Northern Ireland Assembly, 27 January 2025

304 contributions from 65 members. The official report.

Members' Statements

Edwin Poots (DUP, Belfast South)

The first item in the Order Paper is Members' statements.

Declan Kearney (Sinn Féin, South Antrim)

Tá Lá Cuimhneacháin ar Íospartaigh an Uileloiscthe tábhachtach, nó tugann sé deis dúinn machnamh a dhéanamh ar na hainghníomhartha is uafásaí a rinneadh ar an chine dhaonna. Comórann sé gníomhartha uafásacha cinedhíothaithe a rinneadh ar na milliúin íospartach. De dheasca an fhaisisteachais le linn an Dara Cogadh Domhanda, dúnmharaíodh sé mhilliún fear, bean agus páiste Giúdach, lena n-áirítear daoine faoi mhíchumas, baill den phobal LADT+, mionlaigh eitneacha agus príosúnaigh pholaitíochta. Tá an tUileloscadh ar cheann de na dúbhearta is measa i stair an chine dhaonna.

Is gairm chun gnímh é Lá Cuimhneacháin ar Íospartaigh an Uileloiscthe do chách atá tiomanta chun cearta an duine agus chun an daonlathais. Éilítear orainn seasamh le chéile i gcoinne gach cineál seineafóibe, ciníochais agus leithcheala. Tá dualgas morálta orainn an comhionannas, an ceartas agus an tsíocháin a chosaint agus seasamh go daingean in aghaidh an chinedhíothaithe, bíodh sin cinedhíothú a rinneadh san am atá caite nó cinedhíothú atá ar obair san am i láthair.

Declan Kearney (Sinn Féin, South Antrim)

[Translation: Holocaust Memorial Day is an important time to reflect on the most horrific atrocities committed against humanity. It marks the most deplorable acts of genocide against millions of victims. During World War II, fascism murdered six million Jewish men, women and children, including disabled people, members of the LGBT+ community, ethnic minorities and political prisoners. The Holocaust is one of the darkest episodes in modern human history. Holocaust Memorial Day is a call to action by everyone committed to human rights and democracy. It demands that we collectively stand against all forms of xenophobia, racism and discrimination. Our moral duty must be to champion equality, justice and peace, and to stand firmly against genocide in both the past and the present day.]

Stephen Dunne (DUP, North Down)

Storm Éowyn struck Northern Ireland with unprecedented force on Friday. It has left a trail of destruction and had an impact on every corner of our country. As the clear-up operation and work to restore power continue, I commend and pay tribute to the front-line and essential workers who were at the coalface of the storm. Although we are not out of the woods yet, we have made significant progress, and we should pay tribute to all those who have spent the past three days working very hard for us in some treacherous conditions indeed. To the Northern Ireland Electricity (NIE) teams, the various agencies, DFI engineers, healthcare providers or carers, the PSNI, the emergency services, local farmers, council staff and local community volunteers, we say, "Thank you".

The storm, which was described by the Met Office as potentially the strongest to hit our United Kingdom in well over a decade, bringing winds in excess of 90 mph, left thousands of homes and businesses without power.

At its height, power to 220,000 properties and 30% of premises here was disconnected, which showed the scale of the challenge that we faced. The logistical support from the rest of our United Kingdom, and, indeed, from Europe, is very welcome. Progress has been made on that, and I think that more support is coming. My constituency of North Down was not spared. Two schools have had to close their doors today — Donaghadee Primary School and Clifton School — but, thankfully, they will be able to reopen tomorrow.

The storm has had an impact on people of every age. Many homeowners, businesses and farms are still without power, including in the Craigantlet hills, just two miles behind this very Building. We need to see urgent progress on getting full restoration. Many roads were blocked over the weekend, and communities faced significant challenges, including structural damage to homes and businesses, uprooted trees blocking roads and disruption to many essential services. Through the storm, we saw community spirit at its best, with communities coming together, standing shoulder to shoulder in every corner of Northern Ireland. Churches opened their doors, local businesses provided food, community groups supported the most vulnerable and farmers cleared roads, to name but a few. Many vulnerable people were hit hardest. Our elderly population, those who are ill, newborn babies and young families have been greatly impacted on by the long power outages.

As we move forward, we must remain vigilant and be prepared for future weather events. Lessons that need to be learned as a result of this storm include the need for robust and clear emergency preparedness. There is also a need for coordination and support for those most impacted on. Also, NIE has a role to play in compensating with goodwill payments those most impacted on.

Eóin Tennyson (Alliance, Upper Bann)

It is with genuine regret that I rise to address the issue of providing good character references in cases involving serious sexual offences, after it emerged over the weekend that Councillor Brian Tierney of the SDLP provided a reference for Kielan Mooney, a man convicted of rape at the Central Criminal Court in Dublin. The provision of such references adds an additional layer of distress for any victim in any case, but when an elected representative is involved, that hurt is compounded not only for the victim in question but for all victims in our society.

Just because a man is seen to be of good standing, just because he is a sportsperson, is active in the community or has a successful career, does not mean that he is not capable of abuse. All of us in the Chamber have spoken about our genuine desire to tackle violence against women and girls. Therefore, it is incumbent on us, as elected representatives, and on political parties, to lead by example and to act. Serious questions have therefore been raised for the SDLP and for Councillor Tierney. Given that the charge was rape, how could he possibly not have been aware of the seriousness of the allegations? Why has he not been suspended, and why has there been no mention of sanction or disciplinary action in SDLP statements over the weekend?

Leadership is not simply about how we respond to these issues when they appear in other parties but how we respond when they befall our own. Victims deserve accountability and to see this issue treated seriously. It is difficult to fathom how Mr Tierney can remain an elected representative. He and his party ought to be considering his position. I gently ask the leader of the Opposition and the leader of the SDLP to reflect, to be consistent based on the demands that they have made of other parties and to take the appropriate action in the interest of the victims concerned.

Steve Aiken (UUP, South Antrim)

Today is Holocaust Memorial Day. The date of 27 January is chosen because it marks the moment 80 years ago when the Auschwitz-Birkenau death camps were liberated. Last week, on BBC Radio 4, Ivor Perl BEM, a camp survivor, spoke of the horrors of the Holocaust, the murder of six million Jews and the need for remembrance. As he said, that need for remembrance has never been greater as the vile scourge of antisemitism has re-emerged with vehemence.

I am proud that the Assembly debated and agreed to adopt the International Holocaust Remembrance Alliance definition of antisemitism in April 2021, that, as an Assembly, we recognise that the scourge of antisemitism has to be combated, and that, all too regrettably, far too many across this island use antisemitic tropes on an almost daily basis, thinly disguised, if at all, under the banner of criticism of Israel. That criticism is without balance and regularly ignores the ongoing violence across the Middle East, eastern Europe and beyond. It seems that, because Israel is involved, it is somehow acceptable to focus wholly on the Jewish community and go for wholesale victim-blaming of that community at every opportunity. For the avoidance of doubt, that is not legitimate criticism but blatant antisemitism.

One of the worst examples has come from the Irish state. Across the United States, all over Europe and amongst the Jewish people, Ireland is now seen as a haven of antisemitism. Anyone who saw the disgraceful hauling away of a pregnant Jewish academic, who was making a dignified and silent protest at the Irish president's politicisation of remarks at the Holocaust memorial event in Dublin yesterday, will be in no doubt about the ingrained antisemitism now prevalent on this island. While self-awareness was never a trait that could be laid at President Higgins's door, especially after he blamed the Israeli embassy for leaking his remarks about the leadership of the Iranian regime, we should heed the remarks of the Chief Rabbi of Ireland, who said that the president had:

"neglected even to acknowledge the scourge of contemporary antisemitism in Ireland, let alone do anything to address it."

At the commemoration in Dublin of the 7 October massacre, neither the president, the Taoiseach nor the Tánaiste thought it worthy to attend a Dublin synagogue in solidarity with Ireland's small Jewish community. That was bad enough. However, yesterday's blatant attempt to equate the Holocaust with events in the Middle East is beyond revulsion. That Simon Harris chose to defend Higgins' remarks just reinforces to the world the real state of antisemitism in Ireland. Listening again to Ivor Perl's words about the fear of antisemitism in the so-called civilised West, one does not have to look very far from these Benches to see how many of our fears are being realised.

Daniel McCrossan (Social Democratic and Labour Party, West Tyrone)

I pay tribute to all the front-line workers who stepped up over the past few days in what were difficult circumstances, particularly in rural areas. As an MLA representing a rural constituency, I know too well the storm's impact on vulnerable and elderly people across the constituency. Unfortunately, four days later, quite a number are still without electricity; in some cases, they are without water, telephone or any form of communication as well. The storm caused huge stress and anxiety to people who are already vulnerable. They feel isolated and cut off, and some explained that it adversely affected their mental health and general well-being.

The storm that we witnessed over the past few days was unprecedented, but it should be a signal of how we must be prepared for future events and ensure that our society and communities are protected from the worst impacts of such a storm. I pay tribute to Northern Ireland Electricity workers, who restored power to a significant number of properties in a short time and in extremely difficult circumstances and weather conditions. I also pay tribute to others in our community. If you are a neighbour of a vulnerable person and you called to see them, I thank you. If you opened community centres, businesses or churches, I thank you. If you were out checking in on people, helping them via a phone call or other means, or bringing water and food supplies, I thank you. Those are the moments when we see the best of our community and its most human side: when we step up and support those who are in need.

Today, however — four days later, as I said — there are people still without electricity, water or access to supplies that they desperately need, and others are worried about their health and well-being. Unfortunately, there is a sense that the Executive have been invisible over the past four days and have not stepped up to provide reassurance to the people across Northern Ireland who were directly affected by the storm. More could have been done and must be done. Aside from any fancy photographs that will appear, action needs to be taken to support the people who are struggling in our communities.

Pádraig Delargy (Sinn Féin, Foyle)

This week is the 53rd anniversary of Bloody Sunday, when British soldiers murdered 14 civilians on the streets of Derry and seriously wounded 13 more. Growing up in Derry, as a young man, I was told stories by my grandparents of how they had marched for civil rights and a better future for my generation to enjoy. They were part of a generation that stood up and said, "No more": no more to second-class citizenship, no more to inferior housing and no more to being denied the right to vote. When I think of them, I think of those who marched and never came home, whose memory the British state tried so hard to erase.

The people of Derry knew that they were innocent. They knew that they had marched for civil rights and had been shot down on their own streets by an army that purported to be protecting them. Our city stood with the Bloody Sunday families in their lengthy campaign, during which they showed such dignity and courage.

Internationally, "Bloody Sunday" became a byword for state murder and the denial of justice. The British state continues in its efforts to deny any opportunity for families to seek justice for their loved ones through its abhorrent Legacy Act, which is opposed by parties across the Chamber. We will continue to stand with the Bloody Sunday families and with families across the North in their pursuit of truth and justice.

Gary Middleton (DUP, Foyle)

It is 53 years since the senseless and brutal murders of Sergeant Peter Gilgunn and Constable David Montgomery, two men who were much loved by their family, their friends and the wider community and who served the community during the most fearful of times. Those two men were out doing their job when their lives were stolen forever. They were never to return home. Constable David Montgomery, aged just 20, and Sergeant Peter Gilgunn, a husband and a father to an eight-month-old baby son, were killed in the line of duty at 8.30 am on this very day — 27 January — in 1972. They were the first two police officers to be murdered in Londonderry during the Troubles. Peter and David were driving along the Creggan Road when they were shot and murdered by vile criminals who showed no care or concern for human life.

The murders of those two RUC officers by IRA terrorists marked a first for Londonderry, but, sadly, there would be many more murders in the remaining years of the Troubles of those who put on the uniform and went out to protect our communities from those who sought to destroy them. Life-altering physical and mental injuries would be inflicted on many more.

Peter and David's car came under fire from a number of gunmen as they travelled along the road. One gunman fired from an alleyway, while two others opened fire from 40 yds away. During the attack, another police officer was wounded. Two other colleagues escaped injury, no doubt carrying with them the trauma of that terrible atrocity for all their days. According to an RUC spokesperson at the time, the two officers did not have a chance to return fire. The driver managed to accelerate to the RUC station, despite his car being hit 17 times.

Today, my thoughts and prayers are with all the innocent people who have been impacted on and all those who continue to mourn their passing, today and every day. We must not forget their names or their stories. We must not forget whom they were to their families or the fact that they were innocent. Their stories may not receive the coverage that others' do, but we must remember them. They will not be forgotten.

Paula Bradshaw (Alliance, Belfast South)

I recognise Holocaust Memorial Day and emphasise how now, more than ever, we must stand united against antisemitism and all kinds of prejudice, hatred, discrimination and violence. This year's Holocaust Memorial Day is particularly significant, as it marks the 80th anniversary of the liberation of Auschwitz-Birkenau, the largest Nazi concentration camp complex. It also marks the 30th anniversary of the genocide in Bosnia, part of the appalling and all-too-often-forgotten Yugoslav wars of the mid-1990s.

The theme for this year is "For a Better Future", and I sincerely hope that, amid the rise of autocrats around the world, we can, as democrats, all commit to that. That theme is supposed to offer us some hope. It implores each and every one of us to reflect on the atrocities of the past so that we may prevent anything similar from happening in the future. We need to ask ourselves whether we are truly committed to that in a world that is, seemingly, becoming increasingly divided and where almost any form of conduct is acceptable, provided that it is carried out by "our own side". For example, we need to reflect on the very real concerns felt by the local Jewish community in Northern Ireland at the hatred that is being directed towards them because of the conduct of the Israeli Government. We must be able to separate the two: it is entirely possible to be sympathetic to the plight of the people of Gaza, vehemently opposed to the actions of the Israeli Government and hugely concerned about the day-to-day impact on, and experiences of, the small Jewish community here, which still lives with the appalling trauma of the Holocaust.

We can be proud of the role that Northern Ireland has played at crucial stages in offering sanctuary to those who needed it: from Nazi oppression in the 1930s and those fleeing Soviet oppression in the 1950s and 1960s to Ukrainian families that were forced to leave their homes by Putin's aggression in the 2020s. We can take pride in having taken in children who were fleeing Nazi rule, as part of the Kindertransport, so that they could be part of a Northern Ireland that offered them solidarity and safety from persecution.

I have had the opportunity to visit Bergen-Belsen and to sense, in that tragic place, the scale of the human loss and of the inhumanity that caused it. We remain capable of such inhumanity, so we must constantly be on our guard against any slide in the direction of its recurrence. We must never take for granted the freedoms that we enjoy today, as we observe populist politics that continue to threaten democracy in different parts of the world and marginalised groups that are being used as scapegoats.

Alan Robinson (DUP, East Londonderry)

I put on record our support for Drumrane Primary School, which, on Friday morning, faced violent winds that ripped off large parts of its roof. The school is located in a stunning setting, in the foothills of Benbradagh Mountain, in the village of Burnfoot, County Londonderry. It was built recently — in 2008 — when three country schools were merged, and it has 140 pupils and five classrooms.

Anyone in the Chamber who represents a rural constituency knows that a rural school is the heartbeat of its area. When a rural school is impacted on in a negative way, the impact ripples beyond its children and teachers and affects the entire area and hinterland. It was heartbreaking to arrive on Friday to see the external and internal damage to the school, but it is in a strong area. The community of Burnfoot, just outside Dungiven, are at their best when they are under pressure. That community, and its school, will thrive once more. I can guarantee that.

I thank the Education Minister who, when I contacted him on Friday, Saturday evening and Sunday, took a strong personal interest in ensuring that assessments were made for debris to be cleared, which will allow for significant repairs to be carried out. I encourage the Department of Education to keep the focus, as the Minister has done, on a full and speedy repair.

I thank the Drumrane Primary School principal and school leaders and applaud them for their patience. Rest assured, you have our support.

Timothy Gaston (Traditional Unionist Voice, North Antrim)

I preface my comments by paying tribute to the thousands of front-line workers, who did not have a choice when it came to the lockdown warning for Friday morning, including the home helps, who put the needs of others above their own; the police officers; the hospital staff; and, once again, the farmers, whose assistance was invaluable to reopening many of our roads. I thank all the churches and the Orange and community halls that opened their doors so that people would have access to heat and electricity, and, of course, I thank those who were working round the clock to maintain the electricity and water supply during the storm and who have been working since to repair the vast swathes of damage caused to the network since Friday morning. I do not want my next comments to take away from the sterling job that those workers have been doing, and will, no doubt, continue to do until every home has its power restored, every road has been cleared and every house has running water again.

However, I will give some feedback to NIE to highlight the lack of proactive information that flowed to those on the critical care list.

A number of my vulnerable constituents reached out to NIE over the weekend about serious medical issues, but no callback ever came. On Saturday, I heard from a 93-year-old lady who relies on her medical chair and bed to enable her carers and family to look after her. Once the batteries ran out, her medical chair would not function, and the bed deflated. My first call about that issue on Saturday resulted in a wait of over an hour on the elected representative line to NIE. It took four further calls before NIE agreed to provide generators to a number of my constituents in similar situations, and those were delivered only after midnight.

I could recite multiple stories about constituents from yesterday. In one case, the battery ran out in a stair lift, meaning that my constituent could not get upstairs to use the toilet or get to his bed. I also think of the lady in a wheelchair who did not have power in the house for her family to operate her hoist or any of her medical equipment. Those are just some of the many stories of people on the critical care list who were just left until I contacted NIE. The call centre staff were helpful, but the problem was that there simply were not enough staff or generators to meet the needs of those in vulnerable situations.

Members, if any lesson is taken from the response to the storm, it must be that we were not well enough prepared for the vulnerable people on the NIE critical care list. I have heard tell of generators coming in from England and Scotland today, which is welcome, but we need to be better prepared and have those generators ready to go, so that, when the next storm comes, we can meet the needs of those on the critical care list.

Brian Kingston (DUP, Belfast North)

I join in the recognition that today is Holocaust Memorial Day and the 80th anniversary of the liberation of the concentration and extermination camp Auschwitz, where Nazis murdered Jewish people and others who did not conform to their twisted vision. We know that our king will be among those attending the commemoration there today.

The Holocaust was the attempt by the Nazis to destroy all Jewish people in Europe. Building on centuries of antisemitism, the persecution of Jewish people began as soon as the Nazis came to power in Germany in 1933. It is calculated that 6 million Jewish men, women and children were murdered in ghettos, mass shootings, concentration camps and death camps; also targeted and murdered were Roma and Sinti people, black people, the disabled, gay people, political opponents and others.

On this day, we also remember those targeted in more recent genocides in Cambodia, Rwanda, Darfur and Bosnia, of which this year is the 30th anniversary.

On Thursday evening, I joined those attending the Northern Ireland regional ceremony for Holocaust Memorial Day at Belfast City Hall. The event was addressed by our First Minister and deputy First Minister. There were poignant contributions from those with lived experience. First, there was a recorded interview with Professor Peter Lantos BEM, who grew up as a member of the Hungarian Jewish community. Of the 800,000 Jews living in Hungary in 1944, it is estimated, over two thirds — 565,000 — were murdered in the Holocaust. Peter, then aged 5, and his mother were survivors of the Bergen-Belsen concentration camp, where his father died of starvation. Secondly, there was an address by Munira Subašic on behalf of the Mothers of Srebrenica. In July 1995, over 8,000 Bosniak Muslim men and boys were murdered by Serb forces at Srebrenica, which was in a UN protected zone, in just two days. They included 22 members of Munira's extended family, including her husband and youngest son. Another participant at Thursday's ceremony was Reverend David Kale, rabbi of the Hebrew congregation of Belfast synagogue.

It was encouraging to see young people from a range of schools and youth organisations taking part in the ceremony. It is important that we remember those past horrors in support of the survivors, for vigilance against future atrocities and because the final stage in every genocide is denial. With sadness, we say, "Never forget. Never again. For a better future."

Claire Sugden (Independent, East Londonderry)

Like others, I will speak to the events of the past weekend, which continue to leave their mark across Northern Ireland. Thankfully and most importantly, no one was killed or seriously hurt in Northern Ireland during the storm. That is a huge relief and is credit to the swift decisions taken by the Northern Ireland Executive and the various statutory agencies. Their quick actions in closing schools, public buildings and transport networks while getting out the message to stay at home undoubtedly saved lives.

I thank everyone who worked through the storm to help others, including community groups, churches, Health and Social Care staff, the PSNI, road engineers and farmers who helped to clear up. Those efforts demonstrate the best of Northern Ireland. I particularly thank the engineers who have worked tirelessly to restore and repair the damage and continue to do so. Their work is very much appreciated.

That said, the storm has revealed serious challenges that we, as an Assembly and an Executive, need to address. The biggest issue has been the damage to our electricity network and the impact of power outages, particularly on older people, vulnerable groups and those living in rural areas. For many, losing electricity is more than an inconvenience; it can be life-changing. People relying on medical equipment had to be admitted to hospital or simply do without. Older people had been left without heat and were freezing in their homes, and rural communities were left cut off, unable to communicate or even get a hot meal. Those are the stark realities that we need to confront in the aftermath of the storm.

While storms on this scale do not happen often, when they do, they remind us of how vulnerable we can be. We need to learn from storm Éowyn and look at how we can do better next time. That might mean improving support for older and vulnerable people during emergencies, investing in backup solutions for critical medical equipment or even strengthening community networks so that no one is left isolated when the lights go out.

We also need to think about how much we rely on electricity and what happens when it is taken away. It is an important conversation that we need to start now. Storm Éowyn has shown us the challenges that we face, but it has also shown how resilient and supportive our communities can be. We need to do more and do better to recognise and support our community and voluntary sector.

Ministerial Statement

Edwin Poots (DUP, Belfast South)

I have received notice from the Executive Office that the First Minister and deputy First Minister wish to make a statement. Before they do, I express my personal gratitude to all of those working as early responders, not just the NIE people, who go up poles and, particularly in yesterday's conditions, deserve immense gratitude, but the people from Roads Service, Northern Ireland Water, DFI Rivers and all the agencies and members of the wider public. I also pay tribute to the staff who were manning the call centres, because those people were run ragged taking calls. There probably was not enough backup for them, but staff were working an immense number of hours to give people information, which was quite limited. We should all be immensely grateful to all of those who stepped up to the plate to help others over the past number of days.

That said, I know that a lot of Members will want to ask questions to the First and deputy First Ministers, so I plead with you, given the amount of interest that there will be in the subject, to be as concise as possible when you ask questions.

Michelle O'Neill (Sinn Féin, Mid Ulster)

Go raibh maith agat, a Cheann Comhairle.

[Translation: Thank you, Mr Speaker.]

I thank you and your staff for facilitating this important strategic statement on the back of the unprecedented events over the weekend. I apologise to Members that we got the statement delivered to them only in the past short while. We are in live play and are actively responding to the storm as we speak.

The storm has had an unprecedented impact across the entire island of Ireland as well as Scotland and northern England. It has left our citizens without power, water and access to communication. Some of our MLA colleagues will have experienced that themselves, and we have all seen and heard about the impact on our constituents. We wanted to come to the Assembly today to confirm our commitment to getting everybody's services restored as quickly as possible.

Across the Executive, all of our Ministers have been engaged in that effort, and I thank colleagues for that collective focus. In the interconnected world that we live in, that has been absolutely vital. Roads, schools, power, connectivity and hospitals do not exist without one another, and the effort has been huge. Our front-line workers have been really wonderful and will continue to make a strong effort in the coming days.

For our part, we have been closely engaged with the British Government to secure additional resources for NIE; we have engaged with the Prime Minister directly; we have had COBRA meetings; we have had Executive meetings; and there have been regular updates within our system across all our civil contingencies. In significant events such as this, the initial response is vital, as is the recovery phase, which we are now moving into. Our structures for civil contingencies have involved local government at the outset, then the PSNI, DFI and the Department for Communities. That partnership and multi-agency working is essential and, again, is much appreciated. What matters most, of course, is the impact on our citizens, especially the vulnerable. We reiterate our message to everybody to check in on family and friends, people in your street and your neighbours, who may be experiencing difficulties.

The community assistance centres are there to help. As always, we are grateful to local government for the centres and how quickly they were able to stand those up and for the support that they provide. We are also grateful for the support that has come and is coming over to assist NIE in the task of restoring power. That is specialist work. We ask people to take great care around electricity cables, because many are still down. Please, do not take any risks, and, please, stay safe. We will continue to monitor the situation and work collaboratively with all stakeholders, as it is of great concern to us all. We want to continue to engage with the British Government to build on the request. I have engaged with the Tánaiste directly about practical support, but we all face similar challenges at the moment.

The facts and figures will change over the coming days as we get more power and water restored, but I want to give an update on what we knew as of 10.00 am today.

There were 2,600 incidents recorded on our roads as a result of the storm, resulting in a large number of road closures. Although the main strategic road network has now opened, there are still around 100 closures with many roads remaining blocked, 60 of which require NIE assistance to remove electric cables and poles. On Sunday, 80% of the road network covered by winter service was able to be treated. That was a huge stretch in the work of DFI staff, and we welcome that.

More than 100 schools — maybe as many as 154 — have reported damage to their property, ranging from minor damage to fences and missing roof tiles to much more significant structural damage. It is estimated that approximately 100 schools are still without power. NIE has confirmed that it will, where possible, prioritise schools that do not have power. We met NIE this morning to make that case. Potentially, up to 20 schools are listed as closed today. Hopefully, we will improve that picture as quickly as possible.

At the peak, there was an unprecedented level of power outage: 285,000 customers were without power as a direct result of the storm. There were over 5,000 individual faults in the network that needed to be assessed and resolved. As of this morning, 65,000 customers remain without electricity. NIE has escalated its staff cohort and now has 1,000 staff on the ground providing support to try to get customers' electricity restored. Over 210,000 people have had their electricity restored, which is really significant progress, although that is not to take away from the fact that many people are sitting without electricity and have been for four days, which is a hugely challenging situation for them all. We continued to meet NIE over the weekend to ensure that everything that can be done is being done and that NIE has everything that it needs to respond to the emergency.

The storm has had a significant impact on NI Water assets, as a direct result of loss of electrical power or through damage to equipment. The most recent position, as of this morning, is that approximately 2,000 to 3,000 people are without water. Water teams were mobilised as soon as it was safe to do so and will continue to carry out repairs until all assets are operational. Generators have been deployed to various sites, and teams have been identifying and repairing damage to equipment as they reach it. Bottled water has been distributed at a number of leisure centres in impacted areas.

That gives a high-level assessment of where things stand in those four key areas. Our response to the storm is very much a live-play scenario that we continue to work our way through, taking a multi-agency approach.

Colm Gildernew (Sinn Féin, Fermanagh and South Tyrone)

I thank the First Minister and the deputy First Minister for their statement. Can they set out how the Executive are prioritising vulnerable and older people, particularly those who are absolutely reliant on electricity to power medical equipment?

Michelle O'Neill (Sinn Féin, Mid Ulster)

Thanks for that. We are increasingly concerned about that area. There are people who were vulnerable before the storm and people who became vulnerable during the storm, particularly four days in with no electricity or heating or, perhaps, access to a warm meal. There is a dedicated work stream to try to reach the most vulnerable in our society, and we are prioritising efforts to restore power to those homes. It is particularly difficult. That is why we are coming at it in a number of ways. We have our drop-in centres; I encourage all MLAs to use their platforms to promote those drop-in centres so that people know where they can go and what they can get at each of the centres. We are also asking the public to continue to be vigilant, as they have been, and to look out for vulnerable people.

This morning, we have put it to NIE directly that we believe that there needs to be a goodwill payment to assist people to get through this period. We will continue to engage with NIE. The Department for Communities has stood up that response to work with councils to help to fund them to provide services in a localised way. We are particularly concerned about people with chronic health conditions, people who were recognised as being vulnerable and people who have become vulnerable. I assure you that there is a dedicated team working in that area.

Matthew O'Toole (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Belfast South)

I join you, First Minister, in commending the first responders — NIE staff, engineers and people who were out all weekend helping to get us back to normal after an unprecedented storm.

You talked about the team that is operating that involves the Department for Communities. How is that being coordinated centrally? It is critical that there is coordination between councils, the Executive, NIE Networks and DFI Roads. Precisely how is that being driven? Who is in charge of that team? Is it being coordinated from the Executive Office to drive it forward?

Emma Little-Pengelly (DUP, Lagan Valley)

I thank the Member for his important question. Coordination is key to many of the issues, because we are dealing with a number of Departments and agencies, all with different responsibilities. The key thing in all of that is to ensure that the communication and coordination are working, and that is why we have set up those civil contingency structures. Over the weekend, there were, I understand, about nine strategic coordinating groups (SCGs). Many agencies and Departments are represented on those groups to do precisely what you said: to get real-time information as quickly as possible and feed it through to whoever needs to target and direct help to the places where it is needed. Those groups met a number of times. There were also official COBRA-level meetings to coordinate the UK-wide response. Of course, throughout the weekend, the First Minister and I were in constant contact, particularly through the head of the Civil Service and our civil contingencies team sitting in the Executive Office. There is a vulnerable persons cell as part of those structures, and its absolute purpose is to coordinate that response and ensure that support gets to the right people and where it needs to get to.

Paula Bradshaw (Alliance, Belfast South)

Thank you, First Minister and deputy First Minister, for your statement. I join others in thanking the front-line support agencies for their efforts over the past few days.

I believe that in Scotland, for example, they offer hotel accommodation to people who have not got electricity. As you said, First Minister, it seems as though some houses will be without power for a number of days. Given that you communicate through online news outlets and social media, would it be prudent to think about offering hotel accommodation to the families who are most vulnerable?

Michelle O'Neill (Sinn Féin, Mid Ulster)

The purpose of the cell — the group that is looking at the issue of vulnerability — is to look at everything in the round: exactly what we need and where we need it. In Scotland, the power company has chosen to make the goodwill payment, including supporting people to get accommodation. We have also asked for that here. We will continue to engage on that throughout today. Obviously, over the weekend, our focus was on the immediate response and the fact that there was danger to life, limb and property. That was where we needed to focus. Now, we are very much in the recovery phase, where we are looking towards what we can do to support vulnerable people out there.

Harry Harvey (DUP, Strangford)

Thank you, First Minister, for your statement, and deputy First Minister, for your answers.

Obviously, a significant clean-up operation will be required in coming days. What additional support can be provided to councils or DFI to ensure that footpaths and road verge sight lines are cleared of debris, particularly from fallen trees?

Emma Little-Pengelly (DUP, Lagan Valley)

I thank the Member for his question. There were a significant number of obstructions. Well in excess of 2,000 were reported across Northern Ireland, with, according to the latest figures, 100 roads still closed. Trying to clear all of that has required significant work. As with the vulnerable persons cell, an infrastructure cell has been the focus, as the First Minister said, over the weekend. The two big issues — clearing the roads and reconnecting electricity and addressing the impacts of the lack of connection on mobile telephone service and water supply — are being coordinated through the civil contingencies structure, working with councils, Forest Service and others.

Everybody who is available has been pulled in to support the clearing of the roads. They have been triaged, with key routes being cleared first, but, of course, there is that connection with NIE. I cannot stress this enough: if a cable comes down, it is hugely dangerous for anybody to try to clear that. It requires NIE to be called to go on to sites and ensure that they are safe through disconnection. NIE has been clear in its messaging about that over the weekend: if there are cables, including cables that are on a tree or elsewhere, do not touch them. Call the authorities, and they will come out. That has added a bit of complication. I understand that 50 to 60 of the 100 roads require NIE assistance. That is the number that we are down to, however, and I thank all the agencies and staff in particular who have been working hard to make progress over the weekend.

Steve Aiken (UUP, South Antrim)

My party adds its thanks to the public servants and, indeed, members of civil society who have been dealing with the issues.

First Minister, the question seems to be about what has happened to the mobile telephone networks. Many of us were rightly awakened to the concerns about the alarm that went off across the system. For many people this weekend, the mobile telephone networks have not worked, and people have had no method of getting any form of communication. Are there any lessons to be identified here, and are we talking to the mobile telephone networks to make sure that there is redundancy in their systems? There does not seem to be.

Michelle O'Neill (Sinn Féin, Mid Ulster)

Yes. Some people had a triple whammy: no electricity, no water and no mobile service. I had no mobile service for a while on Friday. It is causing huge challenges for people. I assure you that we are engaging with every agency responsible to get people reconnected as quickly as possible. The storm has caused widespread network outage. Lots of MLAs will have contacted all the energy providers and mobile companies. We will continue to do that at a central level, because it is important to get people connected as quickly as possible. Sitting with no water, no electricity and no phone service is a pretty dire situation for anybody. Unfortunately, for some households, that is their position today. We assure people that we are doing everything that we can to push all agencies to do everything that they can. We will continue the good effort of the weekend in the coming days to get people back up and running and reconnected.

Emma Sheerin (Sinn Féin, Mid Ulster)

I thank the Ministers for their statement. I add my name to the list of Members putting on record their thanks to all the front-line workers and everybody who has been trying to restore our services and deal with our queries over the weekend.

First Minister, what are you doing to work with councils to provide services for those who are worst affected by the storm?

Emma Little-Pengelly (DUP, Lagan Valley)

I thank the Member for her question. Councils have played a critical role in supporting the roll-out of support to communities. That has included the opening of centres, and the Minister for Communities has been working with councils on funding support for that. I am also aware that others — sporting clubs, churches, Orange halls and community centres — have stepped up. It has been really good to see that collective community effort of people stepping up to support others who are in need. For many of the areas without electricity and water in particular, there has been coordination on water collection.

Of course, if people are without a phone signal, it is difficult to make sure that that message gets through. I absolutely concur with the Member. We are urgently asking for solutions on mobile coverage. It is connected to the lack of electricity connection. If that cannot be resolved today, we need urgent alternatives to get that mobile connection up and going. Likewise, it is entirely unacceptable that people are without water. We are on day 4, and that is creating significant hardship.

It is not just electricity that is off but water. That is also to do with the lack of electricity connection. We proposed getting generators out there in order to get the water back on. For me, the priority issue of the day is to make sure that people can access water again.

Deborah Erskine (DUP, Fermanagh and South Tyrone)

I thank the Executive for their coordination and all the front-line staff and volunteers for their work over what was a very difficult weekend. My question follows on from what the deputy First Minister said about water. In my constituency, the lack of supply is a real issue. We are now on day 4 without water in a lot of areas. Can the deputy First Minister and the First Minister detail the community response that there is to get water out there? It was yesterday before water went out to some leisure centres. What is the financial impact on NI Water, and how will that be mitigated?

Michelle O'Neill (Sinn Féin, Mid Ulster)

I will answer in reverse order. We will have to work out the financial implications. Our priority is to get the work done to get the response out there, and we will then have to deal with the cost. There was, however, no question whatsoever of our not responding in the way in which we have. There will be local solutions in every area, so I am loath to get into discussing your constituency, apart from to say that our local councils are working hard. Anyone who is unsure should go online to nidirect to see what is being provided. The west has been particularly hit with water issues, so getting water out to people is crucial. We all have questions for the agencies in the aftermath of the storm, but our priority for now is to get people the support that they need.

Ultimately, we need everyone to be reconnected to the power supply, because the situation is causing a hindrance to some water supplies. The generators will be helpful. The deputy First Minister and I have made the case for getting additional generators so that we can respond to some of the immediate water pressures, and there is a willingness for suppliers to work with us. We have been successful in securing additional generators, and we believe that there are more to come. I hope that they will get people connected to water as quickly as possible.

On a more general point, every service has been pushed to get people connected as quickly as possible. We will not rest until that is the case.

Andrew McMurray (Alliance, South Down)

First Minister, I associate myself with what has gone before. I will mention the community centres that have opened up, such as GAA clubs and church halls. There are so many questions to ask, but I will focus on climate change, because it is likely to mean warmer oceans resulting in more intense storms and more intense bouts of weather. What learning has occurred so far from Friday's event, and what will be done?

Emma Little-Pengelly (DUP, Lagan Valley)

I thank the Member for his question. Over the past number of years, we have faced a significant number of events and crises. As a result, our civil contingency structures were examined in detail, and a number of recommendations were made and actioned. The First Minister and I feel that the structures that are in place have worked very well. They were stood up very quickly. We have had clear lines of internal communication. Of course, we always want to go faster and speed things up. We want to get connections restored as quickly as possible. Through those structures, we have spent the weekend pushing agencies to ensure that we get the right information.

I have made it clear that NI Water and NIE need to tell us what machinery and people they need in order to move the time frames for reconnection forward and to get the vast majority of premises' electricity back on within the next 24 to 48 hours and the remaining water issues resolved today. Those are urgent issues, but people have been working very well. Hundreds of people were out over the weekend reconnecting supply and working hard to clear roads. There was a huge effort involved, and it is right that we thank all those who have worked so hard.

Pat Sheehan (Sinn Féin, Belfast West)

Gabhaim buíochas leis na hAirí as ucht a bhfreagraí.

[Translation: I thank the Ministers for their answers.]

Will the First Minister tell us what work is being undertaken to repair damaged schools to enable them to reopen as soon as possible?

Michelle O'Neill (Sinn Féin, Mid Ulster)

There has been significant damage, and the most recent figure that I read was that 154 schools have reported some level of damage. That, however, can mean everything from damage to ridge tiles to more significant damage. I might have said "up to 20 schools" earlier, but 10 schools did not open today for a combination of reasons. The Department continues to work with NIE to restore power to those schools. Those schools are, where possible, trying to do online learning, but they have to be a priority: we have to get our children back into school. In the meeting this morning, NIE committed to continuing to work with the Department of Education and the Education Authority to ensure that schools are prioritised. We are told that the Education Authority's maintenance department is working at pace to deal with the most critical repairs. The 10 schools affected could represent a significant number of children not being in school, so we want to make sure that their doors are opened again as quickly as possible.

Diane Forsythe (DUP, South Down)

I thank the Executive for their response over the weekend, during this terrible time. In my constituency, it has been good to see steady progress on the restoration of power to homes. However, many of the rural pockets across Mourne, Killowen, Scarva, Loughbrickland and particularly Katesbridge, the coldest point in Northern Ireland, are entering their fourth day without power and heat. Will the deputy First Minister provide some assurance as to the Executive's commitment not to leave rural communities behind?

Emma Little-Pengelly (DUP, Lagan Valley)

I thank the Member for her important question. I will, absolutely. The easiest electricity connections to restore are those in urban areas. Those are prioritised due to the number of affected "customers", as NIE would describe them, or households that they serve. There will be a number of homes, particularly in rural areas, that will be very difficult to get to to fix their connection. We have been made aware of that. Those are the people who are most likely to have their power restored towards the end of the time frame.

This Friday will mark seven days from the beginning of last Friday's storm, and it looks as though those who will not be reconnected until after that will be in the more rural and isolated areas. Those people will probably also be the most vulnerable, so we need to ensure that we use all the mechanisms and local information available to target that support, particularly for people who are isolated, older and do not have a network of family and friends to rely on. We have been urging neighbours and family members to reach out to those older and more vulnerable people. We must use our network of local community organisations and local council support teams to provide warm and safe spaces that provide food, hot showers and electricity to charge devices etc. That will be critical as we move beyond day 4.

John Stewart (UUP, East Antrim)

I join the First Minister and deputy First Minister in thanking all the front-line workers and volunteers who have been working tirelessly to repair storm damage. First Minister, a lot of damage has been caused to domestic and commercial properties. Some people have told me that they are really struggling to get commitments from their insurance companies and that barriers are being put in place. What can your office do to lobby the insurance companies to ensure that they are cooperating with those affected and pay out what is due?

Michelle O'Neill (Sinn Féin, Mid Ulster)

Insurance companies should do the right thing and pay out. That is a question that should not have to be answered. It is not acceptable for an insurance company to run for cover when people find themselves in crisis. I send a very strong message from the House that we want all insurance companies to cooperate with the people who pay their fees every year. When people need them, insurance companies should respond accordingly. If we feel that it is appropriate to make an intervention, I am more than happy to do so.

Trevor Clarke (DUP, South Antrim)

In your statement, there is reference to the specialist requirements for collecting generators. The First Minister said that more generators were coming. Given that the priority should be connections and keeping the necessary expertise for that, is there an opportunity to use the engineers here, or bring in engineers from the mainland, to assist with the connection of the generators?

Emma Little-Pengelly (DUP, Lagan Valley)

I thank the Member for his question. We have been very clear in putting across a message on safety with generators, particularly through the Health and Safety Executive. There are people using generators, and there is a danger associated with that if they are not used correctly. We advise everyone who is using a generator to make sure that they look up the advice that is available online from the Health and Safety Executive.

It requires some expertise to get the generators to the right place and set them up correctly. We have worked with NIE on that through COBRA and the UK Government. The UK Government can supply us with generators, and we understand that 30 additional generators will arrive today from Great Britain. That will be a help, but, from our discussions with NIE, it is clear that it wants to prioritise reconnections and deploy the engineers to do that. That means that we will need to source engineer hours elsewhere in order to support the safe installation of the generators. We tasked the head of the Civil Service with that this morning.

A COBRA 'O' meeting — an officials-level, UK-wide meeting — was scheduled for 11.00 am. We asked her to add to our ask and feed that request into the process to see whether we can get additional people who are able to support the roll-out of generators. That will be critical, particularly for the water issue but also in getting schools reopened and getting help and support to people.

Stewart Dickson (Alliance, East Antrim)

I thank the First Minister and deputy First Minister for the work that they were doing over the weekend. Of course, I associate myself with the remarks that have been made about those who were out on the ground in the teeth of the storm working hard.

What action are the First Minister and deputy First Minister taking on a public health message regarding the amount of food that is being declared useless in shops and stores and in people's homes?

Michelle O'Neill (Sinn Féin, Mid Ulster)

I will have to check with our strategic contingency group about any messaging in that regard. To be blunt, I do not know whether there is any such messaging, but, obviously, you would want people to discard any food that is not safe to eat and not to make themselves ill. I will take that away as a point to see whether there is any messaging, but I am not aware of any at this point.

Phillip Brett (DUP, Belfast North)

I thank the First Minister and deputy First Minister for their update. Power companies in other parts of the United Kingdom have been clear that they will make goodwill payments to their customers. NIE makes huge profits on the back of people across Northern Ireland. To date, it has failed to confirm whether it will provide support to households that have had to throw away food, make travel arrangements or, indeed, check into hotels. Will the First Minister or deputy First Minister update the House on why NIE has not given the same commitment to customers in Northern Ireland that customers in other parts of the United Kingdom have been given?

Emma Little-Pengelly (DUP, Lagan Valley)

I thank the Member for his question. Many thousands of people will be keen to hear from NIE. We have made the proposal to NIE that it considers making a goodwill payment. I know that there had been talk of compensation, but, of course, there is a provision that energy companies do not have a legal requirement to pay out for something on this scale. That may or may not be the case when this is looked at.

The Member will understand that, over the weekend, our focus was very much on working with NIE, NI Water and other agencies to get reconnections and support for people. As we have moved through that, the issue of financial support has, of course, come up. Many people have lost the contents of their fridge or freezer, for example. Earlier, I made the point that this is possibly the worst week of the year for financial stress on families — few people have many funds left in the last week of January — so we know that there is a huge burden on families who are having to eat out, for example, because they cannot cook a meal at home.

We believe that it is the right thing for NIE Networks to step up and give a goodwill payment to support the people throughout Northern Ireland who have been suffering hardship without electricity. We know that it can do that. It is important that we talk to the Utility Regulator, but our understanding is that NIE can do that. Indeed, the Scottish energy companies have stepped up in Scotland. As a starter, we should look at the provision that they are giving to their customers — customers who have been impacted on by the same storm — and asking NIE Networks to step up, do the same and give that goodwill payment.

Patsy McGlone (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Mid Ulster)

I associate myself with all the comments about the front-line workers and their support staff, who have been doing sterling work throughout this. What support will be provided by the Executive to assist the many people in critical care, who are often housebound and, in many instances, bed-bound? Could we have a date for the restoration of water supply for the upland areas? That raises many issues around not only domestic supply but animal welfare. Finally, what liaison has there been between the Executive and the internet companies on which many of us rely for communications as well as health, education and business services?

Michelle O'Neill (Sinn Féin, Mid Ulster)

I cannot give a date for the water connection. All I can say is that we are working to push them to ensure that everybody is connected as quickly as possible. That is why we are looking at the provision of generators, for example, to try to get water connected to the last approximately 2,000 people who are still without water. I encourage all MLAs to use the NI Water contact to flag up any vulnerable people, particularly those who are medically dependent, if they are not already on the register or being supported, because we are trying to prioritise those people. Over the weekend, I dealt with at least one family, as, I am sure, most Members did, with somebody who was dependent on oxygen or getting a connection. It is a particularly challenging time. The Department of Health assures us that it is doing all that it can within its remit. NIE has a critical care line for anyone who is in any doubt about those issues.

I was taken aback at the weekend to learn that meter readers were going door to door in some cases. That is commendable, and it showed a bit of agility in how to adapt to a crisis. It is important that we reach the more vulnerable people as quickly as possible. We are in touch with all service providers and are trying to push them to restore services. We need to have people back on electricity, water and communications. We will continue to push all the service providers for quick restoration times.

Pádraig Delargy (Sinn Féin, Foyle)

I thank the Ministers for their answers so far. My question has already been answered in part, but I would be grateful if the Ministers were to provide more detail on the Executive's engagement with schools and, in particular, on how to communicate that to parents and families.

Emma Little-Pengelly (DUP, Lagan Valley)

I thank the Member for his question. The Education Minister has put out a number of statements about the ongoing situation. Two categories of schools are impacted. Well in excess of, I think, 150 schools were damaged in some way by the storm. However, only a small number of those were at risk of not opening. The Education Authority did a huge amount of work over the weekend to address the issues in the schools that could not open. A small number of those schools could not open today. I think that it was around seven schools.

A significant number of schools are impacted by a lack of electricity. That number is higher. By yesterday evening, around 80 schools were without electricity. That number has come down, and a number of those schools were able to open this morning. We are waiting for final numbers to come through. We have stressed that parents need to watch out for local information from the school. Look at the school's page and its alerts. Ultimately, electricity will be coming on in various areas throughout the day, and, as it does, those schools will be able to open. The Education Minister considered putting out that list last night, but he was conscious that schools would be connected overnight, some of which would be able to open. That certainly seems to have been the case.

We understand that, in all likelihood, between 50 and 60 schools were unable to open today due to a lack of electricity. That was one of the issues that we raised this morning when asking about generators. If we get information from NIE about which schools may not be able to open tomorrow or Wednesday, we can try to secure additional generators and get them sent to the right places so that our pupils can get back into the classroom and get the education that they deserve.

Alan Chambers (UUP, North Down)

I record our appreciation of our Health and Social Care staff, who continued to provide a service during the storm.

Can the Minister clarify who has responsibility for putting in place signage to warn of a road that is closed because of a fallen tree? The response in that respect was slow in some instances; in fact, some blockages were left overnight without any signage in place, which resulted in the creation of road safety issues during the hours of darkness.

Michelle O'Neill (Sinn Féin, Mid Ulster)

I assume that it comes under the Department of Infrastructure. As you will appreciate, it was an emerging situation. We had just come out of a red alert period, and it was not safe for staff to be out between 6.00 am and 2.00 pm. They then moved at pace to alert people. I imagine that it was imperfect, but the staff definitely went above and beyond. They tried their very best to respond as quickly as they could.

Mark Durkan (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Foyle)

I thank the Ministers for their answers thus far. Do the Ministers believe that agencies here could and should have been better prepared? Given that the red weather warning in the South existed about 24 hours before the warning here was escalated to red, do they recognise the ridiculousness and the risk of having two separate weather warning systems on an island of this size? Will the Executive pursue an all-island weather warning and response system?

Emma Little-Pengelly (DUP, Lagan Valley)

I thank the Member for his question. By the way, I had not noticed that the Education Minister was in the Chamber when I had the audacity to answer the question about education. He advises me that my answer was accurate and that, in fact, tomorrow, potentially only one school will be unable to open due to damage and that there will be a further update at 4.00 pm about the situation with electricity for schools.

In answer to the Member's question, it is important to remember — I know this only because of Barra Best — that the systems, North and South, measure very different things. In Northern Ireland, we are part of the UK-wide system, and there is a different metric in the Republic of Ireland. Red does not mean the same thing in different areas. However, that does not mean that we do not take those things seriously. There was a red alert here, and the response, therefore, was from the PSNI. As I said, I am satisfied that we have been working hard, including with internal communications and coordination between all the agencies. There will always be certain differences, given that there is an international border between the two jurisdictions, but cooperation is key to making sure that, whatever happens, citizens are kept as safe as possible.

Justin McNulty (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Newry and Armagh)

I pay tribute to the NIE front-line workers, council workers and those from all the other agencies who have bravely stepped up through the storm. Huge credit is due to my fellow politicians Pete Byrne and Thomas O'Hanlon for their responses on the ground in helping people, responding to issues and providing information. People from St Patrick's High School, Keady, who are in the Public Gallery, will know Thomas O'Hanlon.

First Ministers, as late as Thursday, the ridiculous situation ensued whereby there was a red weather warning in the South and an orange weather warning in the North. How did that affect preparedness for the storm? The National Emergency Co-ordination Group (NEGC) in the South was already ramped up and had taken action to take charge. Is there an equivalent in the North? If not, why not? How do families and businesses access the goodwill payment that you have proposed?

Michelle O'Neill (Sinn Féin, Mid Ulster)

All our agencies worked together in advance of the red warning. All the preparatory work was in place. All our messaging and information was ramped up as soon as we were aware that there was going to be a red warning, which the Met Office confirmed early on Thursday morning. We were already working behind the scenes on preparedness. The operation that kicked in in the aftermath of the storm was so effective because of all the preparation and planning that was done.

There are always lessons to be learned, and we will have plenty of time to do that in the aftermath. For now, however, we are focused on restoring people's power and water and getting them the support that they need, particularly those who are more vulnerable.

Timothy Gaston (Traditional Unionist Voice, North Antrim)

On Friday, at approximately 7.30 am, a large tree fell on a car, blocking Craigs Road outside Cullybackey. Despite that incident being logged shortly after and several calls being made to DFI to warn it of the dangers and to request "Road Closed" signs, those signs appeared only when it was too late. Sadly, the signs were deployed only after a further accident, when a car hit the same tree at 8.00 pm, with a lady needing to be cut out of her car. Thankfully, no one was seriously hurt in either crash, but the outcome could quite easily have been different. In future, will DFI prioritise closing roads that are obstructed by fallen trees in order to protect users on the road network who are unaware?

Emma Little-Pengelly (DUP, Lagan Valley)

I thank the Member for his question. Some of the detail of that question might best be directed at the Infrastructure Minister. There was an unprecedented level of, I believe, some 2,800 reported obstructions across the network. Some of those involved multiple trees and other things that had been felled. I understand from our briefings that a triaging system was in place for the removal of those obstructions, which were mainly trees, from the main routes and for trying to get out to assess the damage.

We do not have a huge amount of capacity sitting there waiting for a big event such as this to happen. Therefore, when such things do happen, capacity is stretched. You need to ensure the safety of citizens first, and that is why those roads ought to have been closed and why signs ought to have been put out. I suspect that that did not happen because people were trying to get out to do the same thing in so many areas. We also had a lot of cables come down. As indicated, those are particularly dangerous. If anybody were to touch those trees or cables or try to remove them, there would be a serious risk to life, so those were triaged and prioritised.

I suggest that the Member write to or contact the Infrastructure Minister about the particular circumstances of that case. We want to ensure that obstructions do not cause risk to life, and we will continue to work on that over the next number of hours.

Gerry Carroll (People Before Profit Alliance, Belfast West)

I thank the front-line workers and community volunteers for the work that they have done over the past few days.

Presumably, First Minister, there was a plan in place to deal with the storm. Will that be released for people to scrutinise? I presume that there is a TEO team that works to respond to extreme weather events. If so, how many people work in that team and how often does it meet? Can you give us some further detail on that? Unfortunately, given the heating up of the planet, this is probably not going to be the last weather crisis that we will see in the next few years.

Michelle O'Neill (Sinn Féin, Mid Ulster)

We can all accept that these events that we call "unprecedented" will happen more often, so we have to be able to respond and we have to meet the evolving situation. We have tried-and-tested civil contingency arrangements here. I imagine that they have already been published, but I am happy to share them with you if they have not been. There are structures that kick in, and those structures worked over the weekend. It was very clear to me in all our multi-agency meetings that we could see everybody getting down to business. Not only did every individual carry out their role but they were coordinating and talking across each other, which was very important to the response. I commend the civil contingencies group for its work thus far.

We are not there yet and we still have a bit of road to travel to get people connected, but I am fairly certain that if we carry on in that vein, we will, hopefully, have people connected as quickly as possible. There are going to be difficulties towards the end, particularly for those people who are without power connections. NIE has told us that the speed that we have seen over the past four days will not continue into the next four days. All that I can say to everybody is that the Executive, and Emma and I, have been pushing NIE extremely hard to ensure that everything that can be done will be done.

Claire Sugden (Independent, East Londonderry)

I thank the Northern Ireland Executive for their response since Thursday, because that has, ultimately, saved many lives. What impact has the storm had on the hospitals? We are hearing that people who did not have access to medical equipment were being admitted and, indeed, people who were in hospital were probably not able to be discharged, given the fact that domiciliary care was not effective. Is that already putting a more significant pressure on a system that is, in itself, under pressure?

Emma Little-Pengelly (DUP, Lagan Valley)

I thank the Member for her important question. As I indicated earlier, there is a vulnerable persons' cell, which is coordinating work as part of the civil contingencies approach. That is carried out by way of a number of different measures. In particular, NIE has been dealing with what it calls its "vulnerable list". It has been contacting those people by phone and has visited some of them with hot water and food and to check their welfare. Many of NIE's meter readers have been doing that, which has been important, and I thank them for it. That is not something that has had a lot of visibility, but I have no doubt that it means a lot to those vulnerable people.

In addition, the trusts have been dealing with about 800 vulnerable people. Initially, there was huge concern for those with medical equipment, for example. Much of that equipment runs on battery packs as opposed to mains electricity, but the battery packs require to be recharged using electricity. There is a lot of concern about that, which is why the situation is being monitored by the trusts. There was a multi-agency approach to that, in order to make sure that as many of those people as possible were supported.

We are very aware, however, that there will be many people who are not on a formal vulnerable list but who are, nevertheless, vulnerable. That could include older people who are sitting in a cold home with no electricity and no way of contacting people, or people with a variety of illnesses who may not be able to get into a car to go and get help and support. That is why we are asking for local information. Some of that has come through, and there are people who are in their 80s and 90s, who are isolated, cold and without electricity and the ability even to make themselves a cup of tea. We are appealing to neighbours and friends in local communities, as well as the local churches, to identify those people. If you have not seen your neighbour or heard from them, please check in on them and signpost them to the support and help that is there. We will try our best to get those people food, blankets and help and support until we can get those reconnections made.

Daniel McCrossan (Social Democratic and Labour Party, West Tyrone)

I thank the First Ministers for being with us in the House. I also want to thank front-line workers and those who played their part and assisted people in our communities, including the community workers and the Red Cross, which played a vital role, particularly in my constituency.

Right now, First Ministers, as we sit here and talk about the impact of the storm, people are freezing in their homes and are without heat and electricity, as has been said. Some are without water and some are hungry. This is day 4, and people cannot survive in those conditions for a prolonged period. What is being done today by the Executive to provide intervention, financial or otherwise, by means of accommodation that is suitable for those people to ensure that they are safe?

Michelle O'Neill (Sinn Féin, Mid Ulster)

We are acutely aware of the significant impact that the storm is having on all households, particularly people who are still to be connected. I have set out for the House everything that is being done, not least the fact that the multi-agency approach continues, we are very much moving into recovery mode, we are prioritising those who are more vulnerable and we are doing everything that we can to ensure that people are connected as quickly as possible. We are leaving no stone unturned in seeking additional support, whether that be in the form of engineers, helicopters — we have secured the use of four to help NIE with its work — or batteries. We are doing absolutely everything that we can to get in every single resource that we can. The Executive's shared objective has been to get people connected. The Executive met again this morning and got a read-out from every Department and Minister on their area of responsibility. This is very much a joined-up and collective effort, and every single Department is doing its best to assist people. We all want to get to the same point, folks, and we all have the same objective, which is to get people reconnected and back to their normal lives.

Colin McGrath (Social Democratic and Labour Party, South Down)

I echo the thanks expressed to front-line staff and NIE. However, I would like to add that, in the early hours of the storm, an army of domiciliary care workers went out in that weather to try to help vulnerable people. They did not shirk from their responsibility. They should also be acknowledged and thanked.

In the health service, will those who had to give up appointments on Friday, because hospital services were withdrawn, be prioritised so that they can get their appointments as soon as possible? For some of them, that will be a worrying wait.

Emma Little-Pengelly (DUP, Lagan Valley)

I thank the Member for his question. It is an important one, because many of those people will have waited for some considerable time — too long. We know that it is too long, and we have tackling waiting lists as a priority in the draft Programme for Government. You can only imagine how disappointing it is for somebody who has waited for months, possibly even years, only to have their appointment cancelled. I can give you only the information that we are advised about, because this is, rightly, a matter for the Department of Health and the relevant Minister. However, we are advised that hospitals have been working hard to reschedule those appointments by using every available appointment. You can understand that it may not be this week, but they are endeavouring to get people rebooked appointments as soon as possible. It is not the case that they go to the end of the list. Hospitals have been working away and contacting people. For anybody who has had an appointment cancelled and not heard about being rebooked, please let your local MLA or the system know, and we will get on to that. However, the trusts have advised us that they have been reaching out over the past few days and rescheduling those appointments.

Edwin Poots (DUP, Belfast South)

I do not think that any other Members wish to ask a question, so I thank the First Minister and deputy First Minister for their contribution. We will move on to the next item of business in the Order Paper. I ask Members to take their ease while we change the Chair.

(Mr Deputy Speaker [Dr Aiken] in the Chair)

Private Members' Business

Sian Mulholland (Alliance, North Antrim)

I beg to move:

That this Assembly expresses grave alarm that the number of emergency food parcels distributed by Trussell food banks to children in Northern Ireland increased by 90% during the past five years; is further alarmed that the proportion of emergency food parcels provided to children is higher in Northern Ireland than any other part of the UK; is concerned by the recent report on child poverty from the Public Accounts Committee, which found that delivery of the child poverty strategy has been characterised by failure; recognises that an adequate standard of living is essential for children’s physical, social and developmental needs; calls on the Minister for Communities to urgently publish the new anti-poverty strategy; and further calls on the Minister to work with the Department for Work and Pensions to create a progressive social security system that better supports families with children.

Steve Aiken (UUP, South Antrim)

The Business Committee has agreed to allow up to one hour and 30 minutes for the debate. The proposer of the motion will have 10 minutes in which to propose and 10 minutes in which to make a winding-up speech. An amendment has been selected and is published on the Marshalled List, so the Business Committee has agreed that 15 minutes will be added to the total time for the debate.

Members may be aware that proceedings have been issued in the High Court on the failure to publish an anti-poverty strategy. The matter is therefore now sub judice. Members should take care to respect the distinct roles of the courts and the Assembly when commenting on the active legal proceedings.

Sian Mulholland (Alliance, North Antrim)

I rise not out of duty but out of a profound sense of sadness and quite a lot of anger that, in 2025, children in Northern Ireland still rely on food banks to survive; that 62,000 children face hunger in Northern Ireland; that the number of emergency food parcels distributed to children has increased by 90% in the past five years; and that we continue to accept that as inevitable, with child poverty still not being treated as an outright priority by today's Department for Communities or any previous one.

What frightens me more is that individuals mask their poverty, making the true scale of need almost impossible to measure. Those people remain on the periphery, ashamed to seek help, and fall deeper into poverty as a result. Last week, I had the privilege — I use that word cautiously — to visit the food bank in Ballycastle. The work that Ashley and her team do there is nothing short of heroic — saving lives; providing warmth and sustenance; signposting people to vital services — and is done without fanfare and often without the resources that they so desperately need and risking people avoiding them in the street lest anyone, God forbid, would know that they avail themselves of the food bank's services. The food bank in Lisburn has distributed 461 tons of food, which equates to almost 1·1 million meals. It has fed one in six children in Lisburn and supported one in 10 single-parent families since its opening in 2013. Foyle Foodbank has seen a 161% increase in demand, with 9,000 people, including 4,000 children, having been given household essentials in the past year.

Let me be clear: it is shameful that those places even need to exist in our society. I walked in there not happy, smiling and delighted to see everybody but with a profound and conflicted sense of shame and anger that the political system of which I am part has allowed that to happen. We in the Chamber should not offer congratulations to food banks on their existence. We need to offer solutions to end their necessity. As someone at our round-table discussion this morning told me, food banks used to be an emergency lifeline but are now part of everyday life.

The people of Ballycastle and from communities across Northern Ireland are asking not for handouts but for dignity, stability and fairness. They are asking for change, and it is our duty to provide it. Why is a child in Ballycastle more likely to visit a food bank than a child who lives in Scotland, just 12 miles away across the North Channel? Is it because parents in Ballycastle work less hard or care less about their children? Of course not. It is because Scotland's leaders made a political choice to tackle child poverty head-on. The Child Poverty (Scotland) Act 2017 introduced legally binding targets to reduce child poverty. Policies such as the Scottish child payment and universal free school meals directly lift children out of poverty. Those were not just policies but commitments backed by funding and measurable outcomes. In Northern Ireland, we have made the opposite choice: to delay, to deflect and to deny the scale of the crisis. Scotland's child payment alone has reduced child poverty by five percentage points.

The comparison with Scotland demonstrates that political will backed by ambitious targets can make a tangible difference. Since 2006, when the anti-poverty strategy was first promised, we seem to have done nothing but tumble down a road of delay. In Northern Ireland, there are children relying on food banks who were not even born when the commitment was made for the first anti-poverty strategy. The Public Accounts Committee (PAC) report could not have been clearer when it stated that the child poverty strategy that we had from 2016 to 2022 was characterised by failure: a failure to monitor outcomes, to ring-fence funding, to prioritise prevention and to utilise the Children's Services Co-Operation Act (Northern Ireland) 2015. It was a failure to deliver.

When we took action through temporary cost-of-living payments, such as the £301 payment in spring 2023, food bank usage temporarily fell by 17%, but demand rebounded within weeks. That highlights the inadequacy of short-term fixes in addressing long-term issues.

Whilst I welcome the extension of the welfare mitigations to March 2028, those measures alone are insufficient to protect vulnerable families. The full impact of the two-child limit is yet to unfold, as it impacts only on children born after 2017. If our policies fail to adapt, the benefits of welfare mitigation will erode well before 2028. Implementing the recommendations of Les Allamby's independent review on welfare mitigations is not optional; it is essential to strengthening protections and preventing further poverty. The cost of long-term inaction is staggering. Beyond the devastating impact on children and families, it costs the Executive up to £1 billion annually. That is an unsustainable financial burden in today's economic climate, particularly when effective preventative measures could dramatically reduce those costs over time.

The root causes of food poverty cannot be ignored. Inadequate social security policies, such as the aforementioned two-child limit, disproportionately affect larger families and drive thousands into poverty. The five-week wait forces people to go to illegal moneylenders. During our round-table, I heard from one organisation about a young mother who had her windows put in last week because she could not afford to pay the interest on a loan that she had received from a paramilitary lender. She is the second mother that that organisation has dealt with in recent months. Cuts and freezes to social security since 2010, low wages, insecure work, a lack of social housing and inadequate childcare provision all further trap families in a cycle of poverty. We know that this is not an easy problem to fix, but the solutions are there.

Low wages and insecure work also exacerbate food poverty. One in four food bank users in Northern Ireland come from working households, and, while it is easy to have the view, "People just need to get a job; they are just on benefits, using food banks", the reality is that paid work is no longer a guaranteed route out of poverty. This morning, Rebecca told me that the more she worked, the worse off she was. Another cause of poverty is political instability and the ability of parties to collapse the very institutions that should be working to protect our most vulnerable. We have to reform our institutions to ensure that they remain functional and continue to deliver.

As I said, this morning I met parents who are food bank users and representatives of organisations that have been delivering on the ground. I want to hold space in the Chamber for their words, because it is our duty not just to parrot statistics and high-level policy positions but to amplify the voices of those who rely on the House to represent their needs. Comments included that we need to change the conversation; have a rights-based, child-centred approach; and address the right to have food and the right not to be hungry. One person said:

"Gas is a luxury. 'Eating or heating' isn't a sound bite; it's my reality. My reality is that I went without food so my kids could eat. The impact can't be hidden from my children. They don't want to have their own children, in case they have to live in poverty like they did".

Another said:

"My daughter now has OCD and other mental health issues in terms of spending money or having money".

Another said:

"I have to explain to a four-year-old that mummy just doesn't have the money for what she wants".

Another said:

"The more I worked, the worse off I was".

Another said:

"It's not just about the financial poverty; it's about the courage I have to have to have to even walk in and ask for help".

Those who work in some of the organisations say that there is only so much that they can do. They say, "The poor keep getting poorer", "The system is broken", "Universal credit isn't working" and:

"Minimum wage isn't the living wage".

They also say:

"Food banks used to be that emergency lifeline and now they're part of everyday life".

And:

"This is more than just about food; it is about every single element of my daily life".

It goes on.

We are at a tipping point. Without immediate action, children in Northern Ireland will continue to suffer: some may even lose their lives as a result of our collective failures. It is not governance; it is negligence. We must all act with urgency and purpose to tackle child poverty. That begins with publishing and implementing a robust anti-poverty strategy, which we are due. That strategy will have to have measurable targets and ring-fenced funding, otherwise it will be simply another strategy. We have to lobby Westminster to reform the welfare system by removing the two-child limit and introducing an essentials guarantee for universal credit to ensure that it meets even the most basic living costs. Affordable childcare must be delivered so that parents can access secure and well-paid jobs. We need to tackle in-work poverty by raising wages and improving job security. Political reform is equally necessary to ensure that our institutions function effectively and deliver services. By fully implementing Les Allamby's recommendations on welfare mitigations, collaborating with community organisations and setting ambitious, legally binding targets like those in Scotland, we can begin to create a society in which every child has a fair chance to live.

I conclude where I began. Ashley at Ballycastle Foodbank shared with me a simple but profound reflection:

"Our users want empathy, not sympathy, and structural solutions that provide a hand up, not a handout."

Empathy, solutions and a hand up are the three pillars on which we must rebuild our approach to tackling child poverty to ensure that children and families can break free from the cycle of hardship.

Steve Aiken (UUP, South Antrim)

Thank you, Sian. I call Brian Kingston to move the amendment.

Brian Kingston (DUP, Belfast North)

I beg to move the following amendment:

Leave out all after "developmental needs;" and insert: "welcomes the commitment of the Minister for Communities to delivering a new anti-poverty strategy; calls on the Minister to urgently bring that draft strategy to the Executive for consideration, with view to launching a public consultation on the proposals; and further calls on the Minister to work with the Department for Work and Pensions to create a progressive social security system that better supports families with children"

Steve Aiken (UUP, South Antrim)

Thank you. You have 10 minutes to propose the amendment and five minutes to make a winding-up speech. All other members who speak will have five minutes. Over to you, Brian.

Brian Kingston (DUP, Belfast North)

Thank you, Mr Deputy Speaker. I thank the Alliance Party for tabling the motion on this important matter, and I hope that the Assembly will accept our amendment, which captures current progress on the updated anti-poverty strategy.

The Democratic Unionist Party continues to stand by families across Northern Ireland, many of whom are feeling the financial squeeze, with soaring costs for basic goods such as food and utilities. That is evidenced by the stark statistics provided by the Trussell Trust. There has been a 143% increase in emergency parcels distributed over the past five years. In 2023-24, almost 61,000 parcels were distributed for children. Those of us who interact with the public in our constituency offices see all too often, sadly, the daily struggles that people face. In many cases, that need for support is being met by community, voluntary and faith-based groups, which do amazing work in our communities.

Childcare is one example of a financial burden for working families. The DUP designed a subsidy scheme and slashed childcare bills by 15%, saving working parents up to £160 per month. That is DUP delivery. In under four months, £4 million has been issued in support of families with young children.

We have seen the successful roll-out of the social supermarket scheme. That was co-designed with councils to assist those facing food poverty. The social supermarket provides wrap-around services to help address the underlying issues contributing to a household's financial position. The models evolve and develop in recognition of level of need and the geographic area.

DUP elected representatives got involved in politics because they care about this place. We care about its people, and we want to see Northern Ireland thriving. We have a strong record of delivery for working people, and we are committed to ensuring that each child gets the best start in life. Since taking up the role of Minister for Communities, Gordon Lyons and his officials have been working with other Departments to learn from the actions and the failings of previous leadership in this area.

The Public Accounts Committee report on child poverty in Northern Ireland reported that the delivery of the last child poverty strategy was characterised by failure. The report found that there was a failure to take ownership, to implement effective monitoring arrangements and to engage with children and the community and voluntary sector and that the strategy failed to turn the curve and reduce child poverty.

The DUP is ready to lead a step change in approach. Tackling poverty, including child poverty, is a cross-cutting issue and, therefore, an Executive-wide responsibility. However, that should be a catalyst for good and for real change, not for paralysis and inaction, as has often been the case.

We all know the importance of getting a new anti-poverty strategy right. The challenge that poverty presents to households across Northern Ireland is huge. There is a heavy burden on many hard-working people who are struggling to make ends meet. Almost one in four children now lives in relative poverty. Around 9% of children in Northern Ireland live in low-income households that cannot afford basic goods and essential activities. There is a clear challenge ahead. The economic uncertainty coming from the Labour Budget is unsettling for many, especially those on lower incomes, with fear of job losses to come due to the impact of National Insurance changes on business.

There are many aspects to poverty, including housing, health and education. It is really important to help people to get into work. That is one of the greatest barriers that people face to getting out of poverty. The Labour Party's policies will not help to grow the economy or alleviate poverty. The Communities Minister has been working alongside a range of stakeholders, experts and service providers on the development of an overarching anti-poverty strategy to address the risks and impacts of poverty, including child poverty. Given the criticism that:

"the Department appeared to be too far removed from children and families experiencing poverty",

it is vital that the new strategy go out for public consultation and people have their say. That is the purpose of our amendment. A strategy could be quickly developed and published, but what would the outcome be, if we did not take the time to learn from the past? How would that serve the people whom we are here to represent? The report laid bare the fact that we must focus on tangible delivery. We, as an Assembly, cannot have strategies and schemes that are simply words on a page; real progress must be made.

I commend the amendment to the Assembly.

Colm Gildernew (Sinn Féin, Fermanagh and South Tyrone)

I start by thanking Sian and the other Members who tabled today's motion. It is hard to imagine that, in 2025, there are still people without enough food to eat, but, unfortunately, that is the reality for so many families in our society. Food insecurity is defined as a lack of:

"regular access to enough safe and nutritious food for normal growth and development and an active and healthy life."

When a parent lacks the resources to obtain enough food for themselves and their family, they often face choices that no parent should be forced to make, such as choosing to skip a meal or reduce portion sizes so that others might have enough to eat. Research carried out by Trussell found that, over a 12-month period, one in six adults in the North had experienced some form of food insecurity, which is the highest level in recent times. Consequently, we have seen a huge rise in the number of people availing themselves of food banks, with a 143% increase in food bank usage over the past five years, including a 90% increase for children. I encourage the Minister to engage actively with Trussell, Barnardo's, the Cliff Edge Coalition and all of the groups that are so aware of the difficulties and, indeed, the solutions.

While food banks are an important safety net in ensuring that people have enough to eat, their existence points to a failure of the economic and social security systems here to meet people's basic needs. It is our job as legislators to understand why so many people rely on food banks and to fix the problems at their root cause, which is poverty. The poverty and income inequality report published in March last year showed that roughly 18% of people in the North were living in relative poverty, which was up from 16% in the previous year. The figures pertaining to child poverty are even more concerning, with 24% of children living in relative poverty, which is up from 18% in the previous year. The COVID pandemic, together with the cost-of-living crisis, has had a major impact on the levels of poverty and deprivation in our society. The inflationary price increases on essential items such as food, fuel and electricity and other items such as car and home insurance, which have been driven partly by British Government policies, have pushed record numbers of people into financial hardship.

The Good Friday Agreement gave a commitment that the Executive would produce an anti-poverty strategy to tackle the growing prevalence of poverty in our society. Unfortunately, 26 years on, we still wait for that strategy, and it is clear that the need has never been greater. While I welcome the work that has been done to date, there must be no further delay in the publication of that strategy. I once again call on the Minister for Communities to urgently publish the anti-poverty strategy.

As a member of the Public Accounts Committee, I participated in the recent inquiry into child poverty, the findings of which were extremely stark.

Child poverty levels remain stubbornly high, with previous strategies failing to make any meaningful impact. Children living in poverty are more likely to have poorer outcomes in later life when it comes to physical and mental health, educational attainment and economic opportunities. Tory austerity, particularly policies such as the two-child limit, must shoulder much of the blame for where we are today with child poverty.

The anti-poverty strategy must be accompanied by a comprehensive and fully costed implementation plan with clear targets and outcomes to reduce poverty across our society, particularly among children. It must focus on fixing the root causes of poverty, including low income, educational attainment, disability, gender, ethnicity and addiction. Finally, it must also contain achievable targets and outcomes that are quantitative, qualitative and time-bound to properly measure performance and demonstrate and track the impact of strategic actions.

I am happy to support the motion, and I look forward to the debate in the House today.

Andy Allen (UUP, Belfast East)

I, too, thank the proposers for tabling this important motion. Today, we are confronted with the grim reality that, over the past five years, the number of emergency food parcels distributed by Trussell Trust food banks to children in Northern Ireland has risen by 90%. That is a staggering and shameful figure. Worse still, the number of food parcels provided to children here is proportionately higher than that in any other region of the United Kingdom. Those numbers tell us something that we cannot ignore: we need to do more. Child poverty is not just a statistic; it is a daily struggle for families who must choose between heating their home or feeding their children. Some do not even have that choice.

Regularly, my office, like so many others, is approached by individuals and families in desperate need of support for the basic essentials of food, electricity and heating. Far too often, it is the third sector that steps in to provide that critical assistance. I take this opportunity to pay tribute to the wide range of organisations, such as the Trussell Trust, National Energy Action and the Bryson Charitable Group, that work tirelessly, day and night, to support households. Their dedication and compassion is a lifeline for so many in our communities.

Many households are unable to keep their homes warm, especially during the winter months. For children, cold homes mean more than discomfort; they mean higher risk of respiratory illness, poor educational outcomes and emotional stress. Equally, far too many find themselves heating their homes only for the heat to escape through poorly insulated cavity walls, which is another area on which we need to do more. One action to support households and improve energy efficiency could be for the Department for the Economy to supplement the Northern Ireland sustainable energy programme, which I have already raised with the Minister. Meanwhile, the soaring costs of food and essentials have left too many parents having to make impossible choices. That is not a sustainable or acceptable reality.

Short-term relief is crucial, but we must think beyond emergency measures. We need a coordinated, multi-tiered approach to tackle poverty at its roots. The response must be immediate, strategic and long term. There must be three pillars to the approach. It must be short-term focused because families need immediate financial support, as I already highlighted. An enhanced fuel allowance and emergency food grants can provide a lifeline, and, as has already been outlined, those have been provided by so many organisations. In the medium term, as we have already heard, reforming the social security system is essential. We must work with the Department for Work and Pensions to design support that truly meets the needs of families, whether through increased child benefits, free school meals or affordable childcare, with the latter two being within the scope of the Executive. In the long term, addressing poverty requires investment in education, housing and jobs. Economic development must focus on creating opportunities so that families can build secure, sustainable futures.

We can draw inspiration from other nations. In Norway and Sweden, for example, robust child benefit systems and subsidised childcare have drastically reduced child poverty. Canada's child benefit system has lifted hundreds of thousands of children out of poverty with targeted direct financial support. New Zealand's well-being budget prioritises measurable social outcomes, targeting investment to where it will have the greatest impact. Those examples prove that, with the right policies, poverty can be reduced and even eradicated. The amendment acknowledges the commitment of the Minister for Communities to a new anti-poverty strategy. That is a step forward, but we cannot delay. We need the strategy to be brought to the Executive, published and opened for public consultation. While we can learn from worldwide examples, as I have highlighted, we must also implement learning from our own experiences, such as the findings in the recently published Public Accounts Committee 'Report on Child Poverty in Northern Ireland.'

We cannot stand idly by while families suffer. Poverty is not inevitable. It is a challenge that can be overcome with the right policies, the right investment and the right will. We must act swiftly and decisively to ensure that no child in Northern Ireland grows up hungry, cold or without hope. Let us not just discuss poverty. Let us end it.

Mark Durkan (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Foyle)

I am disappointed that we are still here debating the same issue of food insecurity and poverty. In September, Executive parties stood in the Chamber lamenting rising child poverty. Last year, the same parties vowed to tackle holiday hunger and reduce dependency on food banks. What has been done and what has changed? If a Government are to be judged on how they treat their most vulnerable citizens, surely the fact that one in five children lives in relative poverty — rising to one in four in areas of high deprivation — is a damning indictment of their leadership.

Every Member who has spoken has referred to statistical increases in just about every area that we do not want to see them in. Those figures are even more striking in areas of high deprivation and in communities, like my constituency, where families feel the pain of political failure the most. Behind those figures are families — starving and freezing families. How is that being allowed to happen? Poverty is a reality for far too many families and it is exacerbated here because the leadership parties have, in the not-too-distant past, put short-term political popularity over doing what is right for the people whom they purport to represent. As of 2023, 109,000 children were deprived of the basic necessities. To those who have held these institutions to ransom and prevented action for five out of the past eight years, you should be ashamed of the Dickensian conditions that your actions have compounded.

Understanding why child poverty exists here is not a difficult equation. The child poverty strategy ended in 2022 in the midst of a cost-of-living crisis and an economy reeling in a post-pandemic landscape. The strategy was a bit of an empty vessel. It made a lot of noise but did not hold a wild pile of substance. There were no clear targets, no prevention or early intervention and no understanding or appreciation of cross-cutting responsibilities. We have been denied an anti-poverty strategy for two decades. The previous Communities Minister gave assurances that it would be implemented within the previous mandate. I appreciate that we have been told that it is now ready to go. I fear that it might be coming just a bit late in the day, but better late than never. Where is the sense of urgency? The lackadaisical approach to date is an insult.

I know that we are talking about child poverty here today, but when I talk about a lack of urgency, I want to draw attention to the lack of urgency around older people and fuel poverty. It has just been revealed to me today in an answer from the Minister that, to date, not one penny of the much-heralded £100 winter fuel support payment has been paid out. If that does not exemplify a lack of urgency, I do not know what does. The two-child policy, as others have said, is inflicted on tens of thousands of households here, and we will see that bite more acutely as more people move to universal credit. Of claimants here, 42% are either behind on bills and credit payments or find it a constant struggle to keep up. Yet, the Minister has no plans to address the debt-inducing five-week wait for universal credit. The proposer of the motion, quite rightly, identified the role that that is actually playing in driving people towards unscrupulous, illegal and immoral moneylenders. Families are no longer just about managing. Under callous Tory policy, compounded by Executive absence and apathy, they are working on the breadline. It will take a long time and a real commitment to undo that damage. Certainly, the Labour Party has not got off to a good start in doing so.

It is important that, as an Assembly, we look at what we can do here to protect our citizens and at what we can do to influence and improve policy in that other place and how it impacts on our most vulnerable citizens. My party will support the motion and, indeed, the amendment. We will support any initiatives that come from the Minister and the Executive to tackle the rising scourge of poverty across our communities.

Steve Aiken (UUP, South Antrim)

Thank you, Mark.

Ladies and gentlemen, as Question Time begins at 2.00 pm, I suggest that the Assembly take its ease until then. The debate will continue after Question Time, when the next Member to speak will be Ciara Ferguson. Thank you. Take your ease.

The debate stood suspended.

(Mr Speaker in the Chair)

Oral Answers to Questions — Infrastructure

Connie Egan (Alliance, North Down)

1. Ms Egan asked the Minister for Infrastructure when the eastern transport plan (ETP) 2035 will be implemented. (AQO 1407/22-27)

John O'Dowd (Sinn Féin, Upper Bann)

The eastern transport plan is one of eight local transport plans that my Department is developing in parallel with each council's local development plan (LDP) process. The eastern transport plan is the largest of the local plans and covers the five councils of Antrim and Newtownabbey, Ards and North Down, Belfast City, Lisburn and Castlereagh, and Mid and East Antrim. It will set the framework for those councils to make transport policy and investment decisions until 2035 and aims to ensure that the transport network meets the needs of people and businesses living and working in and visiting the eastern transport plan area.

We are facing an uncertain future, and we need to make radical changes that address issues arising from the environmental emergency and other societal problems that are related to our historical over-reliance and dependency on fossil fuels and the private car. The eastern transport plan uses a vision-and-validate approach that will consider the wider societal challenges that we face, generate a vision for the area and identify transport measures that will help us achieve that vision. That approach and vision are very much aligned with the core objective of my Department to promote and create cleaner and greener connections by achieving measurable increases in sustainable travel.

My Department undertook a public engagement exercise to introduce the vision and objectives of the plan to stakeholders and the general public. The level of engagement was high, with over 500 responses and broad agreement from the respondents on the vision and objectives. Owing to the five councils being at different stages in their local development plan, the eastern transport plan will be published in iterations. The Belfast City Council plan is the most advanced, so the first iteration will cover its transport plan. My officials are undertaking a public engagement exercise with key stakeholders on the draft proposals for the Belfast City Council plan.

Visioning has commenced for the remainder of the eastern transport plan area, and transport plans will follow when each of the remaining councils' LDP is sufficiently advanced. My officials are working closely with the councils and stakeholders on the progress of the entire plan.

Connie Egan (Alliance, North Down)

Thank you, Minister. It is welcome to hear that the eastern transport plan aims to move towards more sustainable modes of travel. How is that in line with your Department's launching of a consultation on allowing even more taxis in bus lanes, however?

John O'Dowd (Sinn Féin, Upper Bann)

Taxis form part of the public transport network, and taxi services are the part of that network that allows customers to travel from door to door. We have opened up the transport links in and around Grand Central station in particular, so it is important that we ensure that part of our public transport system is allowed in bus lanes in order to deliver people to the new transport hub, which is Grand Central station.

Cathal Boylan (Sinn Féin, Newry and Armagh)

Minister, what steps is your Department taking to improve active travel?

John O'Dowd (Sinn Féin, Upper Bann)

My Department is undertaking a consultation on the active travel delivery plan. I encourage Members and members of the public to engage with it. A number of public events are taking place, and there is an opportunity for members of the public and elected representatives to respond online. Members know their local area better than anyone. They will therefore know what connections are required in order to ensure that people can use active travel options, whether that means people travelling into their town or village centre or to their local school or their being connected to public transport networks that will allow them to complete longer journeys.

Timothy Gaston (Traditional Unionist Voice, North Antrim)

The Minister has talked about the eastern transport plan. I am concerned that large swathes of land in the Ballymena area that are zoned for new roads will never see those roads be built. Has the Department given any consideration to doing away with the proposals in order to allow the land to be released for local regeneration projects?

John O'Dowd (Sinn Féin, Upper Bann)

It is important that the Department work in tandem with councils on their local development plans so that we recognise councils' plans for development in their area and so that councils know what the Department's plans are through the eastern transport plan. The transport plan, when published, will take into account the plans of councils. There will, obviously, be public consultation, and a final plan will then be published, which will allow councils to release land for further development, if needs be.

Declan McAleer (Sinn Féin, West Tyrone)

2. Mr McAleer asked the Minister for Infrastructure to outline the next stage of the A5 western transport corridor project. (AQO 1408/22-27)

John O'Dowd (Sinn Féin, Upper Bann)

Following Executive agreement on 2 October 2024, I announced my decision to proceed with the length of this vital flagship scheme that runs between the south of Strabane and Ballygawley, which is 55 kilometres of its 85 kilometre total. On 13 November, the Department received a formal legal challenge to my decision. No further challenges have been received at this stage. Work is ongoing with my departmental officials and legal team to prepare evidence to robustly defend the challenge. The court has fixed a timetable for the preparation of the case, which will lead to a substantive hearing on 3 March 2025, with an expected time frame of five days.

On 25 November 2024, the vesting orders became operative, and ownership of the lands necessary for the construction of that length of the road was transferred to my Department. The legal challenge did not affect that transfer of ownership. While there is no defined time frame for the handing down of the court's decision following the hearing in early March, the court has previously indicated the importance of getting the case dealt with as quickly as possible.

Declan McAleer (Sinn Féin, West Tyrone)

I thank the Minister for his response. Minister, will you outline the level of engagement that there is with the road authorities in the South, particularly on the link between the new A5 and the N2 in Monaghan and the N14 in Letterkenny, Donegal?

John O'Dowd (Sinn Féin, Upper Bann)

We have worked very closely with the Department of Transport in Dublin throughout the project and engaged with it on a number of matters. It is vital that we work not only with the Department of Transport but with the relevant councils on how the road networks link up. That work is at an advanced stage, and it is part of the work stream of the North/South Ministerial Council. I am confident that we are fully and properly engaged on the matter, and both jurisdictions, and the relevant bodies within them, are aware of each other's plans.

Daniel McCrossan (Social Democratic and Labour Party, West Tyrone)

I thank the Minister for the update on this all-important project. The Minister and his Department are working to see the road fully developed. We await the court case that is due in March. I attended the initial hearing. Will the Minister tell us what power or influence he has to ensure that his Department objects to any request by the objectors for their costs to be capped because there has been no cap on the cost to the taxpayer when it comes to the cost of the project, which has spiralled beyond all recognition?

John O'Dowd (Sinn Féin, Upper Bann)

I will clarify the matter in writing if I am incorrect, but my understanding is that, under the terms of the court case, there is a cap on the costs because of the nature of the legislation under which the objection has been lodged. It is outside my remit or powers, or indeed my legal team's powers and the powers of the court, to overturn that.

Keith Buchanan (DUP, Mid Ulster)

Farmers and landowners will be put under pressure by the figure that they might receive for compensation. I understand that they are not to be better off, but they will definitely be worse off because they cannot replace the land that has been taken from them. Obviously, the price of land will go up because everybody will try to replace the land that they have lost. What do you say to local landowners?

John O'Dowd (Sinn Féin, Upper Bann)

All local landowners whose land has been vested will have received communications from my Department on how the process will develop from this point onwards. They will be advised to obtain the services of a land agent, who will be suitably qualified to negotiate and engage with the Department on their behalf under their instruction. I assure the Member that my Department is fully open to those discussions and engagement. The ultimate cost or price of the land will be down to Land and Property Services, and there has been significant engagement between the departmental officials and landowners up to this stage. However, I encourage landowners to engage and work through the process, and I will do everything in my power to ensure that everyone is treated fairly.

Edwin Poots (DUP, Belfast South)

Questions 3 and 4 have been withdrawn.

Deborah Erskine (DUP, Fermanagh and South Tyrone)

5. Mrs Erskine asked the Minister for Infrastructure for an update on when details will be provided on the review of the prioritisation of the major roads programme. (AQO 1411/22-27)

John O'Dowd (Sinn Féin, Upper Bann)

According to my notes, question 5 has been withdrawn.

Edwin Poots (DUP, Belfast South)

Mrs Erskine is very much here.

Deborah Erskine (DUP, Fermanagh and South Tyrone)

I know.

[Laughter.]

John O'Dowd (Sinn Féin, Upper Bann)

She is. My apologies. Will the Member give me a clue as to what question 5 asks?

Deborah Erskine (DUP, Fermanagh and South Tyrone)

No problem at all, Minister. The question is:

"To ask the Minister for Infrastructure for an update on when details will be provided on the review of the prioritisation of the major roads programme."

John O'Dowd (Sinn Féin, Upper Bann)

I thank the Member for her assistance in that matter. Cooperation across the Floor is always very helpful.

I hope to be in a position in the next number of short weeks to make a formal announcement to the Assembly on which projects we will move forward. It has taken slightly longer than I hoped, but, when dealing with hundreds of millions of pounds of public funds, I want to make sure that I invest that money in a manner that is as future-proofed as possible and is of benefit to the public purse.

I am also conscious that, in relation to the various transport plans and strategies that have been discussed, including in this Question Time, I am working with information that is as up to date as possible. However, I assure the Member that I hope to be before the Chamber in the next number of weeks making a formal announcement about which major projects will move ahead at this stage.

Deborah Erskine (DUP, Fermanagh and South Tyrone)

I thank the Minister. I record my thanks to DFI staff for their work over the weekend. It seems a bit crass to be talking about the major roads programme when we see the destruction that is across even rural roads in the likes of my constituency.

It may seem strange that I am not advocating just for my constituency today; I want to ask about the York Street interchange and to check whether that will be part of the major roads programme. We talk quite a bit in the Chamber about congestion, and that is one of the measures that could alleviate it. We saw £400 million secured by the DUP confidence-and-supply agreement, and that project is part of New Decade, New Approach. Will that project be included in the prioritisation programme?

John O'Dowd (Sinn Féin, Upper Bann)

I thank the Member for her question. I add my gratitude to all DFI, NI Water and Translink staff, who performed humongous tasks over the weekend and continue to do so today to bring public services back online.

York Street interchange is a central part of my deliberations on major projects and how we move that forward. It is a considerable investment but a necessary one for all the reasons that the Member has pointed out. It could also be a major economic driver for this place, if we can secure the project's future. I assure the Member that it is part of my deliberations, and I am looking at how we deliver it.

Justin McNulty (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Newry and Armagh)

When does the Minister intend to engage his counterparts in the Republic of Ireland, since the formation of the new Government, in his aspirations to encourage more people off roads and onto public transport and with regard to the delivery of the all-island rail review and other cross-border infrastructure projects? When will he align rail fares so that people in the North do not have to pay more for shorter journeys?

John O'Dowd (Sinn Féin, Upper Bann)

I have constantly engaged with representatives of the Dublin Government about the all-island rail review and how we get connectivity across the island. That is ongoing work in my Department and through the North/South Ministerial Council (NSMC) sectoral meetings. I will engage with the new Administration on that basis. I hope that funding, whether through the UK connectivity review or the all-island funding that is offered through the Taoiseach's office, will assist us in delivering real, meaningful change and programmes on that.

I continue to explore how I can provide the funding necessary to ensure that we encourage more people on to public transport and to reduce fares and align them as much as we can across the island. It is worth noting that, in October-November 2024, there were 400,000 more journeys on public transport than in the previous year. We are having success, but we cannot become complacent, and we have to keep driving forward.

Kate Nicholl (Alliance, Belfast South)

6. Ms Nicholl asked the Minister for Infrastructure, further to the Northern Ireland Audit Office (NIAO) report stating that there should be a comprehensive review of how NI Water is funded, to outline the basis on which he considers NI Water’s funding model to be fit for purpose. (AQO 1412/22-27)

John O'Dowd (Sinn Féin, Upper Bann)

I confirm that I have the answer to question 6.

First, I want to clarify that the Audit Office report does not state that there should be a comprehensive review of how NI Water is funded. It is important to note that, in its report on the funding of water infrastructure, the NIAO simply encouraged my Department and NI Water to complete a review of the alternative funding and governance arrangements for NI Water to be led by suitably qualified experts.

As I have previously set out, my Department has already extensively reviewed NI Water's funding model and engaged experts in the Strategic Investment Board (SIB), the Department of Finance and NI Water and the Utility Regulator, who analysed the opportunities for NI Water to raise additional revenue and looked at different governance models. The conclusion was that all of the models examined required a water-charging model. To be clear again, I will not introduce domestic water charges on people and families who are already struggling as a consequence of rising inflation and higher costs of living.

My Department also reviewed alternative water utility company structures, including mutualisation, across these islands for best practice. I know that the Member will be interested in that, given that the Alliance Party has recently published its policy proposals for the funding and form of NI Water and has proposed mutualisation as one such structure. As I have previously advised the Assembly, mutualising NI Water will require the introduction of domestic water charges. However, in the spirit of delivering solutions, I have asked officials to keep alert to additional opportunities for providing additional funding for water and sewerage services within my policy framework and in collaboration with NI Water.

Alongside that, I am working hard in partnership with the Executive on progressing a three-pronged approach to ensure that NI Water remains fit for purpose. Specifically, I am continuing to work with Executive colleagues to try to increase waste water investment; reviewing the policy and legislation around developer contributions; and securing Executive agreement for the water, flooding and sustainable drainage Bill to be introduced to the Assembly.

I will leave it there.

Edwin Poots (DUP, Belfast South)

Thank you, Minister. I think that you are better at answering the questions yourself than using the civil servants' answers, because you finish on time. Nonetheless, I am sure that you will get the rest of it in during your response to Ms Nicholl's supplementary question.

Kate Nicholl (Alliance, Belfast South)

I thank the Minister for his response. In NI Water's 2022-23 annual report, it said that it was being "held hostage" to fluctuations in its funding. Does the Minister agree with that assessment?

John O'Dowd (Sinn Féin, Upper Bann)

I do not agree with the use of the language. There is no certainty for NI Water going out onto the markets either. That has to be said. It has one certainty when it is being funded directly by the Executive: it has, at its back, the Executive — the Government. Going to any institution beyond that brings uncertainty. The markets will gladly, I suspect, take on NI Water, and privatisation will gladly take on NI Water, but look at what is happening in England. Look at the water companies in England that have been privatised. They are in substantial debt but continue to pay out significant bonuses to their directors, executives and shareholders. They are damaging the environment, because the scale of the upgrades that were promised to the infrastructure simply has not been delivered. Therefore, privatisation is not the utopia that some people present it as.

As I have said, mutualisation will lead to domestic water charges: I am not going down that route. Others may support it, and that is fair enough. NI Water has the Executive behind it. We have made significant investment in NI Water — over half a billion pounds this year. I also secured £19 million during the October monitoring round from my Executive colleagues, and we connected an extra 2,300 homes as a result of that investment. Often, when we talk about NI Water, we, understandably, talk in billions and hundreds of millions, but, sometimes, £5 million, £10 million, £15 million or £20 million makes a big difference.

Stephen Dunne (DUP, North Down)

Some 17,000 new homes across 23 of our towns are still being held up due to the waste water restrictions, so the system is clearly not working. What more can be done, particularly in relation to future monitoring rounds, to ensure that we can get back to homebuilding? Does the Minister agree that a sticking plaster approach simply will not cut it?

John O'Dowd (Sinn Féin, Upper Bann)

Even if the Executive were in a position to fully fund NI Water during the current price control period, 2021-27, it would connect only a further 4,500 homes. When it comes to those 19,000 homes or whatever figure is thrown out — I think you referred to 17,000 or 18,000 homes — the reality and the facts are that, if NI Water were to be fully funded to the level that the Utility Regulator recommended, 4,500 additional homes would be connected. NI Water is on record as saying that, during that period, if there were contributions from developers to divert rainwater away from the system, it could connect another 18,000 homes.

Yes, NI Water faces challenges in delivering, but, as I have said many times in the Chamber, let us not send out the message that we are closed for business, because we are not. Developers continue to engage with NI Water, and connections continue with NI Water. As I said when I answered the supplementary, the Executive delivered an additional £19 million to NI Water in October, and 2,300 homes will be connected as a result of that investment. We can all become blinded by figures and the scale of the problem that is coming at us, but that has shown me that we can solve some of those problems with some investment. The long- and medium-term plans that I have in front of me will allow NI Water to continue to deliver on its objectives.

Matthew O'Toole (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Belfast South)

Minister, are you seriously telling us that you think that the funding model is grand? You seem to be saying that it is about finding odds and sods in January monitoring rounds, with tens of millions here and there. Important though that is, that is no model for the long-term funding of our waste water infrastructure. Every serious economic commentator, construction company and outside investor says that our water infrastructure is a crisis that needs to be dealt with. Down the coast, where NI Water pumps millions of tons into Belfast lough, we are famous for our seabirds, but lots of people listening today will associate that kind of intervention with another type of bird: an ostrich sticking its head in the sand. Minister, we need action on NI Water.

John O'Dowd (Sinn Féin, Upper Bann)

There is a difference between a funding model and the amount of funding received. Is the Member telling me that the privatisation of NI Water is now the Opposition's policy?

Matthew O'Toole (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Belfast South)

I did not say that. What is your policy?

John O'Dowd (Sinn Féin, Upper Bann)

My policy is clear.

Matthew O'Toole (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Belfast South)

No, it is not.

John O'Dowd (Sinn Féin, Upper Bann)

Maybe you have not been listening. Under my policy, NI Water will stay under the governance of the Executive. It will not be privatised. It will continue to receive a public subvention, which was almost half a billion pounds this year. I will continue to work with my colleagues. I am doing so successfully, because they are also willing to travel the journey to secure additional funding for NI Water. I am looking at contributions from developers for NI Water. We will then move to one of the most fundamental changes that, I believe, has to happen: working with nature. The sustainable drainage system (SuDS) Bill that will be introduced to the Assembly for Members to debate will set out a governance arrangement for dealing with the millions of gallons of rainwater that we put through waste water treatment works but do not need to treat. We spend tens of millions of pounds treating water that we do not to treat. We should hold that water back and release it more slowly into the system by working with nature. I have a plan; I look forward to hearing the Member's plan.

Emma Sheerin (Sinn Féin, Mid Ulster)

Minister, will you outline the reviews of NI Water's funding model that the Department has carried out?

John O'Dowd (Sinn Féin, Upper Bann)

Several reviews have been carried out over the years. All of them have come to the same conclusions. Anyone standing in my shoes could change the funding model for NI Water. They could bring in privatisation or mutualisation etc. However, all the reviews came to the conclusion that changing the model would require the introduction of domestic water charges. I am clear on this, as are many others in the Chamber: there will be no introduction of domestic water charges. That limits the options. However, as I said to the Member who asked the original question, look at what is happening in England. Those who tell us that privatisation would solve all the problems in the management of waste water infrastructure should look at England. There has been significant damage to the environment, and companies are in serious debt, on the brink of collapse, and may even have to be nationalised again. Billions and billions of pounds of families' and workers' money went into those companies, but those people never saw the benefit of it.

Andy Allen (UUP, Belfast East)

Just last week, the Communities Committee received a briefing from NI Water on the challenges that it faces. The officials from NI Water said that the capital investment required is nearly double that which is forecast. The Minister has repeatedly highlighted and then ruled out mutualisation, for example. Will he point us to the recent information that he has used to assess how mutualisation will lead to water charges?

John O'Dowd (Sinn Féin, Upper Bann)

One of the first debates that I responded to in the Chamber was on a motion that referred to the introduction of mutualisation. At that stage, I set it out clearly that information was available to me that mutualisation would lead to domestic water charges. That was in March or April 2024. To date, no one has provided contradictory information to that. If anyone can come forward with a report, research or information that is different from that, I will happily examine it, as will my officials.

There is no magic or easy solution to this. NI Water faces huge challenges, but name me a public service that does not. My job is to find solutions. I have set out in front of you today three of the pathways that I am following. One of those has already borne fruit: a £19 million investment has delivered over 2,300 connections. I will continue to lobby for more money for NI Water, and my Executive colleagues are on the same page as me. We will continue to look at the other methods as well.

Colin McGrath (Social Democratic and Labour Party, South Down)

7. Mr McGrath asked the Minister for Infrastructure, based on NI Water sampling, whether any contaminated effluent has entered the Quoile river via the adjoining waste water treatment plant in the past five years. (AQO 1413/22-27)

John O'Dowd (Sinn Féin, Upper Bann)

The Member will be aware that I have already responded on the matter through the five questions for written answer that he has tabled in recent weeks about discharge into the Quoile river. NI Water has advised that Downpatrick waste water treatment works currently treats waste water in line with the parameters and limits set in its discharge consent issued by the Environment Agency. The continuous final treated effluent discharge from Downpatrick waste water treatment works into the Quoile river is subject to an operator self-monitoring announced sampling programme agreed with the Environment Agency.

Two types of sample are collected for regulatory compliance assessment, namely, spot samples for assessment of the water order consent compliance; and composite samples for assessment of compliance against the Urban Waste Water Treatment Regulations 2007. Spot samples are collected instantaneously by the sampling contractor, while composite samples are taken by the auto-sampler over a 24-hour period at 15-minute intervals. The treated effluent discharge from Downpatrick waste water treatment works has a sample frequency of 24 times per year, and the sampling parameters are based on the standards in the discharge consent issued by NIEA. NI Water's sampling, including sample collection and analysis, is accredited by the UK Accreditation Service (UKAS). For Downpatrick waste water treatment works, there were no occasions when the number of individual parameters exceeded the number of allowed fails, meaning that the works has been assessed as compliant with the regulatory quality discharge standards for the past five years.

Colin McGrath (Social Democratic and Labour Party, South Down)

I believe that there was a crossover between the submission of questions for oral answer and the responses to the questions for written answer, so I thank the Minister for those.

Is the Minister assured that, in the water management along the Quoile, dredging can play no part in assisting flood alleviation in the area? Many local people, some of whom have used the waterway in excess of 50 years, can pinpoint that the change in water management in the area came when the dredging stopped, yet the Department continually tells us that dredging will do nothing. Will the Minister have a real, deep look at that to see whether dredging could assist in any way?

John O'Dowd (Sinn Féin, Upper Bann)

The Member will be aware that the matter has, understandably, been raised with me a number of times. That has been the case for a number of other watercourses, each of which can tell its own story.

The advice of the engineers in my Department, who have the professional qualifications to advise me on such matters, is that dredging would not assist in the case of the Quoile river and may make matters worse by causing the water to flow faster, perhaps causing significant issues downstream etc.

On the Member's behalf, I will go back to officials and ask whether there is any further update, and I will let him know. At the moment, however, that is the information that I have in front of me.

Edwin Poots (DUP, Belfast South)

We now move to topical questions.

Mark Durkan (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Foyle)

T1. Mr Durkan asked the Minister for Infrastructure, having first placed on record his party's appreciation of and gratitude for the efforts of so many of his Department's staff throughout the storm and since, whether he feels that his Department could have been better prepared had a red warning been in place earlier. (AQT 931/22-27)

John O'Dowd (Sinn Féin, Upper Bann)

My Department had been preparing for the storm since the various weather warnings were issued. It has to be remembered that, even when it was at the amber stage, that is still a quite significant weather event. The difference between amber and red is that red indicates a significant threat to life, and there is a recommendation not to travel. The amber warning is also significant, however, so my Department was preparing on that basis.

At this stage, everybody is aware of why there is a difference between the two jurisdictions in how they measure a weather event. I think that there is some work going on between the met offices to bring in a standard, which would be very helpful and would cause less confusion moving forward. I am satisfied, however, that my Department was preparing for a major and significant weather event even before the warning turned red.

Mark Durkan (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Foyle)

The Minister has anticipated my supplementary question. He mentioned work that may be ongoing between the met offices in the different jurisdictions on this island. Will he undertake to do some more work with his counterparts in the Twenty-six Counties towards the development of an all-island weather warning and response system?

John O'Dowd (Sinn Féin, Upper Bann)

I am happy to do so. The key to it is that we are providing information to the public. It has to be said that, by and large, the public paid heed to the warnings that were delivered before the weather event. There were no deaths or serious injuries as a direct result of the weather event itself, and we all have to be thankful for that. We do not want anyone to be seriously injured or hurt, and the work of the emergency responders was made a lot easier in that regard. I am happy to work with my counterparts in Dublin to ensure that we have a common message coming out.

Cathy Mason (Sinn Féin, South Down)

T2. Mrs Mason asked the Minister for Infrastructure whether he has any plans to increase flood mitigation provision in Newcastle, County Down. (AQT 932/22-27)

John O'Dowd (Sinn Féin, Upper Bann)

I had hoped to meet the contingency group that is established in Newcastle last Thursday, but that meeting had to be rearranged, partly as a result of the incoming storm. We are looking to see how we can continue to support communities and businesses in Newcastle, County Down, to alleviate their flooding concerns. There has been significant investment, and lessons have been learned from that. I understand that there may be a need for NI Water to make some investment in the area and to put in a pumping station to direct water back towards the river. My Department has inspected its network and gullies etc to ensure that the challenge that we face now, which is surface run-off, will not cause flooding problems in future, inasmuch as you can mitigate that threat, given that it depends on the strength of the storm.

Cathy Mason (Sinn Féin, South Down)

I thank the Minister for his answer. The very committed Newcastle community flood defence group that you mentioned has raised the issue of communication between all of the agencies, including the local council. What coordination has taken place between the agencies and the council to ensure that a comprehensive flood emergency response is in place for Newcastle residents?

John O'Dowd (Sinn Féin, Upper Bann)

As has been the experience during the most recent event, there is a strategic contingency group that oversees the preparation for storms and how agencies work together with local communities to mitigate the impact. There are always lessons to be learned, however, and I look forward to rearranging the meeting with the group in Newcastle, just to hear about its real-time experience and determine the lessons that can be learned from that.

The residents' groups and business groups that come together are a vital cog in our defence against upcoming storms.

No matter how well resourced Departments are or how well they have planned, if there are people in the community who are prepared to work with them and take measures, the safety and well-being of the community will increase almost twofold. I therefore look forward to learning the lessons from Newcastle, and I encourage others to follow its path.

Deirdre Hargey (Sinn Féin, Belfast South)

T3. Miss Hargey asked the Minister for Infrastructure for an update on engagements that he has had with Belfast City Council and the Department for Communities on progressing the 'A Bolder Vision for Belfast' plan. (AQT 933/22-27)

John O'Dowd (Sinn Féin, Upper Bann)

The last ministerial meeting on 'A Bolder Vision for Belfast' was in 2022. Since then, my officials have had ongoing engagement and discussions with project officials from Belfast City Council and the Department for Communities. There is an acknowledgement that the eastern transport plan, which I discussed earlier, will play a significant part in detailing and delivering the transport aspects of 'A Bolder Vision'. As a result, it was agreed that the 'A Bolder Vision' strategy would be revised once there was more clarity on the eastern transport plan and the city centre proposals. That work and engagement continues, with Belfast City Council being a key leader in that regard.

Deirdre Hargey (Sinn Féin, Belfast South)

Belfast city centre is surrounded by inner-city working-class communities that have been cut off from the city by defensive planning in the 1960s and 1970s. Does the Minister agree that the plan should start to deal with that severance issue and re-stitch those communities into the city centre?

John O'Dowd (Sinn Féin, Upper Bann)

I do. Roads present barriers and divide communities physically. If there is a busy two-, three- or four-lane road running between communities, that is a physical barrier, even to their development. Such roads can prevent them from getting, for example, local shops or community infrastructure. The transport plan and 'A Bolder Vision for Belfast' have to be about opening up the city by removing those barriers, but it also has to be about making it cleaner and greener. Yes, allow people to use a private vehicle when necessary but also provide space for public transport and active travel, whether that be walking, cycling or wheeling. You can give the city a bolder vision, but it would be a radical vision for the city to allow it to be opened up for its people. Belfast thrived because of its local communities, so it is almost a case of giving the city back to them.

Trevor Clarke (DUP, South Antrim)

T4. Mr Clarke asked the Minister for Infrastructure, although he acknowledges that no one underestimated the mammoth task that some of the Minister's officials had over the weekend to clear roads, to indicate how much local farmers weighed in to support them. (AQT 934/22-27)

John O'Dowd (Sinn Féin, Upper Bann)

It is clear that farming communities once again stepped up to the mark and cleared a lot of debris off roads and removed trees etc, and I welcome that. I appeal, however, to anyone who is proposing to clear fallen trees or debris from roads not to do so if they have any concerns whatever. If cables are down, take it for granted that they are live, and let the professionals deal with them. However, I thank the members of the farming community who have helped out thus far.

Trevor Clarke (DUP, South Antrim)

I hear what you say, Minister, and agree with your remarks about cables. The good old farmers have come out to help again, and what I am trying to find out from you, Minister, is whether there is any indication of whether we are going to retain a list of farmers who can be called on for their support and can be recompensed for the work that they do? If it were not for the farmers, some of the work would take much longer. Those farmers, who are getting hammered from every direction, are doing that work at their own expense. Will you now compile a simple register of farmers to be called on following events such as this or snow or other adverse weather?

John O'Dowd (Sinn Féin, Upper Bann)

After the period of cold weather in early January, I asked a similar question in the Department about whether we could use farmers to grit a number of rural roads. If I am correct, the Department can, through its procurement exercises, hold a list of contractors, and individual farmers could be on that list. It is something that we should explore. The Member is right: if we have people in the community with the equipment, skill set and knowledge to help us out, we should use them as much as we can. I will examine that further with officials in the time ahead.

William Irwin (DUP, Newry and Armagh)

T5. Mr Irwin asked the Minister for Infrastructure, after thanking his colleague for praising farmers for the work that they have done to clear roads after the storm, whether he has any plans to provide more money for rural road repairs, bearing in mind that maintenance of rural roads and potholes is a major issue in his constituency and in many constituencies across the Province. (AQT 935/22-27)

John O'Dowd (Sinn Féin, Upper Bann)

I am working my way through my entire departmental budget, both capital and resource, to see how we can divvy it up. The Member will be aware from hearing about them during Question Time of all the demands that are, understandably, on my Department. I am keen to ensure that our road infrastructure receives an uplift in its investment. It has suffered significantly over the past number of years through difficult budgetary periods. We are not out of that yet, but I have a better budget this year than I had in the previous year or the year before that, so I want to make best use of it.

William Irwin (DUP, Newry and Armagh)

I thank the Minister for his response. Does he accept that money would be better spent on repairing roads than on paying for damage to cars? People come in to my office daily, looking for claim forms.

John O'Dowd (Sinn Féin, Upper Bann)

Without a doubt. Prevention is better than cure. That is one of the reasons why I am keen to ensure that our road infrastructure is properly maintained.

Liz Kimmins (Sinn Féin, Newry and Armagh)

T6. Ms Kimmins asked the Minister for Infrastructure to outline the potential benefits of biennial MOT testing, given that he recently launched a consultation on it. (AQT 936/22-27)

John O'Dowd (Sinn Féin, Upper Bann)

The Member is correct that I have launched a consultation. It is a genuine consultation; I have not come to a fixed position on the matter. I want to hear the views of the public, motorists, garage owners, insurance companies, the PSNI and others on whether we should move to a biennial service. One of the clear advantages relates to the pressures on the Driver and Vehicle Agency (DVA) and how it manages an ever-increasing demand for MOT tests. It could also be a recognition that modern vehicles are better constructed, have more safety features and are, in many ways, more durable than the earlier models that we may have dealt with before MOT tests were changed to include the criteria that the DVA has now. There are a number of advantages, but the consultation is genuine, and I want to hear the views of all before making a final decision.

Liz Kimmins (Sinn Féin, Newry and Armagh)

Go raibh maith agat.

[Translation: Thank you.]

Will the Minister commit to ensuring that road safety will not be negatively impacted on by biennial MOT tests, should they be introduced?

John O'Dowd (Sinn Féin, Upper Bann)

That will be the primary prism through which I look at the matter when I come to make a decision. During the previous mandate, when the then Minister, Minister Mallon, called for evidence on the matter, one of the issues that the PSNI and others raised was ensuring continued road safety. Given the ever-increasing death and injury toll on our roads, I will ensure that safety is the major factor in any decision.

Claire Sugden (Independent, East Londonderry)

T7. Ms Sugden asked the Minister for Infrastructure, after stating that work on a puffin crossing on the Dunhill Road in Coleraine is ongoing and that such investment is always welcome, to acknowledge that better traffic management is needed in that area, given that there are new residential developments there and a number of new big stores in the Riverside Retail Park. (AQT 937/22-27)

John O'Dowd (Sinn Féin, Upper Bann)

I do not know the specifics of the area. The Member has corresponded with me on a number of roads in her area to raise concerns and suggest ideas on how we should manage them. All new developments in an area have to go through the planning process, as the Member will be aware. DFI Roads is a consultee in that regard. As developments increase in that or any other area, DFI Roads will make a consultation response on how best to manage the traffic there. I encourage the local council's planning committee to take on board what DFI Roads says.

Claire Sugden (Independent, East Londonderry)

I am glad that the Minister has mentioned planning permission, because I thought that there would be an opportunity to address the issue through new developments. Sadly, DFI, as a statutory consultee, did not raise the issue. After many years, we are still going through the process. Will the Minister commit to looking at it again?

John O'Dowd (Sinn Féin, Upper Bann)

I am happy to do so.

Stephen Dunne (DUP, North Down)

T9. Mr Dunne asked the Minister for Infrastructure for an update on the Sydenham bypass resurfacing works. (AQT 939/22-27)

John O'Dowd (Sinn Féin, Upper Bann)

Apart from one weekend, when they had to be cancelled due to adverse weather conditions, the works are progressing as planned.

Stephen Dunne (DUP, North Down)

Thank you for that, Minister. I believe that, over the past two weekends, the works have been postponed due to weather conditions. I am keen to find out a more accurate completion date, given the weather conditions.

John O'Dowd (Sinn Féin, Upper Bann)

I will supply the Member with the most up-to-date report on the completion of that. Works can be delayed or cancelled as a result of difficult weather conditions, and last weekend's were particularly difficult. I will keep the Member up to date on the proposed finalisation of that.

Edwin Poots (DUP, Belfast South)

That concludes questions to the Minister for Infrastructure.

Oral Answers to Questions — Health

Peter Martin (DUP, North Down)

1. Mr Martin asked the Minister of Health to outline what consideration he has given to reopening the inpatient ward and the minor injuries unit at Bangor Community Hospital to alleviate pressures in capacity within the South Eastern Health and Social Care Trust (SEHSCT). (AQO 1422/22-27)

Mike Nesbitt (UUP, Strangford)

I thank the Member for his question. Given the logistics involved, no consideration has been given to asking the South Eastern Health and Social Care Trust to reopen the inpatient ward or minor injuries unit at Bangor Community Hospital. I believe that the Member is aware that that service, along with the associated resources, transferred to the Ulster Hospital as early as September 2023, following extensive consultation. As detailed in the consultation report, the stand-alone minor injuries services at Bangor Community Hospital were not sustainable. I believe that there has been a physical reconfiguration of that area in Bangor Community Hospital since then.

The Member will know that, in order to provide a new service, such as a step-down service or an emergency service, we need four things: the building, the equipment, the medicines and the workforce. Of course, the workforce is the most important element. If you do not have the right workforce, it does not matter what buildings, equipment capacity or range of medicines you have. Given the timescales, it was not possible to consider Bangor Community Hospital in the way that the Member has suggested.

Peter Martin (DUP, North Down)

I thank the Minister for that answer. He touched on workforce. GPs are one of the professions on the front line when it comes to dealing with patients before they get to emergency departments (EDs). What is the Minister's plan for increasing the number of GPs being trained in Northern Ireland? What is a possible timescale for achieving that?

Mike Nesbitt (UUP, Strangford)

I thank the Member for that follow-up question. We have been increasing the number over recent years. Would I like to increase it yet further? Yes, of course I would. Would I like to provide a timescale? Yes, I would, but the fact is that the budget does not permit me to start detailing that sort of plan to the Member. As we move into next year, the draft 2025-26 Budget leaves the Department of Health with a funding gap of around £400 million. I remind the Member that I am working hard to deliver the pay parity awards that nurses and doctors deserve. I do not want to sound the irony klaxon just yet, but the challenges of increasing staffing, workforce and resource cannot be met without an appropriate accompanying budget.

Colin McGrath (Social Democratic and Labour Party, South Down)

Does the Minister agree that the full utilisation of facilities such as Bangor Community Hospital and Downe Hospital would help to alleviate pressures that are felt across the South Eastern Trust? Does the Minister agree that more could be done to utilise the Downe Hospital, including its urgent care centre, by extending the hours or the provisions in the hospital? People would be assisted by not having to travel to the Ulster Hospital to get that care, and it would save some of the pressures there.

Mike Nesbitt (UUP, Strangford)

I was recently in Downe Hospital. The urgent care centre was one of the areas that I visited. It is a magnificent development. Indeed, the consultants and nurses in that urgent care centre made the point that, in the past, people who lived in the vicinity of that hospital would have made their way to the Ulster Hospital emergency department to be triaged and would then have been referred back to Downe Hospital. The direction of travel that I want to see, which is now emerging, is having direct referrals, preferably made by GPs who have done a triage assessment, and then being able to contact an urgent care centre directly, bypassing EDs and unnecessary trips to other hospitals.

More broadly, I am absolutely with my predecessor Robin Swann when it comes to maximising the capacity of those hospitals. He said that he needed every square yard — I imagine that he said "yard", because he is not a European and would not have gone for "every square metre". We need every square yard or square metre of all the facilities. It is about how we reconfigure them, and that is why I have gone out to consultation on the idea of having a network of hospitals. We really need to embed that idea in the minds of the population.

Edwin Poots (DUP, Belfast South)

Question 2 has been withdrawn.

Michelle McIlveen (DUP, Strangford)

3. Miss McIlveen asked the Minister of Health for an update on the reform of adult social care. (AQO 1424/22-27)

Mike Nesbitt (UUP, Strangford)

I thank the Member for her question. Following the publication of the consultation report, the social care collaborative forum was established with the intention of working with my Department to implement the proposed reforms. The forum provides the cross-sectoral leadership that will be critical to adult social care reform. While it is expected that full reform of the scale necessary will only be deliverable in the longer term, we are also trying to make progress in a number of key areas. Achievements to date include the establishment of the social care fair work forum, which aims to gather evidence to support additional investment in the sector, and the commitment to make it a real living wage sector, which is a policy that the Member will be aware that I announced earlier this month. I also made available additional funding in the financial year 2024-25 to help stabilise and maintain independent sector provision. The implementation of CareLineLive in three of the health trusts is enabling the better utilisation and deployment of the trusts' home-care services. They do this by creating greater line of sight of home-care capacity on specific schedules and quickly identifying areas where there are capacity issues and where recruitment activity needs to be focused.

The completion of a review of the impact of trusts' early review teams resulted in 2,884 strategic planning and performance group-funded hours per week being recycled into the system between October 2023 and September 2024. It is intended to roll out reviews across all programmes of care in the next financial year.

A new social care workforce strategy was launched on 12 December. Among other things, it sets out how we will attract, grow, retain and develop the skilled staff necessary to deliver high-quality social care. To deliver that stronger, strategic vision, a whole-system approach to design and delivery will be required.

Michelle McIlveen (DUP, Strangford)

I thank the Minister for his response. The overall reform of adult social care is essential to the transformation of the health service. I accept that it will take considerable time. Equally essential is taking measures to ensure the flow of patients in hospitals. What we are seeing currently is unacceptable. I appreciate that the Minister has outlined some of the things that he is doing. Can he give us some confidence that what is happening now will have an immediate consequence?

Mike Nesbitt (UUP, Strangford)

Yes, I can assure the Member that there will be an immediate consequence in what I am calling "blank-sheet planning" for next winter — and, indeed, earlier than that. As she correctly identifies, the issue has been the flow, which can be blocked at any point between a patient arriving in an ambulance at an acute hospital and being fit for discharge at the so-called back door. The Member is also aware that, this year, the biggest problem that has manifested itself in emergency departments is not the emergency department but the community capacity. I am determined to work at that over the course of the coming calendar and financial year. Hopefully, introducing the real living wage should make working in that area much more attractive, certainly more attractive. That is a major step.

With that blank-sheet approach to pressures in our EDs — not just winter pressures, which I now call "additional winter pressures" — I hope that we will look at the consequences and how we improve, going forward.

Liz Kimmins (Sinn Féin, Newry and Armagh)

I really welcome the commitment to the real living wage. It will go some way to tackling the issue. Minister, in relation to that, as you have said yourself, we are aware that social care is key to unlocking some of the significant pressures on our hospitals. I have been speaking to some providers, and there are solutions that can be looked at. Has the Minister looked at potentially ring-fencing funds around rural packages? That would help to tackle some of the real challenges in getting care packages for people living in more rural areas that are harder to reach and are not as attractive for domiciliary care providers, given the huge travel times and difficulties accessing those locations.

Mike Nesbitt (UUP, Strangford)

I thank the Chair of the Committee, who is speaking in her personal capacity as an MLA. Yes, that is an issue but it is one in a range of issues that we have to look at. We have to think outside the box and have that blank-page start and ask, first of all, "What are the issues?", and there are specific, rural issues with healthcare delivery. Absolutely. We then have to ask ourselves, "What are our resources and what is our ability to meet the challenges that we have?"

I am more than happy to work with the Member on an individual basis, and I am more than happy to work with the Committee. I will be working with officials. I am very glad to listen to representatives from the voluntary and community sector, who operate in rural areas, for me to fully understand the issues and to listen to imaginative ideas for how to address them.

Justin McNulty (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Newry and Armagh)

Minister, you mentioned a blank-sheet approach to dealing with adult social care challenges. What would you say to the front-line workers in our care homes who have come to your Department with practical, logical and workable solutions but say that they are not being listened to? Do you agree that many of the issues in social care are caused not by a lack of money but by how money is being spent, and that it is vital to listen to the people who, literally, have their finger on the pulse?

Mike Nesbitt (UUP, Strangford)

I agree with the Member that listening is absolutely important. As Minister of Health, I listen to people, not just those in the Department. I listen to anecdotes, but, more importantly, I like to listen to people who are at — to use an old-fashioned phrase — the coalface. I do that all the time. I was in a care home on Christmas morning, listening to some of the staff talking about the challenges that they have in delivering for their service users. It is really important to listen. It is also important to set a direction of travel. I think that the Member will recognise that I have set a direction of travel, which is to shift left in order to try to take the emphasis off curing people who, in many cases, have become acutely ill and need an acute hospital, and to put the emphasis on community, primary and social care, and on prevention and early intervention. It is about making sure that people do not need to go to an acute hospital, unless that need is absolutely acute.

Paula Bradshaw (Alliance, Belfast South)

Minister, you talked about the fair work forum. I have a constituent who had to take time off work because she picked up a bug in a nursing home. She was not paid for the shifts that she missed. What is being done to improve the terms and conditions of our care assistants and domestic workers etc, who provide vital support in our care homes?

Mike Nesbitt (UUP, Strangford)

I thank the Member for the point. I am not aware of that individual constituent's contractual relationship with her employer. It may well be a private-sector matter, in which case the Department is, probably, limited in the extent to which it can intervene. However, if the Member wants to provide me with the details, I am more than happy to look at the particulars; as Shakespeare said, from the particular comes the general.

John Stewart (UUP, East Antrim)

Recent weeks have, once again, shone a spotlight on the importance of our social care workforce. Therefore, I very much welcome the Minister's recent announcement that he will ensure that the sector becomes a living wage employer. Will he provide an update on what else has been achieved to date to support our social care workforce?

Mike Nesbitt (UUP, Strangford)

I thank the Member. A range of initiatives are under way to help to build and sustain that workforce: the social care workforce strategy, which I have already mentioned and which will be key to addressing recruitment and retention in the sector; the launch of the new level 2 safe and effective care practice certificate; a new care and practice framework, which includes career pathways; and a continuous learning framework. Those will all support the career progression of social care practitioners and should enable them to use their practice experience, knowledge and skills to better support service users. I have mentioned the establishment of the fair work forum to make an evidence-based case for improving pay, terms and conditions. Furthermore, I recently announced my intention to make the sector a real living wage sector. We have also sought to better promote social care as a valuable career choice. We have delivered the Social Care — Making a Difference promotional campaign, which showcases the value and diversity of social care.

Diane Dodds (DUP, Upper Bann)

4. Mrs Dodds asked the Minister of Health what assurances he has sought personally to ensure that lessons have been learned from the new maternity hospital project, prior to signing contracts for the new children's hospital. (AQO 1425/22-27)

Mike Nesbitt (UUP, Strangford)

I thank the Member for her question. I have asked my officials to identify the key lessons from the new maternity hospital project and ensure that they are applied ahead of signing any contract for the new children's hospital on the Royal Victoria site. My officials are working closely with all parties involved in the delivery of the new children's hospital, including the Belfast Health and Social Care Trust, the design team and the contractor. We want them to consider a range of improvements to the management of that construction project, which the Member and I agree is absolutely crucial.

At the minimum, I am looking for the use of a new engineering contract (NEC), which is a new form of construction contract that contains contractual requirements demanding timely decision-making with collaborative, agreed outcomes.

I also want the appointment of a new director of strategic development in the trust to carry out the role of senior responsible owner for the children’s hospital. Much of their workload will be attributable to the project.

The incorporation of learning from the maternity hospital and other learning from recent major schemes in the NHS and, indeed, in Dublin into the design and commissioning arrangements for the children’s project will be essential. That has included the definition of more detailed criteria for the water safety standards. We will also see the engagement of independent subject matter experts for all the critical systems. That includes high-voltage and low-voltage electricity, water, fire, medical gas and ventilation. The introduction of building information management and a contract management software system with common data environment for use by all parties will improve project collaboration and coordination. Finally, the introduction of a new change control protocol for the children’s hospital project should be reassuring.

Diane Dodds (DUP, Upper Bann)

I thank the Minister. I absolutely agree that the new children's hospital is an imperative for us in Northern Ireland. I spent many years of my life in the old children's hospital, and the conditions there have not improved significantly since that time.

In reply to a question for written answer that I submitted to the Minister, which I received just this morning, the Minister stated that consultancy fees for the children's hospital are in the region of £25 million so far. Can he explain what that money was spent on and how we might prevent excessive — if that figure is not excessive — amounts of money from being spent on that element of the build?

Mike Nesbitt (UUP, Strangford)

I thank the Member for her supplementary question, and I acknowledge, of course, the time that she spent in previous years in the maternity hospital. I will not endorse the thought of those fees being excessive, because I think that, to reach that conclusion, we need to break them down and analyse them line by line. I have asked for that to be done, because, like the Member, I find the amount to be surprising, if I may use that phrase. I find it surprisingly high, but they are major works that have gone on over a long time.

I have said in the House previously it is not just the construction of new build in Health and Social Care that should be an issue for the House and for the Executive. You think of things such as the additional costs of Ulster University's development in north Belfast and Casement Park. I have come to the conclusion that we are certainly not top of the class or best in class when it comes to major infrastructure works, and this is part of a bigger problem that needs to be analysed, because those figures, on the face of it, are surprisingly high. It is incumbent on me as the Minister of Health to look at whether it can be fully justified or whether there are areas where there are learnings and where we can say that we should not have run up such a big bill.

Danny Donnelly (Alliance, East Antrim)

The projects are associated with spiralling costs and ever-increasing delivery timelines. What is the Minister doing to ensure that future projects are delivered on budget and on time?

Mike Nesbitt (UUP, Strangford)

I thank the Member for his question, and I agree with the sentiment of it, although I caveat that by saying that there are things that are beyond our control. The rise in building costs and in building materials has been much higher than anybody — any economist, any politician or any Chancellor of the Exchequer — could have predicted over the past number of years.

That said, we have to think again, because there are so many examples, as I have just said, not just in health provision, where the costs and the timelines are exceeded quite starkly. I think that it was the Audit Office that recommended that we have an Executive-wide body to look at all such major projects. That is the right way to go, and I had written to the First Minister and deputy First Minister in those terms. It is an issue that, to my mind, is unresolved. I do not know whether that will be the outcome or whether a better outcome is being proposed by colleagues in the Executive or elsewhere. How can anybody who has listened to the history of those major projects over recent years have any confidence that the next project will not run over in time and cost?

Andy Allen (UUP, Belfast East)

5. Mr Allen asked the Minister of Health for an update on progress to implement the changes needed to enable individuals in receipt of universal credit (UC) to be passported for assistance with health costs. (AQO 1426/22-27)

Mike Nesbitt (UUP, Strangford)

I thank the Member. I assure him that work on the proposed changes to the legislation is a key focus for my Department and that I am committed to ensuring that the work is completed without undue delay. The Member may well come back to me and say that there has already been undue delay. He can make that argument, which I am more than happy to listen to. However, in defence of the Department, it is a complex area. It is not the case that, in GB, all universal credit recipients are automatically eligible for help with health costs. That needs to be looked at and is part of the delay.

I am pleased to tell the Member that I am announcing that the public consultation on the proposed eligibility criteria for passporting UC recipients has launched today. The consultation will run for six weeks, with the associated legislative process commencing thereafter. It is intended that the legislative process will be completed by this summer. My aim is to ensure that those most in need automatically receive help to access those very important health services.

Andy Allen (UUP, Belfast East)

I thank the Minister for that important update. Will the Minister commit to assessing whether the length of time that it has taken to get to this juncture can be justified? I do not feel that it can. Will he also outline what engagement his Department has had with the Department for Communities on streamlining the application process for those who will not be captured by any legislative change?

Mike Nesbitt (UUP, Strangford)

The Member now brings up three things. First, let us make it happen. To my mind, the most important thing is that we look after those vulnerable people and make sure that they get the help, resources and funding support that they need.

I am taking it in reverse order. Secondly, yes, there has been ongoing consultation between officials from my Department and the Department for Communities. The two Departments work well together. Indeed, what has been happening since last week's storm is evidence of good cooperation, from ministerial level down, between the Minister for Communities and me. I will digress just for a moment: a lot of the vulnerabilities are not with people in hospitals or care homes but with the vulnerable in the community.

The third point was on whether I will investigate whether there has been an undue delay. I assure the Member that I will do that, but let us get the thing fixed first.

Gerry Carroll (People Before Profit Alliance, Belfast West)

Leaving aside the obvious fact that nobody should be forced to pay for healthcare, will the Minister confirm why exemptions do not automatically apply when people sign on for universal credit or other benefits? Why do people have to apply annually through the HC1 form? I fear that too many people are falling through the cracks.

Mike Nesbitt (UUP, Strangford)

I will confirm it in writing to the Member, but I believe that those are regulations coming out of the UK Government and are UK-wide.

Sian Mulholland (Alliance, North Antrim)

I am delighted to hear that the consultation has been launched. The more quickly we can get it sorted, the better. What engagement has the Minister had with DWP about those who are excluded in GB and whether there will be a direct copy and paste here?

Mike Nesbitt (UUP, Strangford)

Yes. Maybe I should have made it clear that my officials are liaising not just with the Department for Communities here but with the Department for Work and Pensions in London. As I said, it is a complex area, and we intend to get the best possible fit for people in Northern Ireland. That involves knowing exactly what DWP is doing, including the restrictions, because, as I said, not everybody automatically passports from universal credit to get this help. We want to get the best of both worlds.

William Irwin (DUP, Newry and Armagh)

6. Mr Irwin asked the Minister of Health to outline the impact of excessive alcohol consumption on visits to accident and emergency facilities over the Christmas and new year period. (AQO 1427/22-27)

Mike Nesbitt (UUP, Strangford)

I thank the Member. I recognise that, like elsewhere in the UK, our Health and Social Care (HSC) system as a whole is under sustained and significant pressure. Too many people wait too long to access urgent and emergency care, which falls short of the service that we all strive to provide.

My Department recognises the risk of possible harm to patients who experience long waiting times in an emergency department. Some patients will present with a range of issues where alcohol may have been a factor — for example, a fracture or head injury due to a fall — or they may present with symptoms of liver disease.

Hospital attendances are coded to reflect the primary reason for a patient attending the emergency department, but that will not necessarily reflect the fact that alcohol was a contributory factor. It is therefore not possible to provide a reliable assessment of the impact of excessive alcohol consumption on visits to emergency facilities over Christmas and the new year.

We know that our EDs faced increased pressures over the festive period. That is why my Department asked the trusts and the Ambulance Service to develop improved plans to maximise capacity and improve flow through our hospitals. That is all part of the winter preparedness arrangements. Trusts also plan to include the development of pathways that provide direct access for ambulance services to services as an alternative to conveyance to emergency departments, which will reduce pressures on those EDs.

If I may be so bold, Mr Speaker, maybe I can ask the Member a question. Does he support me in my drive to get the Executive to agree to introduce minimum unit pricing for alcohol, which has been proven to decrease demand on the NHS in Scotland?

William Irwin (DUP, Newry and Armagh)

I thank the Minister for his response. I do not take alcohol.

A constituent approached me about Craigavon Area Hospital, where he had seen at first hand the issues resulting from excess alcohol and the dangers that it creates for staff. Does the Minister accept that it is an issue that must be dealt with?

Mike Nesbitt (UUP, Strangford)

I thank the Member for his follow-up question. Before I became Minister — in fact, we are talking about maybe three or four years ago — I was made aware that Monday nights are the nights when EDs are under the most pressure. As a constituency MLA, I asked to spend the night observing a night shift in the ED at the Ulster Hospital. I brought up the issue of people coming in after excessive drinking and asked whether it caused problems and created pressure. The nurses said, very clearly, "Absolutely not. We have been dealing with that for decades. It is not a new issue. We are well used to dealing with it". By the way, they said that the big problem was treating mental health patients, because, in the old ED at the Ulster Hospital, there was only one side room for mental health patients, so, when a second one presented, there was nowhere to put that patient.

When I was there, a guy came in a bit after midnight by ambulance. He was drunk. He had a lot of alcohol on board. He was found a chair. At around 2.00 am, the chair was empty. I asked, "Have you dealt with that patient?". I was told, "No, he has disappeared". At around 3.30 am, a second ambulance brought the same patient back. What had happened in the meantime? He had got a taxi home to get a drink. That is what ED staff have to deal with.

John Blair (Alliance, South Antrim)

On the subject of winter preparedness, to which the Minister referred, will health workers and professional bodies, such as the RCN, the BMA and the Royal College of Emergency Medicine (RCEM), be consulted when the Minister starts work on his so-called blank page for winter pressures?

Mike Nesbitt (UUP, Strangford)

I am very happy to confirm that they will be. To be fair to them, departmental officials were very professional in their approach when they started, in March 2024, to plan for this winter. From looking at the plans, however, it is clear to me that some of those organisations were represented directly at the table, some were represented second-hand by a broader organisational group and some were perhaps not even at the table at all.

My view is that we get every stakeholder around the table for the initial meeting, where the page is blank. I have some ideas, but, if I start to say them, I will be filling in the page before they get to have their input. Let us start with a blank page. When we fill it in, a lot of the stuff that we already know is bound to go in there, but let us try to be imaginative, and, above all, let us include everybody from the get-go. That clearly did not happen last time. That is not a criticism of the Department; it is a critique of what happened last time and of how we might improve things next time.

Alan Chambers (UUP, North Down)

8. Mr Chambers asked the Minister of Health for his assessment of the impact of ceasing agency recruitment for social workers. (AQO 1429/22-27)

Mike Nesbitt (UUP, Strangford)

For a number of years, the Department has been working collaboratively with the trusts and other stakeholders in an effort to stabilise the social work workforce. It has been a key focus for my predecessor and for me. In early 2023, over 200 social workers were employed by recruitment agencies. They were delivering Health and Social Care services.

The majority of those agency social workers were located in children's services, which is a sector that was also experiencing high levels of vacancies.

In collaboration with the trusts, the Department decided to end agency usage for HSC social workers by the end of June 2023. Some 160 former recruitment agency social workers were then recruited into HSC posts. I repeat: 160. The five trusts have confirmed to the Department that, between September 2023 and the present day, no recruitment agency social workers have been employed in HSC services. I am pleased to report that, between July and October 2023, 204 newly qualified social workers were appointed to vacant posts, the majority of which were in services relating to children and families. That exercise was repeated in the summer of 2024, and, again, I am glad to report that a further 221 newly qualified social workers have successfully completed their social work training and taken up permanent employment in the trusts.

The net effect of the Department, stakeholders and the HSC trusts working together over the past two years has been the trusts’ complete cessation of agency social worker usage, the direct recruitment of 160 former agency social workers into HSC contracts and the recruitment of almost 430 newly qualified social workers into HSC vacancies.