be for the people of Glasgow and Scotland. (S6F-00470)

Nicola Sturgeon (Scottish National Party, Glasgow Southside)

I think that the lasting impact will be a very positive one. We can all feel pride in the leadership that Scotland, the people of Scotland and, in particular, the people of Glasgow showed during the 26th United Nations climate change conference of the parties.

I think that the outcome, although it did not go as far as many of us would have liked, will accelerate or help to accelerate our delivery of net zero, and it is important that people and communities are at the heart of that.

We are currently funding a number of projects in Glasgow through the climate challenge fund, which supports communities to reduce car reliance, cut waste, grow local food and lower energy use. We are also building a new model to support further community climate action. That will be part of the longer-term legacy from COP26 in Glasgow over two weeks.

Kaukab Stewart (Scottish National Party, Glasgow Kelvin)

For many countries in the global south, the impacts of climate change are already being felt. We have a moral responsibility to acknowledge that and to take action. The Scottish Government has led the way by providing £2 million of funding for loss and damage. That commitment has been widely welcomed, including by the secretary general of the United Nations, António Guterres, but we cannot act alone. How will the Scottish Government continue to push for climate justice globally post-COP26?

The First Minister

First, we will try to lead by example through our actions at home. That is why the decision that we have taken to increase our climate justice fund and our decision to allocate resources to the issue of loss and damage are important. That allows us to use that leadership to seek to encourage others to do likewise.

I have already had discussions on the issue with other Governments, and I know that there is a willingness now to step forward on loss and damage. We will continue to play our part in building that momentum.

It is really important that we focus on actions to mitigate climate change and to help countries to adapt to the future impacts of climate change. However, as Kaukab Stewart has rightly said, many countries across the world are suffering loss and damage right now. They are struggling to cope with that, and the developed world, which has, of course, done the most to cause climate change, has a real moral obligation to step up and play its part in helping with that. Scotland will continue to do everything that we can to play our full part.

Neil Bibby (Labour, West Scotland)

As my colleague Paul Sweeney has said, one of the positives from the COP in Glasgow was that delegates benefited from smart, integrated ticketing. The First Minister promised Scotland that almost a decade ago, but she has never delivered it. This week, Dublin is rolling out a new 90-minute ticket across buses, trams and trains. Glasgow and Scotland are falling further behind our neighbours. When will the First Minister finally make seamless and affordable public transport a reality for Scotland’s passengers?

The First Minister

That work is already under way. I will not repeat everything that I said in response to the previous question on that—it is an important question and it is an important priority—but let me repeat one point. From January next year, every young person under the age of 22 will have free bus travel in Scotland. That is a significant step forward, but it is not the end of the journey. We have to build on that to go further. However, we are taking concrete steps to make public transport more accessible and more affordable, and we will continue to make that progress in the years ahead, as we have to do a range of different things to live up to our own climate change targets.

Face-to-face Advocacy Services

Pauline McNeill (Labour, Glasgow)

4. To ask the First Minister what assessment the Scottish Government has made of the impact of reduced face-to-face advocacy services on vulnerable people, such as victims of domestic abuse. (S6F-00472)

Nicola Sturgeon (Scottish National Party, Glasgow Southside)

I commend the work of front-line advocacy services, which have worked tirelessly to ensure that people, including those experiencing domestic abuse, have been able to access support throughout the pandemic. We are in regular contact with those services to understand the challenges that they face and to support them as best we can.

Over the past 18 months, we have invested an additional £10 million to allow the rapid redesign of services and to address backlogs, and we have supported organisations such as Scottish Women’s Aid and Rape Crisis Scotland. In addition, our delivering equally safe fund recently confirmed funding for 112 organisations, which will help them to provide key services and prevent gender-based violence.

It is important that, when the issue is raised, all of us say how utterly abhorrent domestic violence is. It should never be tolerated, and, if anyone is in need of help, whether from the police or from a support agency, they should not hesitate to seek it.

Pauline McNeill (Labour, Glasgow)

I especially welcome the additional funding for the equally safe campaign. However, it is clear that the loss of face-to-face advice will have the greatest impact on the most vulnerable members of our communities. Recently, Rachel Moon, who is a senior solicitor at Govanhill Law Centre, said:

“For the ... most vulnerable in our society—those with no literacy, no English, no family or monetary support, and a history of discrimination—they need a physical place ... to see a real person to hand over their eviction documents ... we must remember those people who cannot phone, zoom, or scan documents.”

Violence against women is sadly endemic in our society and, as the First Minister has recognised, levels of domestic abuse are rising alarmingly. However, it can be impractical for people who are in a controlling and abusive relationship to seek help remotely at home. What will the Scottish Government do to review the funding that it gives to law centres and the free advice sector so that vulnerable people and women who are experiencing domestic violence have safe places where they can access face-to-face legal advice?

The First Minister

A

s I said in my initial answer, we will continue to do all that we can to ensure funding for front-line organisations that provide advocacy services. There are a range of such services—I mentioned some of them—particularly in the field of dealing with gender-based violence. There are also law centres, which I know—I used to work in a law centre, many years ago—provide valuable advice and services.

On the issue of face-to-face access versus telephone or online access, organisations themselves will often be best placed to make decisions about the correct balance. It is really important that, where necessary, people have the face-to-face option. However, I know that, during the pandemic, some organisations have found that the necessity of moving to more digital access has allowed them to extend their reach, so it is important that the balance is right.

It is challenging in the current circumstances, but I hope that our commitment to funding those organisations, as far as we possibly can, will help them to return to normal and to provide the essential services that they offer to so many people across the country.

Advocacy Services (Funding)

Alexander Stewart (Conservative, Mid Scotland and Fife)

Advocacy services are an important lifeline for many different groups, including vulnerable older people. However, even before the pandemic, reduced funding for advocacy organisations across Scotland meant that they were struggling to meet demand. Does the First Minister agree with independent advocacy services that increased funding is necessary to allow those organisations to protect vulnerable individuals’ rights?

Nicola Sturgeon (Scottish National Party, Glasgow Southside)

Yes, I do—I agree strongly with that. We do not have unlimited resources—that is a statement of fact—but, within the resources that we have, we are seeking to ensure that front-line organisations that support and provide help to vulnerable people have the funding that they need, although that will continue to be challenging.

Of course, given the range of circumstances—I am not talking specifically about domestic abuse—in which people feel the need to access advocacy support, we also need to do more to deal with the root causes of some of those things. Many people who are accessing services—citizens advice bureaux, for example—right now will be doing so because of the cuts to their benefits, given the position of destitution that that often puts people in. We all have a responsibility to support front-line services, but, equally, we all have a responsibility to try to deal with some of the root causes that lead people to need those services. I hope that the member will, on behalf of his colleagues, reflect on that.

Minimum Unit Price for Alcohol

Stuart McMillan (Scottish National Party, Greenock and Inverclyde)

5. To ask the First Minister what consideration the Scottish Government has given to increasing the minimum unit price for alcohol. (S6F-00467)

Nicola Sturgeon (Scottish National Party, Glasgow Southside)

We are absolutely committed to ensuring that, as we move forward, we have in place a level of minimum unit price that remains effective in reducing alcohol harms. At the point when minimum unit pricing was first introduced, we did not know that we would be facing a pandemic, which has had an impact on the use and consumption of alcohol. Prior to the pandemic, however, we were seeing early and very encouraging signs of a reduction in alcohol sales and in alcohol-specific deaths.

The evaluation of minimum unit pricing is on-going, and a final report from Public Health Scotland is expected in 2023. Of course, any change to the level, or to any detail, of the minimum unit pricing policy must have a robust evidence base.

Stuart McMillan (Scottish National Party, Greenock and Inverclyde)

I remind members that I am a member of Moving On Inverclyde, a local addiction service.

The First Minister will know that the most recent statistics indicated that Inverclyde had the highest level of alcohol-related deaths during the peak of the Covid pandemic. Every death is a tragedy and I offer my condolences to the people affected.

It is clear that minimum unit pricing was having a positive effect but, due to inflation, the effectiveness of the 50p unit price will have declined. Bearing in mind the fact that alcohol was 64 per cent more affordable in 2017 than it was in 1980—particularly in supermarkets and off-sales—will the First Minister consider increasing the minimum unit price in line with inflation or even slightly above that in the upcoming budget? Will she also commit to setting up an external commission to consider when future increases should occur and what level they should be?

The First Minister

I will consider any suggestions of that nature and will take Stuart McMillan’s suggestions into account.

It is really important that we do two things, which are obviously related. First, we should properly and robustly evaluate the policy of minimum unit pricing. Indeed, a commitment was given to do that when the legislation was passed and the policy was introduced. That process is under way and we will know the outcomes of the Public Health Scotland evaluation in 2023.

It is also important that we keep the level of the price under review and take account of factors such as inflation, because the level of the price is critical to ensuring that the policy continues to be effective. There were encouraging signs pre-pandemic that it was being effective, and we need to take account of changes since then. Those issues will receive on-going, careful and evidence-based consideration by the Government.

Willie Rennie (Liberal Democrat, North East Fife)

Stuart McMillan is right. It has been a decade since the 50p rate was first set, inflation is rising dramatically and the sunset clause is coming into effect soon. The First Minister and I agree on minimum unit pricing but I am concerned about the lack of urgency in her answer. We need to move faster on increasing the rate. Today, 28 organisations spoke out to say that it should be 65p. Will she back the science?

The First Minister

I hope that Willie Rennie and others accept that there are few people in the chamber more committed to the policy of minimum unit pricing than I am. I was the minister who took the legislation through the Parliament. We then had a lengthy court challenge and have been committed to the policy throughout, including at times when few people were prepared to predict that it had any chance of becoming operational. Therefore, I take those points extremely seriously.

We need to consider all the points carefully and we are doing so. I do not want to sound in any way complacent about the matter. Minimum unit pricing will have the desired effect only if it is set at an effective level.

There is one other complicating factor right now—I say this as a statement of fact, not for any other reason—and that is the United Kingdom Internal Market Act 2020. Any changes in the price, whether by inflation or any other level, could engage that act. That is a source of great concern for us and one of the many reasons why we raised such profound concerns while that act was going through the Westminster Parliament.

I hope that, as we take forward the work on minimum unit pricing, members will engage rightly and properly on the detail of where the price should be set. That must be evidence driven. I hope that we will have the support of members around the chamber if we find that the United Kingdom Internal Market Act 2020 is a serious obstacle to ensuring that minimum unit pricing remains effective, because that would be deeply regrettable, given the policy’s history and how difficult it was to get it into operation.

Gillian Mackay (Green, Central Scotland)

Sadly, alcohol-related deaths in Scotland rose by 17 per cent in 2020, to 1,190. Those devastating figures emphasise the point that action must be taken and that a range of methods, including minimum unit pricing, should be implemented to tackle harmful alcohol consumption.

I know that the Government plans to consult on the marketing of alcohol. Will the First Minister consider implementing other measures, such as mandating nutrition and health information on alcohol labels and placing a social responsibility levy on alcohol retailers?

The First Minister

Without commenting on the specific suggestions that Gillian Mackay made, although they are both important, I say in general that we remain open minded to every action that can help us to deal with the harm that alcohol misuse does. In fact, when we first proposed minimum unit pricing, it was one of, I think, 40 different actions that were put forward in our alcohol strategy.

Minimum unit pricing is important but it is not the only initiative that needs to be taken. We will consider other initiatives and very carefully consider their evidence base. Within the powers that we have, that includes the suggestions that Gillian Mackay made.

Tenants (Private Sector)

Mark Griffin (Labour, Central Scotland)

6. I draw members’ attention to my entry in the register of members’ interests, as an owner of a rented property in North Lanarkshire.

To ask the First Minister what action the Scottish Government is taking to support tenants, in light of University of Glasgow research indicating that around a quarter of private tenants are in arrears, totalling around £126 million. (S6F-00463)

Nicola Sturgeon (Scottish National Party, Glasgow Southside)

We are very much aware that rising rent costs cause hardship for tenants. Although that has been the case for many years, the pandemic has further exacerbated the financial situation for many people. That is why the Government has already taken significant action. For example, we have supported and are supporting tenants through a variety of schemes, with an additional £39 million. That includes a £10 million tenant grant fund, an increase in discretionary housing payments and a £10 million tenant hardship loan fund. This year we have committed £82 million in discretionary housing payments.

In the longer term, we have committed to tackling high rents by implementing an effective national system of rent controls by the end of 2025 and to introducing a new deal for tenants, so that there is quality, affordability and fairness at the heart of the rented sector.

Mark Griffin (Labour, Central Scotland)

I am grateful for the First Minister’s answer but, with social sector arrears growing by £9 million just between July and September this year, it is clear that arrears are set to dwarf that £10 million grant fund. To my surprise and the surprise of those in the sector, that is not even new money; it has been raided from the ending homelessness together fund. Also, the loan fund appears to be completely useless. It offers tenants in arrears more debt, and most applicants are simply refused. In the first four months of this financial year, just £42,000 was paid out.

Tenants fear a tidal wave of evictions and homelessness, yet last week’s report says that landlords want notice periods for arrears to be slashed to the pre-pandemic level of 28 days. Can the First Minister assure tenants that their rights on notice periods will not be slashed? Can she commit to rent controls in next year’s housing bill—not by 2025, as she suggested in her previous answer?

The First Minister

The member can take it from my previous answer and from the overall commitments from the Government that our objective is to strengthen the rights of tenants, not weaken them in any way. I take his points about financial assistance, although I would say that helping tenants with rent arrears is an important part of helping to prevent, and therefore end, homelessness. That point needs to be made.

In the course of the budget process, we will of course consider what more we can do to help not just tenants but others who are dealing with difficult financial circumstances right now. If the member wishes to make proposals about how we free up more money in the budget, the housing minister would be perfectly happy to have that conversation.

We are happy to engage about the timing of legislation on rent controls. The Parliament rightly wants proper time for consultation and scrutiny of proposed legislation, and we are open to discussions about the legislative programme and how quickly we can move to introduce reforms.

The reforms will be contentious. I do not believe that they will be unanimously supported within this party—within this Parliament, I mean. I hope that they will be unanimously supported within this party, but I am not sure that they will be within the Parliament. It is perhaps those members who might oppose them who are now murmuring from a sedentary position.

To be serious about it, this is a real issue. Overall, inflationary pressures from energy costs, rent and rising food prices will pose significant challenges for many people across the country, and the Government will do everything that we can within our resources to help people to deal with those pressures.

Road Safety (Falkirk)

Liam McArthur (Liberal Democrat, Orkney Islands)

The next item of business is a members’ business debate on motion S6M-01281, in the name of Stephen Kerr, on road safety in Falkirk. The debate will be concluded without any question being put.

I invite members who wish to participate to press their request-to-speak buttons or, if they are joining us online, to type R in the chat function.

Motion debated,

That the Parliament recognises efforts in Airth and Reddingmuirhead to introduce a 20mph speed limit; considers that, in busy areas, a 20mph speed limit is safer for pedestrians, in particular school children and cyclists, and notes the view that local councils should be empowered to make decisions on speed limits, acknowledging their local knowledge.

Stephen Kerr (Conservative, Central Scotland)

I am delighted to have the opportunity to speak to this motion on road safety in Falkirk. Road safety is of paramount importance and, when properly enforced, it saves lives. One of the most important factors in road safety is speed. The road safety charity Brake states that one in three fatal road crashes can be attributed to excess speed and that an average speed reduction of 1mph reduces crash frequency by 5 per cent.

Since becoming a member of the Scottish Parliament in May, I have been made aware of various community-led campaigns to improve road safety in Falkirk by reducing or enforcing speed limits. One of those campaigns is in the village of Airth and is led by Airth community council. For many years, residents have been complaining about the noise pollution and increased risk from cars, vans, lorries and even tractors ignoring the 30mph speed limit on the main street. Earlier this year, more than 100 residents took part in a survey that showed that 87 per cent of people who live in Airth backed proposals to reduce the speed limit on the main street to 20mph. Despite that support, the people of Airth are no closer to the introduction of a 20mph speed limit becoming a reality.

Reddingmuirhead and Wallacestone community council has also been leading a campaign to enforce the 30mph speed limit on Shieldhill Road. There is a school beside the road, but there is no continuous pavement on either side, so children cross the road back and forth on their walk to and from school. By itself, that is incredibly dangerous but, when we take into account data that shows that 75 per cent of the traffic on Shieldhill Road ignores the 30mph speed limit, we see how dangerous that daily walk is for the pupils of Braes high school.

In response to a letter

Michelle Thomson (Scottish National Party, Falkirk East)

I thank Stephen Kerr for securing this debate about roads in my constituency and other areas of Falkirk. I welcome his agreement with the ambition that is set out in the Scottish Government’s programme for government to make a move towards national 20mph limits where appropriate.

First, I would like to put on the record my condolences to the friends and family of the, as yet, unnamed victim in a road traffic accident in Grandsable Road, which is also in my constituency.

We should bear in mind that the motion speaks to only two areas within a network of nearly 1,000km of carriageways and over 1,700km of footpaths, cycleways and other structures. All of those are the responsibility of Falkirk Council, while our national Parliament is responsible for national strategy. I am sure that we will hear more on that from the minister in due course.

I also note that local councils already have powers to make decisions on speed limits, acknowledging local circumstances.

I will make a few remarks about the local issues contained in the motion. I am grateful to Councillor Laura Murtagh, a well-kent face in Airth and an extremely hardworking councillor, for all her efforts over a sustained period. Likewise, I am grateful to Councillor Gordon Hughes for his efforts in the Upper Braes over many years. They and other Scottish National Party councillors have been at the forefront of activities to ensure that community needs are listened to and addressed.

In the case of Airth and the A905, it is a matter of public record that Falkirk Council has undertaken numerous investigations into issues that have been reported about speed and other road-related concerns raised by local residents. Those issues have been assessed in line with advice and guidance on road safety. The investigations are publicly available and I will happily share them with my constituents and with Stephen Kerr, to ensure that he, too, is up to speed.

Alas, the available evidence does not support the introduction of a 20mph zone along that stretch of road in Airth—it is recommended neither by Police Scotland policy nor by the national guidance.

Although a 20mph zone might initially appear as a natural bonus to road safety, if it is unenforceable and in an inappropriate place without the corresponding road architecture to support it, drivers might be unlikely to observe it, which could ironically increase the danger to pedestrians.

The character of the road at Airth introduces an additional consideration, in that it runs adjacent to a stone wall and only one side of the road has a pavement. The passing of larger vehicles thus gives a feeling of being hemmed in. [

Interruption

.] The member should try to visit Airth sometime.

Local SNP councillors have led on exploring options for alternative pedestrian routes through the adjacent housing estate, and on securing agreement with some local heavy goods vehicles companies to limit their speed to 20mph when passing through the village. It was also local SNP councillors who helped to implement a spaces for people entirely closed road space in Airth.

Mr Kerr quoted a letter from the council that references Shieldhill Road. In summary, the letter notes that police records suggest that, of the three accidents that have occurred on Shieldhill Road in the past 10 years, confidence that vehicle speed was a contributory factor was noted as no more than possible in only one. That leads me to a key point. Although it is not my responsibility to act but that of Falkirk Council, it will act based on gathered evidence.

Everyone wants measures that will improve road safety. I understand that Falkirk Council roads officers are preparing a report under instruction from Councillor Paul Garner, Falkirk Council’s spokesperson for the environment. The purpose of that report is to consider the approach towards implementing a 20mph speed limit in some towns and villages in the Falkirk Council area.

The recommendations will be evidence based and consider increasing road safety for pedestrians and drivers, through local knowledge, in order to improve the lives of people, promote active and sustainable travel, climate change mitigation and place making.

Stephen Kerr (Conservative, Central Scotland)

Will the member take an intervention?

Michelle Thomson (Scottish National Party, Falkirk East)

I am already over my four minutes.

The report is expected to be presented to the executive committee in the next two months.

The Deputy Presiding Officer

You need to wind up now, Ms Thomson.

Michelle Thomson (Scottish National Party, Falkirk East)

None of the above can be confused with the national strategy, which is the job of this Parliament to determine. I draw the attention of all to the programme for government, which notes that

“all appropriate roads in built-up areas”

should

“have a safer speed limit of 20 mph by 2025”.

Richard Leonard (Labour, Central Scotland)

Down the years, Stephen Kerr and I have stood on opposite sides of the barricades. Ours is an unashamedly ideological clash and an honest and sincere political division, which stretches all the way back to the miners’ strike of 1984-85 and beyond. Given that history, there is a certain irony that it should be, of all places, the village of Airth and its community, with its strong associations with the Scottish coalfield, the mineworkers and the National Union of Mineworkers that brings us together on the same side of the argument. I thank Stephen Kerr for raising the issue.

I was in Airth on Monday with Joan Coombes, the local Labour councillor, to meet Robert Smith, the local community council’s secretary. Over the years, Robert Smith has petitioned Falkirk Council, petitioned Transport Scotland and petitioned the Scottish Government with a simple demand on behalf of the villagers of Airth: extend the 20mph zone by a distance of less than 1 mile, make it permanent and keep the community safe.

This week, as we walked alongside the A905 through the village, he said that

“People frequently get the impression that HGVs are exceeding the speed limit because of the close proximity of the vehicles to them, and the draft and slipstream caused. Many pedestrians particularly women with children, prams and pushchairs, have felt as if they were being blown off their feet.”

He is right—that is how it felt to me. I witnessed it this week, which is why the local community has my full support.

In the previous session of Parliament, Mark Ruskell proposed a member’s bill to introduce a statutory 20mph speed limit, which I was happy to sign and support. However, I recall that no Conservative MSP backed it at the time, and the bill fell before it could reach the statute book.

In this session of Parliament, we are told in the SNP-Green agreement that

“all appropriate roads in built up areas will have a safer speed limit of 20 mph by 2025”

and that

“A task group will be formed to plan the most effective route for implementation.”

As this is the first time that we have been able to debate the matter in Parliament, perhaps the minister can explain in his closing remarks what exactly that means. Is it that a default position of a 20mph limit, as was proposed in the bill in the previous session of Parliament, will be introduced, pure and simple. Is it the situation as it currently stands, or will it be somewhere in between?

For the avoidance of doubt, the position as it currently stands is set out clearly by Transport Scotland in a letter that was shown to me by Robert Smith on Monday. It says:

“The A905 is a local road and the responsibility of the local road authority, in this case Falkirk Council. Local authorities are responsible for deciding how best to meet their duties on local roads in their area”

That is why I have written to the chief executive of Falkirk Council again this week, expressing my support for an extended 20mph zone through the village of Airth. It is why I am delighted to report that it is my understanding that the proposal will now go before the council early next year.

It is also why, when I spoke to Welsh Senedd member Huw Irranca-Davies just this morning, we discussed the situation there. He confirmed that the Government in Wales is now introducing a 20mph speed limit. Local authorities have the right to reverse that if they have local support, but the burden of proof will be on them, and not the other way around. I think that that is the right position. That is where we need to be for the sake of the people of Airth, of Reddingmuirhead and of communities up and down Scotland. We are democratically elected representatives; we are sent to this Parliament to make people’s lives better, and I think that we are at our best when we show political conviction.

Tess White (Conservative, North East Scotland)

I am delighted to speak today; I pay tribute to my colleague Stephen Kerr for securing this debate on road safety in Falkirk.

Mr Kerr made a strong case for introducing a 20mph speed limit in Airth and Reddingmuirhead. Falkirk residents have been vocal in their support for the measure, with 87 per cent of respondents to a recent survey by Mr Kerr calling for a 20mph zone to be introduced on Main Street. In particular, the community complained about a lack of visible policing on Main Street and the risk to schoolchildren from speeding cars. Such concerns have been repeatedly shared with me in my region.

For local roads, I agree that councils are best placed to respond to the road safety requirements of the communities that they serve, so I caution against a top-down blanket approach being taken on 20mph zones. They can be effective at reducing casualties and accidents on the road, but they are not the only approach. Road humps, speed cushions, traffic islands, signs and markings provide alternative and sometimes more suitable traffic-calming measures. Such decisions are best taken at local authority level, based on local knowledge and community feedback.

Stephen Kerr (Conservative, Central Scotland)

Does Tess White agree that Richard Leonard’s speech was a splendid example of where we can set aside party badges and colours and do the right thing for the people who live in the communities that we are elected to serve? Does she share my disappointment about the tone of Michelle Thomson’s speech, which was highly partisan and wholly inappropriate for the subject we are discussing?

The Deputy Presiding Officer

Ms White, I can give you time back.

Tess White (Conservative, North East Scotland)

I agree with Stephen Kerr. Please could the minister not laugh from a sedentary position? The safety of children around schools is very important and—[

Interruption

.] Shame on you. I would like just like to say—

The Deputy Presiding Officer

Could you take your seat, Ms White?

Tess White (Conservative, North East Scotland)

Safety is not a laughing matter. May I continue, Presiding Officer?

The Deputy Presiding Officer

I discourage you from responding to interventions that are made from a sedentary position. I will deal with those.

Tess White (Conservative, North East Scotland)

Thank you, Presiding Officer.

Decisions on such matters are best taken at local authority level, based on local knowledge and community feedback.

I note that last year there was a 35 per cent decline in the number of road casualties across Scotland because of restrictions on travel. That significant reduction is, of course, extremely welcome.

Michelle Thomson asked for evidence. I will give her evidence. There were still almost 5,000 casualties, including 490 children. That is not a laughing matter. Six children lost their lives—

Michelle Thomson (Scottish National Party, Falkirk East)

Will the member take an intervention?

Tess White (Conservative, North East Scotland)

No. I am talking about safety, so I would like to proceed.

Six children lost their lives—that is a higher figure than in the two years prior to the pandemic—and 176 children were seriously injured. There is the evidence. Those figures provide a sobering reminder of the critical importance of road safety for all users.

Now that restrictions on travel have been lifted, and as the winter approaches, with reduced visibility and adverse weather conditions, we cannot be complacent. Traffic calming measures have an important role to play, but their success depends on drivers respecting them, and on the measures being suitably enforced, where appropriate.

I understand that Aberdeenshire Council is investigating the correlation between certain age demographics, high collision rates on the roads, the work commute and the school run. I am particularly concerned about non-compliance with 20mph zones around schools in my region. For example, I have been contacted about concerns that have been shared by parents and teachers in relation to Marykirk primary school, where drivers regularly flout the 20mph speed limit on Kirktonhill Road. There are already too many near misses on our roads. Too often, we see action being taken when it is too late. I am committed to working with the school, local councillors and the police to ensure that children are safe on the school run. I appeal to residents and visitors to the area to reduce their speed around the school in order to ensure the safety of pupils, parents and teaching staff. It is simply not worth the risk.

The Deputy Presiding Officer

I invite the minister to respond to the debate.

Graeme Dey (Scottish National Party, Angus South)

I congratulate Stephen Kerr on raising the issue of road safety, which is a very important issue not just in Falkirk but across the country, and I commend the efforts of the communities of Airth and Reddingmuirhead in promoting their concerns in that regard.

I agree that lowering speed limits in cities, towns and villages can help to make communities feel safer, not only in Falkirk but across Scotland. Tess White was right to say that the street furniture that accompanies such speed limits is equally important.

However, I must reiterate that the roads in and around the communities of Airth and Reddingmuirhead are local roads. Given the varied nature of Scotland’s urban road network and the number of factors that need to be considered in setting appropriate limits, the Scottish Government’s position remains that decisions on setting speed limits on local roads are best taken by individual local authorities, which can and do successfully implement 20mph limits where it is appropriate to do so. That is the case elsewhere in these islands, in England and Northern Ireland, although Richard Leonard was right to say that Wales has taken a different path.

The Road Traffic Act 1988 places a statutory duty on local authorities to promote road safety and to take steps to reduce and prevent accidents. Where data supports it, that can include the setting of appropriate speed limits. Therefore, local authorities do not require further powers to assist them with such things. It is not for the Scottish ministers to intervene in councils’ day-to-day performance of those duties.

Stephen Kerr (Conservative, Central Scotland)

Can the minister understand the frustration of the people of Airth about the fact that motorists who continue along the A905 towards Stirling will find that, once they have left the jurisdiction of Falkirk Council and entered that of Stirling Council, there are 20mph speed limits on the A905 there? They are deeply frustrated by the lack of action. I am afraid that Michelle Thomson’s speech reflected the tone of the response that those people have been getting from her colleagues in Falkirk Council for some time.

Graeme Dey (Scottish National Party, Angus South)

As someone who represents a constituency, of course I understand local communities’ concerns in such areas, but I will not get dragged into discussing the basis on which a 20mph zone has been set in one area but not in another. As Michelle Thomson rightly pointed out, the approach that is taken must be evidence based.

Richard Leonard (Labour, Central Scotland)

Will the minister take an intervention?

Graeme Dey (Scottish National Party, Angus South)

No. I want to make some progress.

All that said, the Government encourages implementation of 20mph speed limits and zones in appropriate environments. In 2016, we published the “Good Practice Guide on 20 mph Speed Restrictions”. The guidance offers flexibility to local authorities on the setting of local 20mph speed limits when that is right for the individual road, with local needs being reflected and all local considerations being taken into account. The guidance aims to provide clarity to councils on all the options that are available when setting 20mph speed limits throughout Scotland. I assure members that the Scottish Government is committed to facilitating further the lowering of speed limits in cities, towns and villages.

Graham Simpson (Conservative, Central Scotland)

The minister rightly points out that the guidance gives councils flexibility. The problem is that many councils do not show that flexibility and instead hide behind the guidance. Having been a councillor, I have experience of that. Some councils just present the guidance, which is used as an excuse for not doing anything. That is done instead of showing common sense, which in this case would be to set a 20mph zone.

Graeme Dey (Scottish National Party, Angus South)

Let us move on to what is coming down the track in that regard. As Michelle Thomson rightly pointed out, there is a commitment in the programme for government that all appropriate roads in built-up areas will have a safer speed limit of 20mph by 2025.

Reducing traffic speed to 20mph in the right environments can be a positive step in making our towns and cities friendlier and safer places, where people are confident to walk and cycle more often.

The importance of appropriate speeds is reflected in “Scotland’s Road Safety Framework to 2030”, which has a vision for Scotland to have the best road safety performance in the world. The framework also supports active travel and sets out that Scotland’s communities should be shaped around people, with walking and cycling being the most popular choice for short everyday journeys.

On the questions that Richard Leonard posed, we have committed in the framework’s first delivery plan to developing a national strategy for the expansion of 20mph zones or limits in Scotland. The strategy will introduce a package of measures to support a range of policies. It will tackle the perception of road danger, encourage people to walk, wheel and cycle, and will create more pleasant streets and neighbourhoods.

In relation to a point that was made earlier, a multistakeholder task force has been set up, and its membership has been agreed. At its first meeting, which will be early in the new year, participation and input from local authorities will be key. The parameters of the group’s work, as well as its membership, have been established. A series of options will be considered, ranging from the status quo to substantial change, so all the points that members have made, and their stances, will be covered.

I reiterate that, as I said at the outset, decisions on deployment of 20mph limits on local roads, when that is deemed appropriate, should and must be made at the local level.

13:18 Meeting suspended.

14:15 On resuming—

Scottish Parliamentary Corporate Body Question Time

Annabelle Ewing (Scottish National Party, Cowdenbeath)

Good afternoon. I remind members that Covid-related measures are in place and that face coverings should be worn when moving around the chamber and across the Holyrood campus.

The next item of business is Scottish Parliamentary Corporate Body question time. I ask members who wish to request a supplementary question to press their request-to-speak button now or indicate in the chat function by entering the letter R during the relevant question. Succinct questions and answers would be much appreciated.

Local Offices and Surgeries (Security)

Jamie Greene (Conservative, West Scotland)

1. To ask the Scottish Parliamentary Corporate Body, in light of reported concerns, what consideration it is giving to additional funding for increased security personnel and security for MSPs’ surgeries and local offices. (S6O-00413)

Claire Baker (Labour, Mid Scotland and Fife)

At our meeting on 4 November, we considered options for further security support that could be made available to members following the death of Sir David Amess.

We recognise that any changes to security provision would be expected to have budget implications. However, the corporate body is clear that the safety of members and their staff should not be compromised on the ground of cost.

We have commissioned the following urgent work: a review of advice regarding lone working in local offices, including extending the provision of lone work devices; working with Police Scotland to introduce an annual security briefing targeted to issues in members’ regions; and a project to establish how to effectively provide security support to MSPs at surgery meetings, including an assessment of the viability of providing security operatives, if appropriate.

As Jamie Greene will appreciate, these matters are too sensitive to discuss in a public forum, so the corporate body has agreed that a fuller security update will be shared with members soon.

Jamie Greene (Conservative, West Scotland)

I appreciate the sensitive nature of the discussions. Everyone in the chamber sends their thoughts and condolences to the friends and family of Sir David Amess.

No one in public office, public service or politics should go to work and not come home. We have a duty to protect our staff and members of the public who attend our surgeries and local offices, but we are keen to be as accessible as possible.

Has consideration been given to offering a centralised approach to the procurement of a third party security presence for those members who feel that they need it? Are members who want to contract services privately now free to do that? Will their current office provision allow them to do so?

Claire Baker (Labour, Mid Scotland and Fife)

Jamie Greene raises important points, and I appreciate his comments about the security of members and their staff.

The Parliament currently offers a centrally managed security upgrade for local offices, although members can choose to go ahead and contract work themselves. I advise members to contact the Parliament’s security office to discuss the matter further if they wish to proceed with security measures.

MSP Staff Allowances

Jackie Baillie (Labour, Dumbarton)

2. To ask the Scottish Parliamentary Corporate Body when it will make a decision regarding the level of MSP allowances for staff for 2022-23. (S6O-00407)

Jackson Carlaw (Conservative, Eastwood)

All my antennae have been trained to suppose that that is a trick question, because I think that Ms Baillie knows the answer to her question even better than I do.

The SPCB will submit its 2022-23 budget for consideration at the Finance and Public Administration Committee meeting on 21 December. It will include the proposed uprating of the staff cost provision for 2022-23.

Jackie Baillie (Labour, Dumbarton)

I would never ask a trick question—I assure you of that, Presiding Officer.

I am delighted to hear the timetable. When the Scottish Parliament last uprated the staff salary allowance, it did so on the basis of the annual survey of hours and earnings, and average weekly earnings.

At that time, ASHE and AWE generated an increase of 2.96 per cent. This time, according to the Scottish Parliament information centre, the comparable figure from those sources would be 4.4 per cent. Is that the figure that will be applied effective from 1 April 2022?

Jackson Carlaw (Conservative, Eastwood)

It would probably be inappropriate of me to pre-empt the presentation of the budget to the Finance and Public Administration Committee. However, Ms Baillie is absolutely correct that we have been using the measures that she has suggested to uprate the office and staff cost provision.

Trade Unions (Meetings)

Paul Sweeney (Labour, Glasgow)

3.

To ask the Scottish Parliamentary Corporate Body when it last met trade unions representing Scottish parliamentary service and MSP staff. (S6O-00406)

Jackson Carlaw (Conservative, Eastwood)

The corporate body has a partnership arrangement with the Scottish parliamentary service’s three recognised trade unions—the Public and Commercial Services Union, Prospect and the FDA. Parliament officials regularly meet those unions on a range of employment matters. The last formal partnership board meeting took place in October this year.

The SPCB has had no recent meetings with trade unions representing MSP staff.

Paul Sweeney (Labour, Glasgow)

As a member of the GMB trade union, I welcome the strong relationship with trade unions representing parliamentary staff, but such a relationship is sorely lacking when it comes to the unions that represent the staff that members and party groups employ. If we truly value the principles of fair work and giving workers a stake in decisions affecting them in this place, surely the SPCB, as the ultimate financial controller of the allowances that we use to pay our staff, must properly engage regularly with trade unions such as the GMB.

Jackson Carlaw (Conservative, Eastwood)

I understand that various party groupings have arrangements with trade unions, but the SPCB has no locus to do so in relation to MSPs’ staff. The SPCB is responsible for funding of the reimbursement of members’ expenses scheme, including the staff cost provision, and for determining which indices are used to uprate the overall provisions of the scheme.

In 2020, the SPCB reviewed the indices used for the uprating of the scheme and, in so doing, was made aware of representations from trade unions representing MSPs’ staff. The SPCB agreed to use a basket of indices for uprating the SCP on the basis that it would provide a more steady basis for future increases.

We do that on the basis that individual MSPs remain responsible, as employers of their staff, for setting and managing their staff’s pay and cost of living increases, within the provisions of the expenses scheme. That is not within the locus of the SPCB, as we are not the employer of MSPs’ staff; MSPs themselves are.

Armed Forces Reservists

Jackie Dunbar (Scottish National Party, Aberdeen Donside)

4.

To ask the Scottish Parliamentary Corporate Body what support it provides to MSPs in connection with the employment of armed forces reservists, and to armed forces reservists who work for the Scottish Parliament or MSPs. (S6O-00420)

Jackson Carlaw (Conservative, Eastwood)

The corporate body is committed to supporting members of the reserve forces or those wishing to join the reserve forces. Staff who are armed forces reservists are entitled to take five days paid special leave each year to attend training. MSPs, as the employers of their staff, also have discretion to grant the same entitlement to their staff.

Reservists who are mobilised for acts of service are protected in law from detriment, such as the termination of their employment, because they have been called up to acts of service.

Jackie Dunbar (Scottish National Party, Aberdeen Donside)

Mobilisation of reservists can sometimes happen at short notice, leaving employers with unplanned training and recruitment costs. The Ministry of Defence acknowledges that and reflects it in the form of compensation provided to non-public sector employers. Would the SPCB consider making additional budget available to MSPs who have staff mobilised, to cover expenses arising from mobilisation?

Jackson Carlaw (Conservative, Eastwood)

That is an interesting suggestion and it is one that I shall take back and discuss with my colleagues on the corporate body.

The Deputy Presiding Officer

Question 5 is

from James Dornan, who, hopefully, is joining us remotely.

If I cue him in again, that might work. I call James Dornan.

We will slightly change the order of questions, to see if we can sort out whatever technical difficulty has arisen.

Heating and Ventilation

Emma Roddick (Scottish National Party, Highlands and Islands)

6.

To ask the Scottish Parliamentary Corporate Body what review has been undertaken of heating the Parliament building, in light of the updated ventilation requirements. (S6O-00417)

Claire Baker (Labour, Mid Scotland and Fife)

Ventilation of workplaces is an increasingly important mitigation in limiting the spread of Covid-19 and other viruses. A review of the ventilation system at Holyrood took place earlier this year, which confirmed that the mechanical ventilation systems at Holyrood are working well.

There is a building management system at Holyrood, which monitors temperatures across the campus. It controls the temperature during the preset hours of occupancy and automatically activates the heating system if temperatures fall below a certain point. However, there are parts of the building that rely on natural ventilation, which means opening windows, vents and doors to provide sufficient fresh air.

Emma Roddick (Scottish National Party, Highlands and Islands)

Given the importance of staying safe and healthy this year more than ever, can the corporate body advise what the ambient temperature should be in the Parliament building, specifically in offices? Can it outline what support can be given to members’ staff and SPCB staff to ensure that they have a comfortable and safe working environment?

Claire Baker (Labour, Mid Scotland and Fife)

I appreciate that this can be a challenging building to heat, and that the temperature varies between different parts of the building. I would urge the member to contact facilities management and report any issues if there is a particular concern about her own circumstances or that of staff. Facilities management staff will work quickly to resolve any issues.

We are facing winter, and we are trying to find a balance between sufficient ventilation and making sure that members and the staff are comfortable in their workspaces.

Collective Decision Making

Stephen Kerr (Conservative, Central Scotland)

7. To ask the Scottish Parliamentary Corporate Body what its position is on collective decision making, following media reports of division, regarding the security of MSPs and the Scottish Parliament building. (S6O-00412)

Claire Baker (Labour, Mid Scotland and Fife)

As the member will know, members of the corporate body are elected by the Parliament, and when they are acting as members of the corporate body, they do so in a non-party-political manner. All members of the SPCB are entitled to their views on the range of significant policy, operational and resourcing decisions that are considered by the corporate body. However, at the end of the day, any decision is taken in the name of the corporate body, and that is what is important.

Stephen Kerr (Conservative, Central Scotland)

We all found out about the Parliament’s designated status through Maggie Chapman’s briefing of the press. I have been on a number of boards of directors through my years, and I cannot fathom a situation in which a board member would publicly criticise one of our decisions as a board and retain their place on that board. One simply cannot work in a situation where one person is intent on sabotaging the collective decisions of the board. Does the corporate body agree that any of its members who publicly undermine its decisions should resign from the board?

Claire Baker (Labour, Mid Scotland and Fife)

The member raises the issue in his characteristic fashion, and his views are noted. I say to him that the minutes of each meeting are published, our work is transparent and open to scrutiny, and the corporate body operates on a collegiate basis. Of course, as the member would expect, there can be differing views, and that is to be encouraged as they are important in shaping our decisions. Our discussions often reflect the wide range of views that might be shared by members in the chamber as well as wider society. The important thing is that all decisions are fully discussed and determined in the name of the corporate body and are not party political. I am satisfied that members of the corporate body are working effectively in a co-operative way.

Scottish Parliament Website

Clare Adamson (Scottish National Party, Motherwell and Wishaw)

8. To ask the Scottish Parliamentary Corporate Body what action it has taken to assess the effectiveness and utility of the new Scottish Parliament website. (S6O-00414)

Maggie Chapman (Green, North East Scotland)

We use web analytics and user research and feedback to assess the effectiveness of the website on an on-going basis. We have a continuous improvement programme for taking forward work on the Parliament website, and we use the insights from that to inform how to prioritise various bits of work. We are proactive in seeking feedback. For example, we are about to launch an online user survey to gather further information.

Clare Adamson (Scottish National Party, Motherwell and Wishaw)

I am not speaking for myself: I have had conversations with colleagues, students, stakeholders and constituents who are having trouble finding the information that they need on the new website. For example, the pages in the committee section are difficult to navigate and they list meetings without any context, unlike the previous website. It is frustrating to me, as a convener who inherited two different session 5 committees, that the dropdowns that were on the old website have now been changed, making it very difficult to search the

Official Report

.

I am concerned that this could cause reputational damage to the Parliament. I ask the corporate body to consider having an independent review that includes a comparison with the websites of other legislatures—[

Interruption

.] Apologies, Presiding Officer.

The Deputy Presiding Officer

That is okay. Had you finished?

Clare Adamson (Scottish National Party, Motherwell and Wishaw)

Yes.

The Deputy Presiding Officer

I call Maggie Chapman.

Maggie Chapman (Green, North East Scotland)

I think that some of the frustrations that the member has outlined are shared by members of the corporate body as well. In response, my answer is that no website is ever finished. We have an on-going programme of changes and enhancements to make to the website, and it is informed by feedback—the member’s feedback and that of others.

The previous website was over 10 years old and built on outdated technology that was no longer supported, so we had to make substantial changes to the technical side of the website to make improvements.

We know that there are things that we need to adapt. For example, the search function is part of on-going work. We have already made changes to filtering options and that kind of thing in response to feedback, and other improvements will be made by the end of this financial year. Things such as committee reports and Scottish Parliament information centre briefings are currently on a different site, which makes things difficult. We are in the process of creating the uniform site, which should be done in the next few months.

School Visits (Budget)

Paul McLennan (Scottish National Party, East Lothian)

9. To ask the Scottish Parliamentary Corporate Body what the Scottish Parliament’s budget is for both inbound and outbound school visits. (S6O-00419)

Maggie Chapman (Green, North East Scotland)

Before Covid, our education services offered three different support packages to schools: a visit to the Scottish Parliament; a visit to the school; and resources for independent use by the teacher in the classroom. The average annual spend across 2018 to 2020 was £194,260. The cost of providing inward and outward visits was roughly equal, at £97,802 for inward visits and £96,458 for outward visits, including travel costs.

We are budgeting for a similar amount in 2022-23, as we anticipate a gradual return to pre-Covid demand and service levels towards the end of this academic year. In 2020-21 and 2021-22, we have not been travelling, and have ensured that the budget has been available to support other areas of the Parliament where required.

Paul McLennan (Scottish National Party, East Lothian)

Which schools, if any, are regulars? How can schools that do not engage or that are in harder-to-reach areas be encouraged?

Maggie Chapman (Green, North East Scotland)

There are a couple of things to consider. We want to ensure that the offer that we make to schools is available for all schools, regardless of their proximity to Parliament or regularity of engagement. The team has been doing work to reach out to schools over the past few months. We are reaching new schools and are trying to enhance that engagement to ensure that we do not see some schools with repeated engagement while other areas are neglected or out of touch.

Local Offices (Ventilation)

Stuart McMillan (Scottish National Party, Greenock and Inverclyde)

10. To ask the Scottish Parliamentary Corporate Body what assistance it will provide to MSPs to make improvements to the ventilation of their local offices, in order to support their reopening when that decision is taken. (S6O-00408)

Claire Baker (Labour, Mid Scotland and Fife)

As recognised in a previous answer, ventilation of workplaces is an increasingly important mitigation in limiting the spread of Covid-19. The SPCB recognises the different types of premises that members have for their local offices, so a range of support will be put in place.

First, general advice is being prepared that will point members and their staff towards helpful information that is available from the Scottish Government and the Health and Safety Executive. As part of that guidance, tools will be available that can be used to identify where ventilation improvements may be needed. Secondly, a drop-in ventilation clinic will be run online later this month—officials will be in touch with details. Thirdly, specialist expertise will be made available over the telephone or in person for offices that have particularly complex or unclear requirements.

Stuart McMillan (Scottish National Party, Greenock and Inverclyde)

At some point, we will be allowed to fully reopen our constituency offices. Will the Scottish Parliamentary Corporate Body prioritise those members whose offices are shop fronts or on high streets, where other challenges will also have an effect? I am sure that colleagues across the chamber want to ensure that their staff who work in those offices have a healthy and clean working environment.

Claire Baker (Labour, Mid Scotland and Fife)

Stuart McMillan will appreciate that the priority so far has been ensuring that Holyrood can operate as safely as possible. That has, rightly, been the focus. However, local offices will need to be given support to carry out risk assessments around how to operate those premises safely. The focus will now shift towards local offices and addressing ventilation considerations there. I recognise the importance of meeting the needs of all offices. Members have various arrangements and challenges in relation to achieving a safe workplace for their staff and constituents. The corporate body will look at that closely as we develop plans for the reopening of offices.

MSP Annual Reports

John Mason (Scottish National Party, Glasgow Shettleston)

11. To ask the Scottish Parliamentary Corporate Body whether members’ annual reports can be delivered after 4 February 2022 and, if not, what the reasons are for its position on the matter. (S6O-00409)

Jackson Carlaw (Conservative, Eastwood)

As per the allowances notice that was issued to all members on 10 November, members’ annual reports cannot be issued in the period between 5 February 2022 and the local authority election on 5 May 2022 inclusive, in line with the SPCB’s long-standing policy on members’ publications.

The corporate body has taken that long-standing position to ensure the neutrality of any election without any undue or perceived influence—intentional or unintentional—coming through the issuing of members’ parliamentary funded publications. Advance notice has been provided to enable members to plan the issuing of their publications over the next three months prior to the deadline. Annual reports and other parliamentary funded publications can be issued as normal following the election.

John Mason (Scottish National Party, Glasgow Shettleston)

If the main reason is that it is a long-standing decision, I do not accept that every long-standing decision is necessarily the correct one. It seems to me that three months is an excessively long period to stop members—especially, perhaps, new members—issuing important annual reports. Parliament stopped six weeks before the election last year, for example. Six weeks seems to me to be a more reasonable time than three months.

Jackson Carlaw (Conservative, Eastwood)

I thank Mr Mason for that observation.

The corporate body last considered the matter in 2019, in the previous session, in relation to the unexpected United Kingdom general election. At that point, it agreed that it remained vital to maintain the prohibited period and the neutrality that comes with not issuing such publications.

I have some sympathy with Mr Mason’s argument, but I think that there is the potential, when the Scottish Parliament is sitting—I note that the UK Parliament does not fund such publications—for publications submitted by members of the Scottish Parliament to include people who might be standing in the local authority election, for example. There is that opportunity, however intentional or unintentional. That would be an unreasonable use of parliamentary resources and would potentially breach the intended political neutrality of the annual reports, which are for members to communicate with their constituents. We give as much notice as we do to allow people to make proper provision so that they can fit within the schedule.

Services Outwith Usual Hours

Willie Coffey (Scottish National Party, Kilmarnock and Irvine Valley)

12. To ask the Scottish Parliamentary Corporate Body what consideration has been given to providing parliamentary services outwith usual hours. (S6O-00421)

Maggie Chapman (Green, North East Scotland)

The SPCB recognises the importance of providing flexible and responsive parliamentary services that support MSPs and their staff in fulfilling their roles. The pandemic has shown us new ways of working, and there are lessons, such as the value of extending information technology support until the end of members’ business, that we can take forward in our response to the pandemic and more broadly in relation to the provision of services.

Providing comprehensive parliamentary services has to be balanced with staff rotas and shifts, a commitment to fair work employment practices, and the budgetary constraints that the Parliament works within. The SPCB is discussing how services may be able to adapt and improve post pandemic. We will seek to take members’ views as part of that so that we can ensure that we are providing excellent parliamentary services to support members and the way in which they choose to work.

Willie Coffey (Scottish National Party, Kilmarnock and Irvine Valley)

I thank my colleague for that answer. I am content with that response and am happy to allow us to move on to the next item of business.

The Deputy Presiding Officer

Jamie Greene has a supplementary question.

Jamie Greene (Conservative, West Scotland)

When is it likely that cross-party groups will be able to meet in person? Cross-party groups are a vital function of the Parliament and enable members of the public to engage with members and their Parliament. I am sure that all of us would like to see them running as soon as possible, given that other members of the public are already coming into the Parliament for other functions.

Maggie Chapman (Green, North East Scotland)

Jamie Greene is right: CPGs and others are eager to get back to meeting in person. We review that on a regular, on-going basis, and we balance mitigations and the risk of virus transmission in the building. We hope that we will have an update prior to the Christmas recess, before we return in January.

The Deputy Presiding Officer

It has not been possible to hook up with James Dornan, so that concludes Scottish Parliamentary Corporate Body question time.

Rural Affairs and Islands

Annabelle Ewing (Scottish National Party, Cowdenbeath)

The next item of business is portfolio question time, on the rural affairs and islands portfolio. I remind members that questions 3 and 7 are grouped together, and I will therefore take supplementaries on those questions after they have both been answered. Otherwise, if a member wishes to request a supplementary question, they should press their request-to-speak button or indicate so in the chat function by entering R during the relevant question.

Avian Influenza

Claire Baker (Labour, Mid Scotland and Fife)

1. To ask the Scottish Government how it is ensuring that keepers of birds and poultry, and the general public, are informed and able to respond to cases of the avian influenza virus. (S6O-00388)

Mairi Gougeon (Scottish National Party, Angus North and Mearns)

T

he Scottish Government, through its operational partners, has written to all known poultry keepers in the avian influenza protection and surveillance zone in Angus to inform them of the mandatory biosecurity controls that are in place and where to get help.

The Scottish Government meets key poultry industry stakeholders regularly to discuss the avian influenza situation. Keepers of poultry or other captive birds, as well as members of the public, are routinely informed of current risk levels, disease outbreak information, disease prevention guidance and the introduction of mandatory heightened biosecurity measures through social media, SMS messages, news releases and updates on the Government’s website.

Claire Baker (Labour, Mid Scotland and Fife)

A

s the cabinet secretary said, there have been cases in Angus, as well as in my Mid Scotland and Fife region. The United Kingdom is currently an avian influenza prevention zone, which means that strict biosecurity measures are in place. More than one million households across Britain now keep chickens, but registration is a legal requirement only for keepers of larger flocks. How confident is the cabinet secretary that those with smaller numbers of birds are keeping up to date with their responsibilities, including self-assessment in relation to the prevention zone status? What is the Scottish Government doing to ensure that that is the case?

Mairi Gougeon (Scottish National Party, Angus North and Mearns)

I completely accept the member’s point and the concern that she raises regarding other keepers; our communications are vital in that regard. The risk of incursion of avian influenza from migratory birds across the globe is continually assessed, and it was the recent reports that triggered the campaign messaging by the Scottish Government to encourage preparedness ahead of the anticipated outbreak season.

As I said in my initial response, the Government promotes preventative messaging using our social media channels, news releases and other media, and we use those methods to reach out specifically to our audiences in rural areas, where much of the livestock are kept. There are challenges in trying to reach smaller backyard keepers of fewer than 50 birds, but I assure Claire Baker, and other members in the chamber, that we are working hard to ensure that our communications reach them.

Emma Roddick (Scottish National Party, Highlands and Islands)

Given that the outbreak of avian influenza is affecting other UK nations—cases have been recently confirmed in England and Wales—can the cabinet secretary outline what engagement the Scottish Government has had with the Department for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs on the matter?

Mairi Gougeon (Scottish National Party, Angus North and Mearns)

I am happy to do so. The Scottish Government meets daily, in a range of meetings, with DEFRA, the Welsh Government and the Northern Ireland Executive’s Department of Agriculture, Environment and Rural Affairs, to take stock of current outbreaks and the on-going actions that are being taken to try to control the disease.

We also meet operational partners and key stakeholders daily, to keep apprised of the current situation, and to share information on actions that are being taken to control the disease at infected premises and the surrounding area and on the tracing and surveillance activity that is required to try to prevent the spread of disease.

The most recent assessment of the current risk for wild birds, poultry and other captive birds from highly pathogenic avian influenza in the UK and Europe was published on 10 November. Work is under way to update that with the most recent findings, and the chief veterinary officers of the UK will need to discuss the assessment’s findings and whether further preventative actions need to be taken.

Rural Economy (North East Scotland)

Douglas Lumsden (Conservative, North East Scotland)

2. To ask the Scottish Government how it is supporting the rural economy in the north-east. (S6O-00389)

Mairi Gougeon (Scottish National Party, Angus North and Mearns)

The Scottish Government provides significant support to the rural economy in the north-east through its £125 million contribution towards the Aberdeen city region deal, and through a further £254 million investment alongside that to support road, rail, housing and digital projects across the region.

Working with partners, communities and other stakeholders, our investment in innovation, digital connectivity and infrastructure will help to diversify the regional economy, create new jobs and aid in the transition to a net zero economy. That includes work, on which Scottish Enterprise leads, to deliver a number of transformational projects in the north-east.

Within the Aberdeen City region deal, the £21 million seedpod project, which has been co-created with industry, will provide support to help the region become a leader in low-carbon food production and environmental sustainability.

Douglas Lumsden (Conservative, North East Scotland)

Non-delivery of the reaching 100 per cent—R100—broadband programme in the north-east and rural Scotland is seriously hindering businesses, communities and the delivery of national health service care while increasing rural inequalities. It recently emerged in

The Press and Journal

that the roll-out has slipped again to the end of the 2026-27 financial year. How will the Scottish Government compensate our rural communities for the six-year broadband delay that it has caused?

Mairi Gougeon (Scottish National Party, Angus North and Mearns)

I am sorry, but I simply refuse to accept the member’s assertion, given that the programme is a reserved matter and that the Scottish Government has gone above and beyond to pay for the roll-out of the infrastructure. That job should have been done, and that investment should have been made, by the United Kingdom Government.

Gillian Martin (Scottish National Party, Aberdeenshire East)

Seed potato merchants in my constituency have been in touch with me to ask for my support for their letter to the Prime Minister, as they face exclusion from exporting to European Union markets and Northern Ireland as a result of the Brexit deal. My constituents say that the UK Government has made no attempt to protect them, and has, instead, allowed EU imports of seed potatoes to England, Wales and Northern Ireland.

What communication has the Scottish Government had with its UK Government counterparts on that matter, and how is it assisting the seed potato sector, which is vital to the north-east rural economy?

Mairi Gougeon (Scottish National Party, Angus North and Mearns)

The member is right: it is a vital industry, particularly in the areas that we both represent and across the north-east. The Scottish Government absolutely shares the concerns that the seed potato industry has raised.

The Scottish seed and ware potato industry is a vital part of our successful rural economy, particularly in the north-east as I said. Regrettably, the situation is another example of a Scottish industry being disproportionately impacted by EU exit. It is also an example of the UK Government’s failure to secure through negotiations with the EU an outcome that could have protected that key Scottish industry as far as possible from the impacts of EU exit.

Finding a resolution to the situation is an absolute priority for the Scottish Government. We have raised concerns with the UK Government from the outset about the serious impact on the seed potato market of losing access to the EU and Northern Ireland market. That includes raising the matter in the regular meetings of the interministerial groups, as well as engaging regularly with our UK Government counterparts and seed potato industry representatives.

The Scottish Government has written to the Secretary of State for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs to request an urgent update on progress on the UK equivalence application with the EU for our seed potatoes, as well as to seek assurance that Scottish seed potato producers will not be placed at a commercial disadvantage against suppliers from the EU in supplying seed to ware potato growers in England while we do not have reciprocal trade with the EU.

Food and Drink Supply Chain (Staff Shortages)

Kaukab Stewart (Scottish National Party, Glasgow Kelvin)

3. To ask the Scottish Government, in relation to the impact on the food and drink supply chain, what its response is to a recent survey of 1,000 United Kingdom businesses by Gallagher, which reportedly found that many businesses have been affected by a shortage of staff because of the Covid-19 pandemic and the impact of Brexit regulations. (S6O-00390)

Mairi Gougeon (Scottish National Party, Angus North and Mearns)

I am aware of the report that Gallagher has published. Although much of the detail covers the retail sector, its findings nonetheless provide further evidence, as Covid-19 continues to ravage our society and economy, of the extraordinary recklessness of a hard Brexit that took us out of the European Union, single market and customs union.

Kaukab Stewart (Scottish National Party, Glasgow Kelvin)

In the light of that research, does the cabinet secretary share my view that the pursuit of a hard Brexit, which has been forced on Scotland at the height of an unprecedented public health crisis, amounts to nothing less than an act of governmental vandalism that put ideology ahead of the needs of our economy?

Mairi Gougeon (Scottish National Party, Angus North and Mearns)

I absolutely agree with that. More important, industry would agree with that, too. James Withers, the chief executive of Scotland Food & Drink, said:

“Brexit has been an enormous shock to the labour market; a Brexit implemented in the middle of a pandemic, when supply chains were already straining.”

There is no doubt that the harm that is being caused by Brexit to Scotland’s economy, especially in the rural parts of it, for which I have responsibility, will be long lasting. The most recent research suggests that many exporters are thinking about relocating to mainland Europe. That is really depressing, if not entirely unexpected, given that our exporters have been facing barriers to trade for nearly a year now, which has created a completely unlevel playing field with importers.

We continue to do all that we can within the powers and resources that we have to support our businesses and exporters. I think that the solution is increasingly clear: for Scotland to vote for independence and rejoin the EU.

Food and Drink Industry and Supply Chain (Staff and Skills Shortages)

Clare Adamson (Scottish National Party, Motherwell and Wishaw)

7. To ask the Scottish Government what recent engagement it has had with the Secretary of State for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs regarding reports of labour and skills shortages in the food and drink industry and supply chain. (S6O-00394)

Mairi Gougeon (Scottish National Party, Angus North and Mearns)

I have written to the United Kingdom Government a number of times, most recently on 2 November. In that letter, I again requested a meeting with the secretary of state and the Home Office. I await the UK Government’s response to that, as well as to all other previous communication.

Despite agreeing to meaningful engagement on migration, the UK Government has dismissed our proposals for addressing the acute labour shortage crisis. The UK Government simply has to improve its engagement with not only the Scottish Government but all devolved Administrations, as well as with industry.

Clare Adamson (Scottish National Party, Motherwell and Wishaw)

As was pointed out by my colleague Jim Fairlie on Channel 4’s “The Political Slot”, one of Scotland’s great strengths is our natural larder. Food industry leaders have been clear, however: Brexit has led to a critical shortage of pickers and processors. The UK Government’s ad hoc visa scheme is bureaucratic and is not fit to address the chaos caused by Brexit. Has the minister had any engagement with her UK Government counterparts regarding changes to the visa scheme that would allow us to welcome back valued food workers and to build resilience into our supply chains?

Mairi Gougeon (Scottish National Party, Angus North and Mearns)

Yes, I have. We have sought to engage constructively with the UK Government on so many different occasions. The frustration is that that has been to little avail. On the back of raising this matter at the most recent interministerial group meeting in

September, together with ministers from Wales and Northern Ireland, we had a follow-up meeting with the minister, Victoria Prentis, at which we were assured that our concerns would be looked into and that DEFRA would arrange a meeting between us and the Home Office. That was two months ago now, and we are still waiting on a response to that.

As I said, it is hugely frustrating that we continually pursue these matters, which are critical to our food and drink industry right across the supply chain, but we are repeatedly ignored. This is the single biggest issue that is raised with me by food and drink businesses right across the supply chain. We need the UK Government to listen and to act to address these serious matters.

Liam McArthur (Liberal Democrat, Orkney Islands)

The cabinet secretary will recall that, earlier this year, a seafood trade group was established within Government to provide additional capacity to help seafood exporters to deal with the increased bureaucracy arising from the UK’s exit from the European Union. Given that the issues facing seafood exporters, including the Orkney Fishermen’s Society in my constituency, are likely to continue for some time, will the cabinet secretary commit to keeping in place that valuable additional resource?

Mairi Gougeon (Scottish National Party, Angus North and Mearns)

The member is absolutely right. Establishing the group to deal with the issues that we are facing has been a critical piece of work. As I have just outlined, I do not think that the issues will go away any time soon; they will probably be with us for some time to come. I assure the member that our commitment to delivering a seafood trade strategy, together with all the work that is on-going and the work that recognises the importance of sustainable fisheries, will continue, irrespective of the internal structures that we have to deliver that work. I will, of course, consider the issue closely and carefully.

Carol Mochan (Labour, South Scotland)

The minister is aware that for those in our most deprived areas, an equally important issue, which is relevant to supply chains and the food and drink industry, is that of affordable access to sufficient amounts of nutritious food. Can the minister explain why the Scottish National Party and Green MSPs failed to support the progress of a right to food bill at the committee stage last month? What action is the Scottish Government taking to address hunger and food insecurity, particularly in our rural communities?

Mairi Gougeon (Scottish National Party, Angus North and Mearns)

I am happy to provide a response to that question, because we fundamentally believe in a right to food, but we have already said that the vehicle for that will be the human rights bill that will be introduced to the Parliament. The right to food is integral to other human rights, so it is only right and fair that it is considered as part of the bill.

However, that is only part of our work. At the start of October, we introduced the Good Food Nation (Scotland) Bill to the Parliament for consideration. We have also been consulting on a draft local food strategy, and that consultation is open until 2 December. Again, I encourage members to spread the word about that and fill in the consultation, because it is this Government’s intention to make sure that everybody who lives in Scotland has a right to and is able to access good, healthy, local and nutritious food, and we are absolutely committed to delivering on that.

Beatrice Wishart (Liberal Democrat, Shetland Islands)

The northern isles are at the end of the supply chain and rely heavily on lifeline ferry services for incoming freight. What assurances can the Scottish Government give that shortages in the national stock supply chain, which has been impacted by Brexit and the heavy goods vehicle driver issues, will not be the Grinch that steals islanders’ Christmas?

Mairi Gougeon (Scottish National Party, Angus North and Mearns)

I appreciate Beatrice Wishart’s concern. We are in regular discussion and dialogue with our retailers and across the food and drink supply chain to ensure that that does not happen. I give a commitment that we will continue to monitor the situation to make sure that our islands do not suffer.

Climate Targets (Agriculture)

Martin Whitfield (Labour, South Scotland)

4. To ask the Scottish Government what actions are being taken to ensure that the agriculture sector plays a leading role in delivering a net zero Scotland. (S6O-00391)

Mairi Gougeon (Scottish National Party, Angus North and Mearns)

Agriculture is absolutely taking a leading role, collectively, through the agriculture reform implementation oversight board. On 28 October, I announced a £51 million national test programme that will support our farmers and crofters to learn how their work impacts on climate and nature, and help us understand how sustainable farming can be supported and rewarded in future. That builds on a range of other support, including grants, advice and research, to deliver our vision for Scottish agriculture: to transform the sector to become a global leader in sustainable and regenerative agriculture, delivering on our ambitious climate targets.

Martin Whitfield (Labour, South Scotland)

I am grateful for that answer and I am sure that the minister will agree that a one-size-fits-all approach will not be effective. Our local farmers need flexibility, so what steps is the Scottish Government taking to deliver a flexible approach that will enable different farms with different circumstances to secure support to help tackle climate change?

Mairi Gougeon (Scottish National Party, Angus North and Mearns)

That is an absolutely critical point and the work that we are undertaking through the implementation oversight board is pivotal to that. We wanted to make sure that we had representation across the board, so 21 members represent different geographies and sectors across Scotland, as well as environmental interests. That representation means that we can really help to shape and develop the policy together and make sure that we get it right for the different parts of Scotland and the different needs that exist.